Obamacare Survives SCOTUS

[NorthDallas40]

I never saw your solution, beyond "leave it alone", which isn't a solution at all. I freely admit that I don't know what the solution is, but can admit that the status quo sucks.

Like I said, it boils down to whether our society wants to protect its people by providing healthcare or if we want to be a society where the haves essentially are complacent with knowing that there are huge swaths of their countrymen that could slip into poverty at the drop of a hat. You seem to reside in the latter.

Sure it is. It’s better than the current state by a damn far sight. It’s not my problem you don’t agree. If you want to change it you work to do so. My change is revert it completely

And like I replied I am not willing to bite off M4A

 

[TheDeeble]

This is pretty subjective though...our diverse population of 375 million people including large swaths of severally mentally ill people, drug addicts, obese people, smokers, gang related shootings, etc. aren't the same as say Norway where rich, healthier white people make up the majority of the population.
it's like saying Tennessee football doesnt match up with Boise State record wise, when our facilities, fan base, budget, support, etc. are 10,000x better, but we struggle because we play 5-8 ranked teams a year vs Boise St which doesn't have to worry about any of that.

Is there any other country in the world where being obese is celebrated as someone being "stunning and brave" for being themselves?

 

[Rickyvol77]

Is there any other country in the world where being obese is celebrated as someone being "stunning and brave" for being themselves?

Sumo culture? Samoan? lol

 

[TheDeeble]

Sumo culture? Samoan? lol

I just mean the general population. I know sumo wrestlers can be big, but that's not millions of japanese people walking around being obese and thinking that's ok healthwise.

 

[Franklin Pierce]

Black Americans are 3.5 TIMES more likely to visit the ER for car crash injuries than white patients, CDC report finds

• The rate is much higher for black Americans with 15 visits for every 1,000 people compared to 4.3 for every 1,000 for white Americans
• Younger adults, those in the South, and those with less comprehensive insurance are also more likely to visit the ER for car crash injuries

Black Americans are much more likely to visit emergency rooms (ERs) than whites for car crash injuries, a new report finds.

Additionally, young adults, those in the South, and those with less comprehensive insurance are also more likely to visit the ER for these injuries.

Black Americans are 3.5 TIMES more likely to visit the ER for car crash injuries than white patients | Daily Mail Online

 

[Sea Ray]

Supposedly more people are paying yet costs have skyrocketed. It’s almost like the government intervention made things worse

LawGator has said many times that more people are paying into it but she hasn't backed it up with any facts or numbers. My guess is a lot more people are getting subsidized healthcare. More people actually paying in, maybe. I'd have to see some numbers , but if premiums didn't go down accordingly then what was the point?

 

[Sea Ray]

Black Americans are 3.5 TIMES more likely to visit the ER for car crash injuries than white patients, CDC report finds

• The rate is much higher for black Americans with 15 visits for every 1,000 people compared to 4.3 for every 1,000 for white Americans
• Younger adults, those in the South, and those with less comprehensive insurance are also more likely to visit the ER for car crash injuries

Black Americans are much more likely to visit emergency rooms (ERs) than whites for car crash injuries, a new report finds.

Additionally, young adults, those in the South, and those with less comprehensive insurance are also more likely to visit the ER for these injuries.

Black Americans are 3.5 TIMES more likely to visit the ER for car crash injuries than white patients | Daily Mail Online

Institutional racism I'm sure

 

[BigOrangeTrain]

The ACA has now outlived the following other endeavors:

• Trump Wine
• Trump Vodka
• Trump Tower Tampa
• Trump Steaks
• Trump University
• Trumpnet Communications Corp.
• GoTrump dot com travel site
• Trump Mortgage
• The Confederacy

Wow. This analogy is ridiculous. Good grief and you want us to believe you are educated??

 

[Sea Ray]

Again, I don't know how many people are paying into health care compared to pre Obamacare since LG has not provided that information but I can tell you that the amount of people getting it for free has skyrocketed:

The latest figures show Medicaid enrollment grew from 71.3 million in February 2020, when the pandemic was beginning in the U.S., to 80.5 million in January, according to a KFF analysis of federal data. (KHN is an editorially independent program of KFF.)

That’s up from about 56 million in 2013, just before many states expanded Medicaid under the Affordable Care Act. And it’s double the 40 million enrolled in 2001.

