Petrino on the UT Game

#201
#201
LotteryPick said:
Dooley lovers have a strong presence in this thread.
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Sure.... this one loved him SO MUCH that soon after he was hired... this one said he should be fired after year three if he had not proven he could beat someone that mattered and compete for the East. This one said he should get a chance to recruit some players and build a roster capable of winning but that he HAD TO BEAT SOMEONE THAT MATTERED in 2012.

And it was THIS ONE that said that I thought he should have been fired immediately after losing to the last team that "mattered" in '12... USCe.
 
#202
#202
sjt18 said:
Go ahead if you have the ba.... err, gumption and tell us how you think this will go. How long should Jones get? What should be the expectation for winning and by when?

I am sure you think smart aleck comments count for thoughtfulnes... but put your money where you mouth is. Give a REAL opinion and defend it.
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You need to chill out...

It ain't that serious. I'm sure you boast at night about all the e-arguments/e-discussions you won during the day but for real, it's not a good look...

:stop:
 
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#203
#203
sjt18 said:
Really? This is what you resort to? We aren't the ones going into histrionics because someone disagreed with us on a chat board... If I someone disagrees with me then I consider their point and either change my view or answer them.

If you are that thin skinned then it is YOU that needs to get over yourself. Its a chat board. People disagree. That's half the fun of it and especially if you DON'T take yourself too serious. And in spite of what you may THINK you know about me... I am not accused by anyone who knows me in person of taking myself too serious.

Instead of continuing to stomp your feet... why not actually make a case?

Lay your actual ideas out there. What do YOU think are reasonable expectations for winning from Jones? How long? How does he get there? How does he survive if he doesn't have early success?
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:eek:lol::eek:lol::eek:lol::eek:lol::eek:lol::eek:lol::eek:lol:
 
#206
#206
sjt18 said:
I have never suggested that UT fire anyone after one season. If Jones goes 5-7 this year... what do you think his record will be after 3 years?
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Can't project that far ahead. Lots of variables. Who will be coaching the other SEC teams in three years? How good will those teams be then? Will butch still be recruiting at a high level? Have we had significant problems with roster attrition?

If everything were static, I'd say Jones would have us around 0.75 in year three. That seems to be the norm at every other stop he's had. Assuming he continues to recruit at the same level as this year, we'll have a 9-10 win regular season roster at that point in his tenure.

You and I aren't that far off in our arguments. You think more of the talent on this roster than I do...that's all. I think this is a 5-6 win roster, regardless of the impacts of coaching. People on this board were bragging about the strength of our schedule last week, and now somehow that, in conjunction with our talent deficiencies, means that Butch is supposed to coach us up to 8 wins or the writing will be on the wall.
 
#207
#207
sjt18 said:
Alot of people keep pointing to this one thing as if it proves something. It was an anomaly.... It is NOT the rule. Generally, great coaches come in and make a positive impact right away. Saban did at LSU. Freeze did at Ole Miss. Spurrier did at both his stops. Sumlin has. Meyer did.

I have pointed out several times that Saban's first team at Bama was similar to Kiffin's year at UT. He broke alot of eggs because the discipline problems were so bad. He cut some guys loose who weren't contributing.

Jones really doesn't have to establish discipline. He doesn't have off the field problems to speak of. By his own confession, the team and especially the upper classmen have bought into his program.

This team has very little in common with Saban's first team at Bama except that both had thin spots and had to depend on some youth.

No. It is actually a good bit closer. But again, you don't pick out an exceptional data point and use it to make a general rule.

Nice try. But I don't think so.

But weren't you among those who did just that with Dooley after the UK loss? Maybe I have you confused but I thought you were in that mob. To that point, UK was the only team Dooley had lost to that didn't have more talent than he did. He obviously went on to lose to a bunch last year that didn't have as much talent... but you now say one game should not be enough to draw conclusions.

I would never draw a conclusion on a single game. I am not even saying I would draw an ironclad conclusion based on a single season. However this team has the talent to win 7 games. It simply does if he is able to outcoach someone. He gets six chances to do that... and should be able to do it once. If he can't... then that is at least an indicator against him being able to do it in the future. Not only that, it suggests he could perform even worse next year when the roster gets worse before perhaps starting to get better in '15. That leaves him squarely on a hot seat in '15.

Me neither. I think he wins this game and I think he wins 7 games. I think the buzz around one of these weekends will be about how Jones outcoached one of the "elite" coaches.

