Possible Replacement For Serrano?

We beat Tim Corbin this weekend, 2 out of 3 games with all the advantages they have that folks discuss ad nauseum...with players Corbin didn't want....and yet...people will want to back up a brinks truck to Tim Corbin's house...well after Burke and Helton...


Herky Payne was an All American infielder on the only Tennessee team to make it to the CWS Championship Game (1951) and he was a tailback on the 1951 National Championship team. He's had baseball coaching success on the staff of the 1982 Farragut Baseball State Championship team. He's tanned, rested and ready, hire Herky Payne!!

For the record, I think Serrano will get a 2 or 3 year extension at the end of this year.
 
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Let's be honest at the time of our original upgrades they were absolutely fantastic and we were winning baseball games, now that we are .500 or below no one will be a donor or supporter of the program to get us back up to where we were several years ago. I've heard talk of new wall pads, seat cushions and a scoreboard are on the way, but that's not going to draw a recruit away from the MLB. I'd love for our program to be what it once was, but we are far away from that happening. I agree tho, if we replace Serrano now its just going to further that development for the program. Is he what everyone thought he would be when he was hired? Probably not, but he's no Todd Raleigh either.
 
Atleast he has been able to take us to the SEC tourney...Something Raleigh never managed to do.

Went back and looked

CTR was trying to make a tourney of 8 with 12 total teams

Pretty sure CDS wouldn't have made any tourneys either under that format
 
in 2012 the SEC tournament went to 10 teams instead of 8. Went to 12 when Missouri and A&M came into the league...

Under Raleigh with the 10 team format, we would have made the tournament in 2010, 2008. We were tied for 10th with Auburn in 2009, not sure how the tie breaker would have played out....

Now, without doing a lot of research, I'm thinking the SEC is a little tougher now than it was during the Raleigh years and personally CDS is 3 times the coach of Raleigh IMO.

EDIT: Auburn would have won the tie breaker as they took 2 of 3 from us in 2009.

So, under Raleigh's 4 years, we would have made a 10 team tournament twice....
 
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in 2012 the SEC tournament went to 10 teams instead of 8. Went to 12 when Missouri and A&M came into the league...

Under Raleigh with the 10 team format, we would have made the tournament in 2010, 2008. We were tied for 10th with Auburn in 2009, not sure how the tie breaker would have played out....

Now, without doing a lot of research, I'm thinking the SEC is a little tougher now than it was during the Raleigh years and personally CDS is 3 times the coach of Raleigh IMO.

EDIT: Auburn would have won the tie breaker has they took 2 of 3 from us in 2009.

So, under Raleigh's 4 years, we would have made a 10 team tournament twice....


Good info

Agreed on all
 
On field results disagree

While I've been disappointed with Serrano's record, I've never had the feeling he was in over his head. My first negative reactions to Raleigh were 1. hearing that he was replacing Delmonico, and 2. that he had a Derek Dooley level resume. From that point, my opinion continued downward.
 
The facilities are the not the issue. I know they are upgrading, but UT has better facilites than Vandy, UGA, Kentucky, Missouri and Florida. I have not seen the new set up at Alabama. None of the teams in the eastern part of the conference, other than South Carolina, can compete with the crowds in the western part of the conference as far as crowds and atmosphere. However, I am confident that when and if UT gets going they will pack out the place and can grow quickly. I still hope Serrano figures it out. As I have said before, UT has to recruit well in South. The SEC is brutal, but it is also a recruiting advantage. Best players want to play in best league.
 
The facilities are the not the issue. I know they are upgrading, but UT has better facilites than Vandy, UGA, Kentucky, Missouri and Florida. I have not seen the new set up at Alabama. None of the teams in the eastern part of the conference, other than South Carolina, can compete with the crowds in the western part of the conference as far as crowds and atmosphere. However, I am confident that when and if UT gets going they will pack out the place and can grow quickly. I still hope Serrano figures it out. As I have said before, UT has to recruit well in South. The SEC is brutal, but it is also a recruiting advantage. Best players want to play in best league.

You have more faith than me in the fababse then. I silently cussed the horrible crowds when I was in school. Granted 2005 was the only great year we had during my college days but were never as "bad" as we've been the last 8 years.
 