Medicaid, once considered the ugly duckling compared with the politically powerful and popular Medicare program, now covers nearly 1 in 4 Americans

Pandemic Swells Medicaid Enrollment to 80 Million People, a ‘High-Water Mark’

 

[Vol737]

Again, I don't know how many people are paying into health care compared to pre Obamacare since LG has not provided that information but I can tell you that the amount of people getting it for free has skyrocketed:






Pandemic Swells Medicaid Enrollment to 80 Million People, a ‘High-Water Mark’

Libs need not worry. They’re going to get their coveted socialized medicine. It’s coming. But boy, are the almost 50% that pay no federal income tax gonna be pizzed when they’re paying 40% or better on the new and improved FICA tax to cover it.

 

[Sea Ray]

Libs need not worry. They’re going to get their coveted socialized medicine. It’s coming. But boy, are the almost 50% that pay no federal income tax gonna be pizzed when they’re paying 40% or better on the new and improved FICA tax to cover it.

There's 44 million on Medicare. That means we've already got 144 million on socialized medicine right now

I can't wait till the Medicare for All libs find out that Medicare isn't free. My parents pay $300/mo for a gap coverage. If you opt for a Medicare Advantage plan you're going the Walmart route. It'll likely be an HMO with all the hassles that come with it. You also might not be guaranteed coverage in any place but your home state.

Most Americans are clueless about how all this stuff works

 

[volinbham]

Been saying this for years - a much more efficient model for health care and actually treating insurance like insurance rather than prepaid health care. Too bad a critical component of this type system was made illegal by Obamacare. Worth a read

What Free Market Health Care Would Actually Look Like

"If I were to be able to design the perfect marriage between direct primary care and the coverage that's needed for the what-ifs, the major catastrophes, I would have some high-ceiling, bare-bones policy, much like your homeowners insurance. You need your homeowners insurance if your house burns down. You don't need it to mow the lawn. Let's make the routine stuff affordable, and let's have some safety net for "What if I get cancer? What if I have a heart attack and need a bypass surgery?" That's what the insurance is ideally good for. Unfortunately, Obamacare basically made those plans -illegal."

"We didn't need to wait for Blue Cross to convene a committee to pay for telemedicine services. We didn't need the county facilities to come and certify that the parking lot was a safe place to provide these fee-for-service visits. I didn't need to wait two or three months for Medicare to create a new billing code in order for me to provide technology visits for a patient, and I didn't need to determine whether or not a phone call was the same thing as a video visit, and whether FaceTime was appropriate. I just did it. We did what we had to do in order to provide the care, and that's the flexibility that's built within this model.

For what Medicare pays for a single technology visit, I provide two to three months of unlimited technology visits, unlimited office visits, unlimited home visits, unlimited email visits. So now our model is pandemic-tested. It's proven that it's a superior model because we have the built-in flexibilities to do what we need at the time we need it."

 

[NorthDallas40]

Been saying this for years - a much more efficient model for health care and actually treating insurance like insurance rather than prepaid health care. Too bad a critical component of this type system was made illegal by Obamacare. Worth a read

What Free Market Health Care Would Actually Look Like

"If I were to be able to design the perfect marriage between direct primary care and the coverage that's needed for the what-ifs, the major catastrophes, I would have some high-ceiling, bare-bones policy, much like your homeowners insurance. You need your homeowners insurance if your house burns down. You don't need it to mow the lawn. Let's make the routine stuff affordable, and let's have some safety net for "What if I get cancer? What if I have a heart attack and need a bypass surgery?" That's what the insurance is ideally good for. Unfortunately, Obamacare basically made those plans -illegal."

"We didn't need to wait for Blue Cross to convene a committee to pay for telemedicine services. We didn't need the county facilities to come and certify that the parking lot was a safe place to provide these fee-for-service visits. I didn't need to wait two or three months for Medicare to create a new billing code in order for me to provide technology visits for a patient, and I didn't need to determine whether or not a phone call was the same thing as a video visit, and whether FaceTime was appropriate. I just did it. We did what we had to do in order to provide the care, and that's the flexibility that's built within this model.

For what Medicare pays for a single technology visit, I provide two to three months of unlimited technology visits, unlimited office visits, unlimited home visits, unlimited email visits. So now our model is pandemic-tested. It's proven that it's a superior model because we have the built-in flexibilities to do what we need at the time we need it."

This is the way that it started. Major medical. We were expected to pay for dr office visits. Then I think a driver was insurance got rolled into the employee compensation model which made Benefits competitive that wasn’t a good thing for the healthcare industry (edit: health insurance industry). And continuous government meddling just doomed it from there.

