question about homosexuality

in your opinion are the gay people born that way or do they make a choice to be gay?

  • Total voters
    0
  • Poll closed .
#126
#126
gcbvol said:
I don't see these as attacks at all. I simply want access to the same federal/state benefits/privileges afforded to straight couples. In terms of marriage, (which you have not mentioned here, but I know others have great issue with) civil unions would be fine with me, but the government would need to move to civil union based structure and get out of the marriage business. I will also add there is more at stake than the financial aspects (which can be significant when factoring in estate handling after a partner passes, etc.) - there is also the matter of visitation and decision making when a partner is ill. I know folks who have been locked out in situations of serious illness - even with POAs. These are the most important of the benefits to me. Sure, we can work to try and cover the discrepancies through Wills and POAs but that will not resolve everything. I want to be careful not to come across as someone trying to save a few dollars here, but there are things very important to me. How would you feel if your spouse of several years became seriously ill and you were locked out of visitation and decision making status? I know folks who have experienced this and I never want to even be in a position where that could happen. Also, in the instance that your spouse passes away the estate taxation variance is significant. What if you were in a position in which the added taxation on your spouse's estate had a direct impact on your means of living? Your partner's 401K would also have to be liquidated at a much higher tax rate or remain in the plan with minimum distribution. A surviving spouse can rollover the deceased's 401K into their own account tax free. This may seem petty, but can make a big difference in the lives of many.
Click to expand...

All of those concerns are certainly legitimate.

I don't see the problem getting access to the same benefits as married couples myself. I think the whole "marriage" thing is what people don't see eye to eye on, but marriage in today's age is much different, than the idea of marriage from long ago that people still try to hold dear, but do such a poor job of.

I really believe that marriage ties the church and the state together, whether anyone wants to believe that or not. Most people get married in a church, yet get divorced in court because of the legal ramifications. That's what I don't get. If you get married in a church, you should get divorced through a church, only if wrongdoing can be proven.
 
#127
#127
joeydupree said:
Do you have children?

What will you teach your 4 year old when they see a gay couple and ask questions as only kids can? (Assuming you're not laying up with a man and they're calling him uncle and are already used to seeing same sex partners.)
Click to expand...

You tell them about it and move on.
 
#128
#128
gcbvol said:
Agreed, and FWIW I was raised 'straight' I suppose. It's not like my parents actively raised me to like the same sex, or raised me like I was a girl. Goodness, it really is not that difficult if you take time to think through it. Parents are going to cause a hell of a lot more trouble if they attempt to raise children 'not to be gay'. Ever wonder why the instance of suicide attempts by gay teens is so high? We are exactly like straight people...only reversed. :)
Click to expand...

Because kids are dumb and give other kids a hard time for no reason. That statement is almost like saying the parents would be the one's to cause it for trying to raise them the way they see fit. Am I wrong in how I'm reading that??
 
#129
#129
gcbvol said:
Parents are going to cause a hell of a lot more trouble if they attempt to raise children 'not to be gay'. Ever wonder why the instance of suicide attempts by gay teens is so high? We are exactly like straight people...only reversed. :)
Click to expand...

You didn't comprehend me clearly it seems. I'm using the point I just quoted to ask my question.

I can't understand what it's like since I'm not gay.
On the same token, you can't understand what it's like to be a straight man raising your boys, so your logic to my question does not apply although I don't mind your opinion.

I don't believe babies are born gay. If you were to expect me to buy into it, theoretically, I would in turn raise my children differently.
Most straight men will teach their boys anti gay things. Sorry, but if I see my child or any relative do something suspect I'm going to try and teach them things to prevent them from making a habit of it.
 
#130
#130
g8terh8ter_eric said:
Considering I saw reduced tax breaks after making more money with my ex during our marriage, I know from experience that unless you are poor, the benefits of marriage and children aren't near what people make them out to be.
Click to expand...

I cannot comment on your experience; however, your notion that the tax benefits of marriage are only for the poor are patently false. Individuals earning $150K and $50K, respectively, are going to pay more in taxes, individually, than they would if they were married.
 
#131
#131
joeydupree said:
Do you have children?

What will you teach your 4 year old when they see a gay couple and ask questions as only kids can? (Assuming you're not laying up with a man and they're calling him uncle and are already used to seeing same sex partners.)
Click to expand...

I will answer truthfully to whatever questions they ask.
 
#132
#132
g8terh8ter_eric said:
I really believe that marriage ties the church and the state together, whether anyone wants to believe that or not. Most people get married in a church, yet get divorced in court because of the legal ramifications. That's what I don't get. If you get married in a church, you should get divorced through a church, only if wrongdoing can be proven.
Click to expand...

You are not familiar with the Catholic annulment process; having had an annulment in the Catholic Church, I can tell you that plenty of individuals who get married and end up getting divorced, also go through a church annulment process.
 
#136
#136
Right. But kids copy everything they see. They don't just ask, get an honest answer from Dad and move on.
What do you do when you see your 4 or 5 year old little boy kissing another little boy?

