OU DT Charles Walker leaving during season to prepare for NFL Draft

#102
#102
gc49ervol said:
So in your mind they don't have any obligation to their teammates? They should do what's best for themselves without regard for those that have helped him showcase his talents? The concept of team and commitment seem like a difficult concept for some of you.
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And by "some of you," you mean every coach that leaves before the season is over?
 
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#103
#103
NashVol11 said:
And by "some of you," you mean every coach that leaves before the season is over?
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Nash believe me I understand the business side of college football. I'm 50 and played in the 80s so I don't doubt for one minute that my views are antiquated. But in my day you just never quit on your team for any reason and you finish what you start.
 
#104
#104
NashVol11 said:
He thinks he did, and he very well could be right. We certainly don't know anywhere near enough to tell him he's wrong.

And for the 20th time, whether he will drop in the draft is a separate argument. You keep repeating that others would be mad if UT players did the same thing, so I'll repeat that us as fans would have no right - whatsoever - to be mad at a player for doing what's best for himself and his family, given that players owe us fans not a damn thing.
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I have no RIGHT "to be mad "? Since when is an emotion a "right". I'll REPEAT that it's not about players "owing" anybody "a damn thing". It's repercussions for only doing something for yourself in a team game. When they want a paycheck to be part of a TEAM, these personal decisions come into play. Posted a draft guy's recount of his conversations/observations with GMs,coaches and scouts...they're not fans of how he did this. And these are the fans he needs.
 
#105
#105
butchna said:
I have no RIGHT "to be mad "? Since when is an emotion a "right". I'll REPEAT that it's not about players "owing" anybody "a damn thing". It's repercussions for only doing something for yourself in a team game. When they want a paycheck to be part of a TEAM, these personal decisions come into play. Posted a draft guy's recount of his conversations/observations with GMs,coaches and scouts...they're not fans of how he did this. And these are the fans he needs.
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Yes, he might drop a little in the draft because of this. We have been talking about a totally separate issue for the last several posts now. I don't think you are this dense.
 
#106
#106
1. If a Tennessee player leaves early, I'm not going to freak out and get all sanctimonious, because he should do what's best for him rather than what's best for me as a fan.

2. Walker dropping in the draft doesn't mean he made the wrong decision, or that this isn't what is best for him. As apparently difficult as it is to understand, there is more than one factor that goes into decisions like these.
 
#107
#107
NashVol11 said:
Yes, he might drop a little in the draft because of this. We have been talking about a totally separate issue for the last several posts now. I don't think you are this dense.
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You brought up my right to be mad...I've never strayed.
 
#108
#108
NashVol11 said:
1. If a Tennessee player leaves early, I'm not going to freak out and get all sanctimonious, because he should do what's best for him rather than what's best for me as a fan.

2. Walker dropping in the draft doesn't mean he made the wrong decision, or that this isn't what is best for him. As apparently difficult as it is to understand, there is more than one factor that goes into decisions like these.
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Quitting before the end of the season accomplishes nothing. It's not about fans. You just chose to mischaracterize that portion after talking about what my "rights" are. He screwed himself and was completely free to do so...mission accomplished. Prolly win an ESPY.
 
#109
#109
butchna said:
Quitting before the end of the season accomplishes nothing. It's not about fans. You just chose to mischaracterize that portion after talking about what my "rights" are. He screwed himself and was completely free to do so...mission accomplished. Prolly win an ESPY.
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If you're addressing #1, it had absolutely nothing to do with Charles Walker, so I don't know what the hell you are talking about.

If you're addressing #2, you didn't do a very good job, because it remains irrefutable that we have no way to say that he did NOT do what was best for him and his family. Try as you might, it's a losing argument for you.

With the way this conversation has gone, though, my guess is that you're addressing neither point and are just rambling about the draft stock issue that we resolved pages ago.
 
#110
#110
NashVol11 said:
If you're addressing #1, it had absolutely nothing to do with Charles Walker, so I don't know what the hell you are talking about.

If you're addressing #2, you didn't do a very good job, because it remains irrefutable that we have no way to say that he did NOT do what was best for him and his family. Try as you might, it's a losing argument for you.

With the way this conversation has gone, though, my guess is that you're addressing neither point and are just rambling about the draft stock issue that we resolved pages ago.
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You're not in charge. Just because you state "resolved" doesn't make it so. As long as you keep barking your "what's best for the player" mantra, I'll keep swatting you on the nose. You keep thinking that we're arguing, when I'm just stating my opinion of his decision and the negative consequences of such and you keep stressing the nobility. Nothing to argue.
 
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#111
#111
butchna said:
You're not in charge. Just because you state "resolved" doesn't make it so. As long as you keep barking your "what's best for the player" mantra, I'll keep swatting you on the nose. You keep thinking that we're arguing, when I'm just stating my opinion of his decision and the negative consequences of such and you keep stressing the nobility. Nothing to argue.
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Nobility? I'm saying that the decision could be what's best for him EVEN IF he falls in the draft. Your response is "blah blah he'll fall in the draft."
 
#112
#112
NashVol11 said:
Nobility? I'm saying that the decision could be what's best for him EVEN IF he falls in the draft. Your response is "blah blah he'll fall in the draft."
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If it doesn't work out in him being a higher draft pick? It wasn't "for the best". Resume incessant blah blahing.
 
#113
#113
butchna said:
If it doesn't work out in him being a higher draft pick? It wasn't "for the best". Resume incessant blah blahing.
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Lol, so I was right. You can't get your head around draft position being anything other than the one and only factor in his decision. Have fun with that
 
#114
#114
NashVol11 said:
Lol, so I was right. You can't get your head around draft position being anything other than the one and only factor in his decision. Have fun with that
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Having a blast. Vital point from the beginning ...before you went all shiny happy people human rights hippy, was that he left the team..."to prepare for the draft". So his DRAFT POSITION would be extremely relevant. As far as concussion issues and all, leaving the team may reduce his fear of receiving one on the sideline...but how is it part of "to prepare for the draft"? If he left the team and quit football because of those fears, I'd totally understand (who cares right?). You keep making out that I'm off message. You were never on. :)
 
#115
#115
butchna said:
Having a blast. Vital point from the beginning ...before you went all shiny happy people human rights hippy, was that he left the team..."to prepare for the draft". So his DRAFT POSITION would be extremely relevant. As far as concussion issues and all, leaving the team may reduce his fear of receiving one on the sideline...but how is it part of "to prepare for the draft"? If he left the team and quit football because of those fears, I'd totally understand (who cares right?). You keep making out that I'm off message. You were never on. :)
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I can't believe I'm having to explain this, but that doesn't at all mean that he left solely because he thought it would get him drafted higher. It could very well be that he was well aware of the risk of his stock dropping, and there were other factors that outweighed that risk. You implying that those other factors consisted of nothing more than "fear" or "being a quitter" is an uninformed assumption.
 
#116
#116
NashVol11 said:
I can't believe I'm having to explain this, but that doesn't at all mean that he left solely because he thought it would get him drafted higher. It could very well be that he was well aware of the risk of his stock dropping, and there were other factors that outweighed that risk. You implying that those other factors consisted of nothing more than "fear" or "being a quitter" is an uninformed assumption.
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You're assuming a lot. About a lot I could give a crap about. I'm going with what he put out there. Thread was about his leaving the team to "prepare for the draft". That's what I've been discussing. You went off on your own. :)
 
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