 

[Sea Ray]

Been saying this for years - a much more efficient model for health care and actually treating insurance like insurance rather than prepaid health care. Too bad a critical component of this type system was made illegal by Obamacare. Worth a read

What Free Market Health Care Would Actually Look Like

"If I were to be able to design the perfect marriage between direct primary care and the coverage that's needed for the what-ifs, the major catastrophes, I would have some high-ceiling, bare-bones policy, much like your homeowners insurance. You need your homeowners insurance if your house burns down. You don't need it to mow the lawn. Let's make the routine stuff affordable, and let's have some safety net for "What if I get cancer? What if I have a heart attack and need a bypass surgery?" That's what the insurance is ideally good for. Unfortunately, Obamacare basically made those plans -illegal."

"We didn't need to wait for Blue Cross to convene a committee to pay for telemedicine services. We didn't need the county facilities to come and certify that the parking lot was a safe place to provide these fee-for-service visits. I didn't need to wait two or three months for Medicare to create a new billing code in order for me to provide technology visits for a patient, and I didn't need to determine whether or not a phone call was the same thing as a video visit, and whether FaceTime was appropriate. I just did it. We did what we had to do in order to provide the care, and that's the flexibility that's built within this model.

For what Medicare pays for a single technology visit, I provide two to three months of unlimited technology visits, unlimited office visits, unlimited home visits, unlimited email visits. So now our model is pandemic-tested. It's proven that it's a superior model because we have the built-in flexibilities to do what we need at the time we need it."

Very very few doctors would do what Epiphany is doing. There is something similar called Boutique Practices. They charge about $1000/yr per patient but then they also charge Medicare or whoever for each procedure they do. No way they'd survive on $75/mo

I do agree with the concept that insurance should not cover "oil changes and tune-ups." With a $7500 deductible, my insurance really doesn't cover the little stuff but it's still damn expensive

As for Obamacare and all the crap it requires your plan to pay, I'd advise you to go off the marketplace and get your insurance. Mine is through United Health. It's far better than anything that has to abide by Obama's rules and regs.

 

[lawgator1]

I do agree with the concept that insurance should not cover "oil changes and tune-ups."

Disagree. Ought to cover an annual physical and maybe an additional visit a year for wellness if you have a bad flu.

Saves us all money in the long run.

 

[Pepe_Silvia]

Been saying this for years - a much more efficient model for health care and actually treating insurance like insurance rather than prepaid health care. Too bad a critical component of this type system was made illegal by Obamacare. Worth a read

What Free Market Health Care Would Actually Look Like

"If I were to be able to design the perfect marriage between direct primary care and the coverage that's needed for the what-ifs, the major catastrophes, I would have some high-ceiling, bare-bones policy, much like your homeowners insurance. You need your homeowners insurance if your house burns down. You don't need it to mow the lawn. Let's make the routine stuff affordable, and let's have some safety net for "What if I get cancer? What if I have a heart attack and need a bypass surgery?" That's what the insurance is ideally good for. Unfortunately, Obamacare basically made those plans -illegal."

"We didn't need to wait for Blue Cross to convene a committee to pay for telemedicine services. We didn't need the county facilities to come and certify that the parking lot was a safe place to provide these fee-for-service visits. I didn't need to wait two or three months for Medicare to create a new billing code in order for me to provide technology visits for a patient, and I didn't need to determine whether or not a phone call was the same thing as a video visit, and whether FaceTime was appropriate. I just did it. We did what we had to do in order to provide the care, and that's the flexibility that's built within this model.

For what Medicare pays for a single technology visit, I provide two to three months of unlimited technology visits, unlimited office visits, unlimited home visits, unlimited email visits. So now our model is pandemic-tested. It's proven that it's a superior model because we have the built-in flexibilities to do what we need at the time we need it."

Obamacare was probably designed to fail so that the government would have a reason to come in and "save" healthcare via even more intrusive measures.

 

[Sea Ray]

Disagree. Ought to cover an annual physical and maybe an additional visit a year for wellness if you have a bad flu.

Saves us all money in the long run.

Nah. You can cough up the bucks for that.

Let me give you a direct example of how the system is so screwed up and how we're all paying for it. A few years ago my then teenage daughter went to the doctor for an annual checkup and she got two vaccinations (one was for flu). Our PPO actually paid the doctor $600 for that visit. We were charged $150 just to administer the vaccines. Not the vax itself. That was another charge. But since Obamacare pays 100% for these sorts of visits, no one bats an eye and life goes on. If patients were actually paying at the time of the visit, do you think that pediatrician could get by with charging $600 for a 20-30 min checkup? Hell no

 

[volinbham]

Very very few doctors would do what Epiphany is doing. There is something similar called Boutique Practices. They charge about $1000/yr per patient but then they also charge Medicare or whoever for each procedure they do. No way they'd survive on $75/mo

I do agree with the concept that insurance should not cover "oil changes and tune-ups." With a $7500 deductible, my insurance really doesn't cover the little stuff but it's still damn expensive

As for Obamacare and all the crap it requires your plan to pay, I'd advise you to go off the marketplace and get your insurance. Mine is through United Health. It's far better than anything that has to abide by Obama's rules and regs.