I dont expect UT to compete with Mississippi State and LSU as far as crowds. I do thinnk if they start winning and being competitive they can draw 4-5 thousand fans. That would be consistent with other teams in the east and very strong national. Could be a great atmoshpere. However, lack of big crowds does not excuse losing.
 
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I dont expect UT to compete with Mississippi State and LSU as far as crowds. I do thinnk if they start winning and being competitive they can draw 4-5 thousand fans. That would be consistent with other teams in the east and very strong national. Could be a great atmoshpere. However, lack of big crowds does not excuse losing.

LNS only holds 4283, so 5000 is highly unlikely. But 3100-3500 every weekend game is definitely doable/expected.
 
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JMO, but our coach is not even close to the main reason for our struggles.

I posted some of this on another forum, but I want to weigh in with it here as well.

The baseball program here isn't going to be as successful as other teams in this league until the administration decides to devote resources to support the program at the same level other schools in this league are. There are plenty more factors than just a facility. If you want to focus on one thing, that's fine, but it's not the whole story.

The fact is, other schools in this league are spending twice as much (or more) on baseball than Tennessee is and our staff is being asked to be competitive with them anyway.

What areas are they outspending us? Travel, for one. Most teams in the league are using charter flights for trips longer than 3 hours. Ours busses virtually everywhere. They can't fly commercial out of Knoxville because of the size of the travel party. So where other teams are spending an hour on a flight, our team is on a bus for 6 hours. They're actually getting to fly to Missouri this weekend, but only because two sleeper busses couldn't be secured like the last time they went there.

Another area is that UT has decided not to spend the money it costs (about $5-6000 per game) to produce every baseball and softball game for an SEC Network+ stream, instead choosing to devote resources to do a better production for a smaller number of games. UT is one of the only schools choosing to do it this way. Most schools are streaming all of their baseball and softball games.

Our stadium and stadium situation hurt our fan support as much as anything on the field. UT makes it very difficult for a fan to come to a game. There is virtually no parking (although the new garage on the old Stokely site will help some), and once fans get to the gates, they find a stadium with terrible concessions and no atmosphere. You can blame marketing or whatever, but the biggest problem is that fans are used to coming to first-class facilities to watch UT games. They get that at Neyland, Thompson-Boling, Regal Soccer Stadium and Lee Softball Stadium, but they get the exact opposite at LNS. On the days we do draw a decent crowd, the amenities like restrooms and concessions are completely overwhelmed. Not solely because of mismanagement, but because the facilities lack the ability to serve that many people in a timely fashion.

There are a half-dozen other examples I can cite, but those are a couple of the big ones. None of these issues are the single reason UT baseball is not succeeding, but as part of the full picture, it's tough to compete.

The bottom line is this. If you want to blame Dave Serrano for the team underperforming, that's fine, that's your right. There are certainly numbers that support that position and I won't dispute that at all. But if you think that just hiring a new coach is going to change everything, then you're wrong. You're free to disagree with that, but it's the truth.

The best we can hope for out of the program with the current level of investment is middle of the pack. True, we're not currently achieving even that. But this is a deeper problem than just getting rid of a coach with a proven track record.

Rod Delmonico was an abrasive jerk, but he was an above-average coach that was able to be successful until other programs started investing in baseball like UT was doing in the 90s. As other programs rose, ours fell because we didn't match the new investments. We fell further behind and dumped Rod. Hired Todd Raleigh on the cheap and let the program fall even more while spending even less on it. They promised Serrano additional investments to get him to come here and he made less in his first few years here than he was making at Fullerton to help make those investments a reality. They never came and now we are where we are.

You can label all of this as "excuses" if you want, but they're the realities that Serrano is working with. They are the same realities that the next coach will deal with, whether that's next year or in five years.
 
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I posted some of this on another forum, but I want to weigh in with it here as well.

The baseball program here isn't going to be as successful as other teams in this league until the administration decides to devote resources to support the program at the same level other schools in this league are. There are plenty more factors than just a facility. If you want to focus on one thing, that's fine, but it's not the whole story.