And THAT to me is what will point toward him being the right guy for UT.
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You wanted to talk about facts, I point out that Saban lost to an inferior team and now that fact isn't viable, its an "anomaly". I like your style, there's no way you can ever lose an argument if you get to pick and choose which facts you want consider legitimate. Very nice!
 
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#208
#208
MannyD said:
Can't project that far ahead. Lots of variables. Who will be coaching the other SEC teams in three years? How good will those teams be then? Will butch still be recruiting at a high level? Have we had significant problems with roster attrition?

If everything were static, I'd say Jones would have us around 0.75 in year three. That seems to be the norm at every other stop he's had. Assuming he continues to recruit at the same level as this year, we'll have a 9-10 win regular season roster at that point in his tenure.

You and I aren't that far off in our arguments. You think more of the talent on this roster than I do...that's all. I think this is a 5-6 win roster, regardless of the impacts of coaching. People on this board were bragging about the strength of our schedule last week, and now somehow that, in conjunction with our talent deficiencies, means that Butch is supposed to coach us up to 8 wins or the writing will be on the wall.
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The simple premise he does not understand.
 
#209
#209
sjt18 said:
Alot of people keep pointing to this one thing as if it proves something. It was an anomaly.... It is NOT the rule. Generally, great coaches come in and make a positive impact right away. Saban did at LSU. Freeze did at Ole Miss. Spurrier did at both his stops. Sumlin has. Meyer did.
.
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You can also look at from the other direction. Butch jones could win the national championship this year but it doesn't absolutely mean he's the right guy for the future of UT. Ask Gene Chizik if you don't believe me. Is that another fact that I can't use?
 
#210
#210
VOLinthaNATI said:
You need to chill out...

It ain't that serious. I'm sure you boast at night about all the e-arguments/e-discussions you won during the day but for real, it's not a good look...

:stop:
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No. This is "fun" for me... not serious. It is actually a break from serious stuff that can be pretty stressful if you don't have a "fun" outlet. If I were going to "boast"... it wouldn't be over something like this. It would be something "real".
 
#211
#211
KingtUT said:
You can also look at from the other direction. Butch jones could win the national championship this year but it doesn't absolutely mean he's the right guy for the future of UT. Ask Gene Chizik if you don't believe me. Is that another fact that I can't use?
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That's another unlikely scenario though it may happen more often than the other. Generally speaking you need a HC with serious skill to win a NC. He had a serious player who basically won the thing by himself.

There have been a few others that succeeded in spite of themselvs... I'd include Miles... but that isn't the "rule".
 
#212
#212
sjt18 said:
No. This is "fun" for me... not serious. It is actually a break from serious stuff that can be pretty stressful if you don't have a "fun" outlet. If I were going to "boast"... it wouldn't be over something like this. It would be something "real".
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It's amazing how many people take this stuff so seriously. It's just fun to talk football with fellow Vol fans even if we all don't agree on everything.
 
#214
#214
sjt18 said:
That's another unlikely scenario though it may happen more often than the other. Generally speaking you need a HC with serious skill to win a NC. He had a serious player who basically won the thing by himself.

There have been a few others that succeeded in spite of themselvs... I'd include Miles... but that isn't the "rule".
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The problem with your argument is that you wanted to talk facts, now you want to talk about "the rules" because facts don't completely support your opinion. Like I said, I like your style. It's good conversation.
 
#215
#215
SteelerVol said:
We pasted AustinPeay for 2 qtrs and the rest of the game was a scrimmage for the back-ups.

We had zero penalties and 1 turnover, plus had the right number of players on the field for every play.

Playing in Neyland stadium versus Kentucky's stadium is like comparing playing in Thomson Bowling versus an asphalt court with a chain net.

2 to 1 better talent.

Our 1st team versus WK's 1st team for 4 qtrs?

Quit with the Dooley comparisons and bet the house on Tennessee giving up the 14 points.
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The WKU-Kentucky game was in Nashville with like half WKU fans I believe.
 
#216
#216
KingtUT said:
It's amazing how many people take this stuff so seriously. It's just fun to talk football with fellow Vol fans even if we all don't agree on everything.
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Honestly... I kind of like to argue anyway. I'd much rather go at it with someone like you who backs their points up with thought out points.
 