Per the article there are about 1500 practices doing it - I presume many of those are not single facility practices.

Also per the article the way they survive on this rate is the drastically cut the cost of compliance with insurance AND because they contract in bulk with things like lab services they greatly reduce those costs as well.

 

[volinbham]

Disagree. Ought to cover an annual physical and maybe an additional visit a year for wellness if you have a bad flu.

Saves us all money in the long run.

preventative care leads to cost savings. that doesn't mean insurance is the most efficient (save us money in the long run) way to pay for preventative maintenance.

also the same argument could be made for car or home insurance; if it paid for preventative maintenance (regular oil changes or gutter cleaning) it would save money spent on cars/home repair in the long run but no one is suggesting car or home insurance pay for those things.

 

[AshG]

I know I'm an outlier who has experienced something that less than 0.1% of the population has gone through, but the removal of lifetime maximums in the ACA has saved my ability to provide what I can for my family. I'm still paying a significant amount per year because of my ongoing medical issues ($130 a month on prescriptions, just for me, in-office surgery every week on my leftover leg), but at least I have the ability to continue being insured.

The system is absolutely broken and needs to be amended, but you can understand why I fear much of the "scrap it and start over" talk that tends to accompany this line of discussion.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

Damn you’re obtuse. The level of uninsured isn’t significantly changed and the costs for everyone have skyrocketed and many were forced to change their providers. By any measure the ACA is an abject failure.

It was never about health care. That idiot Bob Beckel admitted it one day before they kicked him off The Five that ZeroCare was about wealth redistribution.

 

[AshG]

Pardon the anecdotal information, but there's a significant difference I've noticed between where I've lived up north and where I've lived in the South.

The number of urgent care and walk in care facilities up here - both in suburban Cleveland, OH and rural Western Michigan - far outnumbers the amount of similar facilities in the South. They're everywhere.

About the same density, it seems like, as predatory Payday Loans and Buy Here/Pay Here car lot places in the South.

 

[volinbham]

Pardon the anecdotal information, but there's a significant difference I've noticed between where I've lived up north and where I've lived in the South.

The number of urgent care and walk in care facilities up here - both in suburban Cleveland, OH and rural Western Michigan - far outnumbers the amount of similar facilities in the South. They're everywhere.

About the same density, it seems like, as predatory Payday Loans and Buy Here/Pay Here car lot places in the South.

we are crawling with urgent care facilities in Birmingham - in my 10 minute drive to work I go by at least 2.

EDIT - just did a Google search and there are 17 within 10 miles of my house.

 

[volinbham]

I know I'm an outlier who has experienced something that less than 0.1% of the population has gone through, but the removal of lifetime maximums in the ACA has saved my ability to provide what I can for my family. I'm still paying a significant amount per year because of my ongoing medical issues ($130 a month on prescriptions, just for me, in-office surgery every week on my leftover leg), but at least I have the ability to continue being insured.

The system is absolutely broken and needs to be amended, but you can understand why I fear much of the "scrap it and start over" talk that tends to accompany this line of discussion.

it doesn't have to be scrap it and start over.

the biggest problem with Obamacare I find is the rigidity of it. why not allow alternative models and insurance for the 340 million people in the country rather than mandating all insurance plans conform to certain rules.

 

[Sea Ray]

it doesn't have to be scrap it and start over.

the biggest problem with Obamacare I find is the rigidity of it. why not allow alternative models and insurance for the 340 million people in the country rather than mandating all insurance plans conform to certain rules.

This is exactly what Trump did. He allowed for alternative models and I have one of those plans. Healthmarkets.com has made a business out of this change. Call 'em up and have one of their brokers look up a plan that will work for you. It's free. If you have a serious pre-existing condition then you are likely stuck with an Obamacare plan. That is still an issue. I don't think just because some people lost the health lottery of life that they should be forced to spend $2K/mo while the rest of us are paying $300.

There are still other issues in healthcare right now such as the difficulty in even speaking with a doctor while in the hospital and the rigmarole of hospitalists, PAs, social workers and everything else that's thrown at you. I could give you an earful of my family's experience with a 91 yr old mother admitted last month.