The fact is, other schools in this league are spending twice as much (or more) on baseball than Tennessee is and our staff is being asked to be competitive with them anyway.

What areas are they outspending us? Travel, for one. Most teams in the league are using charter flights for trips longer than 3 hours. Ours busses virtually everywhere. They can't fly commercial out of Knoxville because of the size of the travel party. So where other teams are spending an hour on a flight, our team is on a bus for 6 hours. They're actually getting to fly to Missouri this weekend, but only because two sleeper busses couldn't be secured like the last time they went there.

Another area is that UT has decided not to spend the money it costs (about $5-6000 per game) to produce every baseball and softball game for an SEC Network+ stream, instead choosing to devote resources to do a better production for a smaller number of games. UT is one of the only schools choosing to do it this way. Most schools are streaming all of their baseball and softball games.

Our stadium and stadium situation hurt our fan support as much as anything on the field. UT makes it very difficult for a fan to come to a game. There is virtually no parking (although the new garage on the old Stokely site will help some), and once fans get to the gates, they find a stadium with terrible concessions and no atmosphere. You can blame marketing or whatever, but the biggest problem is that fans are used to coming to first-class facilities to watch UT games. They get that at Neyland, Thompson-Boling, Regal Soccer Stadium and Lee Softball Stadium, but they get the exact opposite at LNS. On the days we do draw a decent crowd, the amenities like restrooms and concessions are completely overwhelmed. Not solely because of mismanagement, but because the facilities lack the ability to serve that many people in a timely fashion.

There are a half-dozen other examples I can cite, but those are a couple of the big ones. None of these issues are the single reason UT baseball is not succeeding, but as part of the full picture, it's tough to compete.

The bottom line is this. If you want to blame Dave Serrano for the team underperforming, that's fine, that's your right. There are certainly numbers that support that position and I won't dispute that at all. But if you think that just hiring a new coach is going to change everything, then you're wrong. You're free to disagree with that, but it's the truth.

The best we can hope for out of the program with the current level of investment is middle of the pack. True, we're not currently achieving even that. But this is a deeper problem than just getting rid of a coach with a proven track record.

Rod Delmonico was an abrasive jerk, but he was an above-average coach that was able to be successful until other programs started investing in baseball like UT was doing in the 90s. As other programs rose, ours fell because we didn't match the new investments. We fell further behind and dumped Rod. Hired Todd Raleigh on the cheap and let the program fall even more while spending even less on it. They promised Serrano additional investments to get him to come here and he made less in his first few years here than he was making at Fullerton to help make those investments a reality. They never came and now we are where we are.

You can label all of this as "excuses" if you want, but they're the realities that Serrano is working with. They are the same realities that the next coach will deal with, whether that's next year or in five years.

Post of the Year, IMO. Great insight Deerpark! The above post should be a sticky.......
 
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I posted some of this on another forum, but I want to weigh in with it here



What areas are they outspending us? Travel, for one. Most teams in the league are using charter flights for trips longer than 3 hours. Ours busses virtually everywhere. They can't fly commercial out of Knoxville because of the size of the travel party. So where other teams are spending an hour on a flight, our team is on a bus for 6 hours. They're actually getting to fly to Missouri this weekend, but only because two sleeper busses couldn't be secured like the last time they went there.

Deer

Well written post even though I don't agree with a lot of it.


Money spent in the Sec network has zero to do with our program success but the biggest thing I feel you are inaccurate on is this travel budget you post about.

I don't believe for a second any School in the sec is flying charter to a place that is 4 hours away.

Also we always want to compare ourselves to Vandy. Their travel is just about the same as ours when it comes to distance. They bus to nearly all their trips. I know they even bused to lsu a few weeks ago and that is a long trip for sure

Sorry but the travel budget isn't a factor in our underachieving IMO
 
Deer

Well written post even though I don't agree with a lot of it.


Money spent in the Sec network has zero to do with our program success but the biggest thing I feel you are inaccurate on is this travel budget you post about.

I don't believe for a second any School in the sec is flying charter to a place that is 4 hours away.