I know how to raise my children and nothing said here has any effect on how I'll continue to do that. I'm asking how you guys see it just purely for this debate over whether or not babies are born gay.
 
#137
#137
g8terh8ter_eric said:
Because kids are dumb and give other kids a hard time for no reason. That statement is almost like saying the parents would be the one's to cause it for trying to raise them the way they see fit. Am I wrong in how I'm reading that??
Click to expand...

Not exactly. What I am saying is that we are getting into dangerous territory if parents or other authority figures are actively raising children 'not to be gay'. As if being gay is a bad or evil thing. Again, I will bring my own experience in on this topic - I had a lot of self hate as I fought my homosexuality for many years. I never attempted suicide, but would be lying if I said I never thought about it. In retrospect I think it crazy that it ever crossed my mind, but it was not an easy time in my life.

I am not advocating that parents teach their children that 'gay is OK'. I think it would be great (when they are of proper age, whenever that is), but not what I'm saying. The problem would be actively teaching that gay is bad, because if a child is gay there will likely be plenty of struggle for them without the added reason to self-loathe.
 
#138
#138
Burhead said:
So the answer is to pretend they don't exist and lock your kid inside the home?
Click to expand...

Nobody said anything like that.

But yea, I'm totally for locking my kids up away from the whole wide world. Everybody else who isn't gay feels the same way. Gtfo.
 
#139
#139
joeydupree said:
How do we as straight men raise our boys to carry our legacy and lead our families without putting tremendous pressure on them if by chance they are gay?

I guess I could accept if my son CHOSE to be gay, but how do I give him the best shot in life if what I teach him goes against his very make up?
I'd rather not cause irreparable damage by trying to teach my boys to be men. (of course, that's if I believed you could be born gay)

So what do you teach them since there's a chance they're gay?
Click to expand...
I teach them to be a man. Honesty, responsibility, reliability. As far as I know gay men are men too. So I'll teach them what my dad taught me.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
 
#141
#141
Spartacavolus said:
then you need to hold off on children if you would explain homosexuality to a 4 yr old
Click to expand...

No thanks. If they have questions, I will answer their questions. I am not afraid of knowledge and I will not raise children by lying to them or refusing to provide answers to their questions.
 
#142
#142
joeydupree said:
Right. But kids copy everything they see. They don't just ask, get an honest answer from Dad and move on.
What do you do when you see your 4 or 5 year old little boy kissing another little boy?

I know how to raise my children and nothing said here has any effect on how I'll continue to do that. I'm asking how you guys see it just purely for this debate over whether or not babies are born gay.
Click to expand...


I think some people are born gay and some poeple "become" gay. Is a mother of 3 that's now lesbian born that way? Is a former lesbian that's now a mother of 3 still gay?

There isn't a blanket answer.
 
#143
#143
its very interesting when people without children try to give lessons to those who do.

You go ahead and teach your 4 yr old son about anal sex and bj's Trut. It fits your style.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 2 people
#144
#144
joeydupree said:
Nobody said anything like that.

But yea, I'm totally for locking my kids up away from the whole wide world. Everybody else who isn't gay feels the same way. Gtfo.
Click to expand...

My point is, if you kid has a question about anything in life; be it homosexuality, drugs, etc, you should tell them the truth about it no matter their age.
 
  • Like
Reactions: 1 person
#145
#145
It's not you gcbvol. I wanna know what these straight guys will teach their boys if the happen upon it. Because it comes across to me as very hypocritical for the sake of the argument. From a straight man with kids point of view.
 
#147
#147
therealUT said:
No thanks. If they have questions, I will answer their questions. I am not afraid of knowledge and I will not raise children by lying to them or refusing to provide answers to their questions.
Click to expand...

You better be careful what you say then, because it can and will come back to haunt you, especially in today's society.
 
#149
#149
Burhead said:
My point is, if you kid has a question about anything in life; be it homosexuality, drugs, etc, you should tell them the truth about it no matter their age.
Click to expand...

Telling them the truth, and telling them what they should know at a certain point in their development, are two totally different things.
 
#150
#150
joeydupree said:
You didn't comprehend me clearly it seems. I'm using the point I just quoted to ask my question.

I can't understand what it's like since I'm not gay.
On the same token, you can't understand what it's like to be a straight man raising your boys, so your logic to my question does not apply although I don't mind your opinion.

I don't believe babies are born gay. If you were to expect me to buy into it, theoretically, I would in turn raise my children differently.
Most straight men will teach their boys anti gay things. Sorry, but if I see my child or any relative do something suspect I'm going to try and teach them things to prevent them from making a habit of it.
Click to expand...

I understand what you're saying, and I do not have children so cannot relate directly. What I'll ask is what if you're wrong about babies not being born gay? What if there really is no choice involved and you raise a child born gay 'anti-gay concepts'? Do you see how that could cause a lot of damage to the child as they work to accept who they are?

Like you mentioned, you are not gay so how could you know for sure that it is a choice?

I am not trying to tell you how to raise your children, just offering another perspective.
 
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.

VN Store



Back
Top