Recruiting Football Talk VII

[Devo182]

Alabama had 4 in Smith, Ruggs, Jeudy, and Waddle and LSU had 3 in Jefferson, Chase, and Marshall. Both in 2019.

Both offenses were nearly unstoppable and all 7 of those receivers got drafted high.

Absolutely on point.

It's also likely our best shot v defenses like UGA's.

Look at how OSU and LSU put up a lot of points on them. Elite depth at WR. We can't just win with 1 elite guy. We need our WR2...3...4 to beat their #2-4 DBs. Not sure we've had that depth of raw talent yet.

 

[Jimmy Football]

Great News the Houston Gamblers have signed ex Vol QB Jarrett Guatemala....

Gonna be gamblin’ every down…

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Whats something tangible you can share to prove that the reason the offense was limited solely because of the QB?? Joe's numbers are in line with Hendon over the past 2 seasons.

If you are saying the offense was limited or worse (all of this is in comparison to 2022) and Joe played a factor among other factors that I've mentioned earlier than we are in agreement. My beef is most folks are saying we were "limited" bc of the QB when his numbers mirror Hendon's.

And I don't disagree that the offense will probably be better than 2023 next year. But my belief is not solely based on the QB. Comparing 2023, we will be better on the Oline and WRs and I expect a better Joey Hazle and CJH from the gameplan, play design, play calls going into Year 2. I do also think Nico is the real deal.

WTFH are you talking about that Joe's numbers "mirrored" Hookers?...that is asinine.

Are you f'n blind?

 

[Orangeburst]

Gonna be gamblin’ every down…

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

the point is that is where his strengths lie… if he hits them then he is successful but he struggles to drive the team.

He absolutely sucks on 3rd down..I love the guy, but that is just the truth....the more pressure on the play, the slower he processes.

 

[SSVol]

Nico's success in 7x7 football will have prepared him well in these areas. I truly believe a RS freshman Nico will outshine a senior *citizen* Milton.

Fixed it.

 

[Orange_Crush]

Everything not on Joe. Was he Hendon? No. Was he JG? No. Go look at his numbers, he actually had a solid year despite everyone blaming all our failures on him. I've said all season our play calling and gameplans were lacking. That's on the coaches.

Milton's problems were plenty. One could ignore seeing him in-game, look back on his numbers, and say, "He was a really good QB that the coaches failed to use". Or one could remember in-game Milton, look at his stats and ask, "How did the staff end up getting so much out of him?"

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Translation, one Florida team is too many.

Allowing FSU and Clemson to join the B1G is a huge mistake imo.

 

[Cosmo Kramer]

I'm glad you don't have WNML where you live. Listening to Swain and Kevin Simon discuss this team would cause you to have a stroke.

Are you saying McGill has a Flip Phone and can’t download apps

 

[TN-POSSUM]

Trade them Vandy maybe, only since IT MIGHT strengthen them in recruiting and hurt UF. I would still prefer to poach UNC from the ACC to clean up our SEC map, improve BB and decent FB that might pick up steam in our league. Vandy fits better with WF, GT, and the rest of the remaining teams after the other leagues poach the big boys. Let FSU go to the Big 10. Just have an unexplained anti FSU tendency probably dating back to them avoiding joining us years ago.

Vandy was SEC way before Mizzu or USCjr. We can't get rid of our "lil brother".

If we take UNC, I think we would have to take Duke too. You couldn't split them up.

I agree, FSU should have joined us years ago, but I'd be fine with them joining now. With Florida being down, FSU coming in to the SEC would hurt the gaters more than anyone else. And I'm all about the gators being/staying in the ditch. Mizzu needs to go to the Big 10 and replace them with the Seminoles

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

I think they tended to avoid the situations that got Joe in trouble. His clear inability to throw receivers open or anticipate them being open likely made the middle of the field less available. Whatever his role in '22, Golesh wasn't key in all the successful offenses Heupel had in the past, and Heupel didn't forget how to coach offense this year. Joe's stats were decent *because* of the game plan, but the overall performance was down because they were planning around his limitations. I bet that'll be obvious by mid season next year.

Also...throwing inaccurately, especially high, is death over the middle...which in my opinion is why they didn't want Joe doing it.

 

[knoxvol52]

View attachment 604225

All in on 7-2 off suit...

 

[TN-POSSUM]

What do you call a blind doe?

I have no eye deer.

 

[SSVol]

He doesn't get it and isn't gonna.

I distinctly remember Matt Sims having better stats than Tyler Bray, but Bray was completing passes to the guys that allowed us to move the chains and score points. With him our 3rd down conversion % roughly doubled. We looked like an entirely different offense with Bray, with nothing else changing, in literally the same game. Stats don't begin to tell the full story and clearly some don't understand that it doesn't matter what play you call if the guy with the ball can't deliver it where it needs to go.

 

[Orange_Crush]

I think they tended to avoid the situations that got Joe in trouble. His clear inability to throw receivers open or anticipate them being open likely made the middle of the field less available. Whatever his role in '22, Golesh wasn't key in all the successful offenses Heupel had in the past, and Heupel didn't forget how to coach offense this year. Joe's stats were decent *because* of the game plan, but the overall performance was down because they were planning around his limitations. I bet that'll be obvious by mid season next year.

I suspect it'll be obvious by the bowl game this year.