#218
#218
sjt18 said:
Honestly... I kind of like to argue anyway. I'd much rather go at it with someone like you who backs their points up with thought out points.
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Looked at the schedule again and I see your 7 wins. I've said six wins would be acceptable but regretfully that's admitting that Franklin is a good HC and he's had more time to impact his program than Jones has had here. So, I agree that we can win 7 games. If we do it will mean that his team performed completely up to its potential. 8 wins and he's COY. 6 wins means he didn't get the maximum out of this team but still didn't drop the ball completely.
 
#219
#219
KingtUT said:
The problem with your argument is that you wanted to talk facts, now you want to talk about "the rules" because facts don't completely support your opinion. Like I said, I like your style. It's good conversation.
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Now don't start parsing on me now.:)

By rule, you know I mean the general way things go.

Usually, good coaches that take over programs without severe internal problems make an immediate impact for the better.
 
#220
#220
KingtUT said:
Looked at the schedule again and I see your 7 wins. I've said six wins would be acceptable but regretfully that's admitting that Franklin is a good HC and he's had more time to impact his program than Jones has had here. So, I agree that we can win 7 games. If we do it will mean that his team performed completely up to its potential. 8 wins and he's COY. 6 wins means he didn't get the maximum out of this team but still didn't drop the ball completely.
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That's what I think. I actually counted Vandy a win and Auburn and USCe as the most likely "maybe's".

The one guy I think gets really embarrassed by Jones is Franklin.
 
#221
#221
sjt18 said:
That's what I think. I actually counted Vandy a win and Auburn and USCe as the most likely "maybe's".

The one guy I think gets really embarrassed by Jones is Franklin.
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The most important thing for bUTch to do is re-establish the pecking order in the East; starting with Kentucky and Vanderbilt, and get Missouri used to getting BIG ORANGE spanked on a regular basis as well. Win those 3 games convincingly and get us some Auburn Tiger and it will be a very good season. :loco:
 
#222
#222
1974Vol said:
The most important thing for bUTch to do is re-establish the pecking order in the East; starting with Kentucky and Vanderbilt, and get Missouri used to getting BIG ORANGE spanked on a regular basis as well. Win those 3 games convincingly and get us some Auburn Tiger and it will be a very good season. :loco:
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Sounds good to me if that's the way it goes...

I've just been hung up on USCe though. They just seem like a more likely win than Auburn to me. I look at their roster and I see Clowney and a very, very good DL. Then I remember that UT that should match up pretty well. Then you look at their LB's and see new guys who do not appear to be as good as the old guys. You look at the secondary which doesn't appear to be much more if any more settled than UT's.

Their O, like UT's, lost its best playmakers. They return their QB... UT returns its two RB's. UT's front 7 seems to match up very nicely against their OL. Their WR's have more experience but, just based on what I have seen from them, less talent than UT's young guys.

Even after watching a pretty bad UNC team blow one opportunity after another to get in and stay in that game... I saw things that Jones will probably try to take advantage of.

I could be wrong but right now I like the match up... and neither team has talented depth with experience.
 
#223
#223
Petrino better get that neck brace ready cause it's going to crack, when we score a lot of touchdowns.
 
#224
#224
LotteryPick said:
Stop acting like you're some complex individual and get off your high horse. Anyone that can't properly type out "you" and "you're" has absolutely no room to call out someone else.
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Thx...grammar officer! Calling someone out on shortening words that r clearly understood as if it's some kind of new concept. Really??? What is this 2005?? Hope that wasn't to complex for to understand bud. Just in case it was: bite me!!
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#225
#225
The Orange Pants said:
Had it not been for the best thread on this site, I wouldn't have known this character called me out.

Regarding 1s v 2s, nothing was specified. A blanket statement was made. Whatever.
I'm the one who can't understand others? Dude you're so far up your own ass you can't even see anyone else, much less understand them. You're a joke. You want some type of exclusive area for you and your crew to talk? Make a new site. This isn't Nazi Germany where you determine who is inferior.
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Inferiority complex much bro?? All I said is that it would be nice to have a thread that people can have a civil discussion in without immature bashing by people who frankly come off as having an inability to understand. The bashing indicts an inability to contribute productively, but a need to..."just cause." People would monitor each other, and keep each other in check. What's wrong with that??? U afraid u wouldn't hack it in the group?? Mommy always told u were special didn't she???

Seriously Nazi's huh??? This is a private board bro not the federal govt. Step away from the ledge. I bet u bash Dooley for some of his analogies too. Smh.
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