Also we always want to compare ourselves to Vandy. Their travel is just about the same as ours when it comes to distance. They bus to nearly all their trips. I know they even bused to lsu a few weeks ago and that is a long trip for sure

Sorry but the travel budget isn't a factor in our underachieving IMO

So you believe that not paying to stream all of our games as all of our peers are doing is not reflective of our commitment to baseball?

As for the travel, I don't know about Vanderbilt, but the majority of the programs in the conference are using charter air, at least for return trips on Sunday nights.

You can disagree with the content my post if you want to, but they're just facts. The hard numbers on what we spend on baseball compared to our peers have been posted and linked on this board.

If you look at those numbers and see we're spending half of what our competitors are, a third of what South Carolina and LSU are spending, I don't see how you can possibly conclude that coaching is our biggest problem.
 
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So you believe that not paying to stream all of our games as all of our peers are doing is not reflective of our commitment to baseball?

As for the travel, I don't know about Vanderbilt, but the majority of the programs in the conference are using charter air, at least for return trips on Sunday nights.

You can disagree with the content my post if you want to, but they're just facts. The hard numbers on what we spend on baseball compared to our peers have been posted and linked on this board.

If you look at those numbers and see we're spending half of what our competitors are, a third of what South Carolina and LSU are spending, I don't see how you can possibly conclude that coaching is our biggest problem.

The SEC network thing might show a cost cutting mentality I agree but I don't agree that has any direct correlation to success on the field.

Again I don't believe any SEC school is using a flight of any kind for a 4 hour trip. 6 or more sure it happens some but as you said in your post we are flying to mizzu this week so I don't see the point.


$ pales in Comparison to the poor Decision to think an offense led by Bergeron would win in this league. That was the biggest reason this thing has sputtered IMO much more so than travel budgets and sec network commitments
 
Deer

Well written post even though I don't agree with a lot of it.


Money spent in the Sec network has zero to do with our program success but the biggest thing I feel you are inaccurate on is this travel budget you post about.

I don't believe for a second any School in the sec is flying charter to a place that is 4 hours away.

Also we always want to compare ourselves to Vandy. Their travel is just about the same as ours when it comes to distance. They bus to nearly all their trips. I know they even bused to lsu a few weeks ago and that is a long trip for sure

Sorry but the travel budget isn't a factor in our underachieving IMO

I would think this would be factor in recruiting and that has a direct impact on the play on the field. Other schools being able to tell a player that their family and friends can watch just about every game they play in college has to help them. Kids would be willing to go further away from home with that in mind. Also they can sell the fact that a scout can watch the game or a replay online. I know scouts want to see players in person but it doesn't change the fact that schools can sell that and we can only say that about SEC games.
 
I would think this would be factor in recruiting and that has a direct impact on the play on the field. Other schools being able to tell a player that their family and friends can watch just about every game they play in college has to help them. Kids would be willing to go further away from home with that in mind. Also they can sell the fact that a scout can watch the game or a replay online. I know scouts want to see players in person but it doesn't change the fact that schools can sell that and we can only say that about SEC games.

Down the road I agree but the kids we have now weren't recruited with the sec network in mind.
 
The SEC network thing might show a cost cutting mentality I agree but I don't agree that has any direct correlation to success on the field.

Again I don't believe any SEC school is using a flight of any kind for a 4 hour trip. 6 or more sure it happens some but as you said in your post we are flying to mizzu this week so I don't see the point.


$ pales in Comparison to the poor Decision to think an offense led by Bergeron would win in this league. That was the biggest reason this thing has sputtered IMO much more so than travel budgets and sec network commitments


It all adds up...it is never one thing. Teams that travel better, have the potential to play better, teams that have a big presence on Twitter, TV, etc...have better name recognition (UT should be doing a huge campaign to promote Nick). It shows commitment, it is about doing the little things, and if your competition is doing it better than you...time to up your game.
 
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It all adds up...it is never one thing. Teams that travel better, have the potential to play better, teams that have a big presence on Twitter, TV, etc...have better name recognition (UT should be doing a huge campaign to promote Nick). It shows commitment, it is about doing the little things, and if your competition is doing it better than you...time to up your game.

Bingo.
 
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