I think the primary difference between hooker and Milton is that Hooker was energized by pressure and Milton was paralyzed by pressure. Every report and indication was that Milton was the film room, pop quiz and practice field king. He just seemed to tense up in games. Couldn't get out of his own way, and it caused two of our greatest issues with him--accuracy/feel/touch/etc, and lack of situational awareness. He'd hold on to the ball, hesitate, overthrow, laser-throw, and then run out of bounds on 4th down.

He has all the physical tools that seem to be limited by a mental block.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

The difference between this season and last season was because of personnel. 2022 defense was not good but was masked by incredible offense. The defense was actually better this year but the lighting strike o was gone. I think we have dramatically improved both sides for next year and the foreseeable future.
Most people are a year behind and will assume we will be basically the same as this year next year. There are going to be some shocked people.

I hope you're right...I could see it happening if we stay healthy and get some things to go our way..

Also, and this is a HUGE IF...the SECorrupt will call off their hitmen and give us a fair shake.

 

[Devo182]

We don't know for fact either of these points
-Joe may have the strongest arm that college football has ever seen. So doubtful on that point for Nico
-Hendon was one of the highest completion throwers in Tennessee history. 68% and 69% in back to back seasons. That will be tough to beat as well. I do know we will find out at the beginning of the year next year though.

So much of running this offense is hidden in intangibles. I mean, the end results do end up in some jumbled data, but it's not as clear as usual. This offense is pretty unique in how important managing and running it quickly is. Not everyone is built for it.

Imo HH got us set up, running at max efficiency, in the right plays much more often.

JM seemed to struggle on running the offense and seeing the guys open. Which is why you saw more "check with mes". To a (much lesser) degree what HB had shown (and with a much slower offense).

This is where, if scouting is accurate, Nico will excel. Throw in his ability to make nontraditional throws (side arm, whippers, etc) and his quick elusiveness and it's easy to see how he could eclipse HH in this offense. But he needs some time and patience like anyone that green.

 

[Weezer]

Are you saying McGill has a Flip Phone and can’t download apps

What's wrong with flip phones?? I have one. I don't believe in smart phones. That's why I'll be one of the last ones killed by Skynet.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

Know this won't go over well, but I think we've got "comfortable" guys on this coaching staff. They aren't great coaches and definitely aren't great recruiters. Heupel is familiar with them and comfortable working with them. They aren't the kind of guys who usually help you succeed in this league. Give Saban credit. He's not afraid of hiring the best talent he can find. He's secure in his skin and surrounds himself with only the hardest workers...the best. Kirby is along the same lines. Heupel is really starting to remind me of Fulmer toward the tail end of his career at UT in some regards with his coaching staff. Along those lines, I see some parallels between Fulmer losing a detail oriented, disciplinarian type in Cutcliff just like Heupel lwith Golesh. Yeah, everyone says Heupel is really the OC, but being the head man is tough enough without trying to be the OC, too. What Fulmer missed the most was the discipline and attention to details that Cut brought. Wonder if USF will lead their league in penalties?

One thing is certain, this will be the longest Heupel has been the HC at one place if I'm not mistaken. After this year, this will be HIS roster. That's when the clock is ticking. I'll be curious to see what the program looks like in Nico's year 2. I'll also be keeping an eye on Golesh at USF to see if my comparison to Fulmer/Cutcliff still remains somewhat reasonable. Hope Heupel figures it out and this program takes off, but those similarities with Fulmer has me feeling a little on edge.

Dumb

 

[Orange_Crush]

Everything not on Joe. Was he Hendon? No. Was he JG? No. Go look at his numbers, he actually had a solid year despite everyone blaming all our failures on him. I've said all season our play calling and gameplans were lacking. That's on the coaches.

You've stated that Joe had issues throwing, the WRs had issues catching, the OL had issues protecting. WRs and OL compounded the issues with injuries. You've affirmed all of that, yet you want to ultimately blame it on the coach's gameplan (that had to try to make chicken salad out of the... ahem... ingredients you listed)?

That's not expecting a coaching staff. That's demanding Jesus and the apostles, amigo.

 

[VolNash17]

Know this won't go over well, but I think we've got "comfortable" guys on this coaching staff. They aren't great coaches and definitely aren't great recruiters. Heupel is familiar with them and comfortable working with them. They aren't the kind of guys who usually help you succeed in this league. Give Saban credit. He's not afraid of hiring the best talent he can find. He's secure in his skin and surrounds himself with only the hardest workers...the best. Kirby is along the same lines. Heupel is really starting to remind me of Fulmer toward the tail end of his career at UT in some regards with his coaching staff. Along those lines, I see some parallels between Fulmer losing a detail oriented, disciplinarian type in Cutcliff just like Heupel lwith Golesh. Yeah, everyone says Heupel is really the OC, but being the head man is tough enough without trying to be the OC, too. What Fulmer missed the most was the discipline and attention to details that Cut brought. Wonder if USF will lead their league in penalties?

One thing is certain, this will be the longest Heupel has been the HC at one place if I'm not mistaken. After this year, this will be HIS roster. That's when the clock is ticking. I'll be curious to see what the program looks like in Nico's year 2. I'll also be keeping an eye on Golesh at USF to see if my comparison to Fulmer/Cutcliff still remains somewhat reasonable. Hope Heupel figures it out and this program takes off, but those similarities with Fulmer has me feeling a little on edge.

That’s fair to have concerns. You’re exactly right that his clock starts ticking this next year. Overall he’s exceeded expectations so far but the circumstances change and with that comes renewed expectations

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

There should be no more excuses by anyone if secondary performance does not improve. Banks/Martinez have handpicked talent at their disposal with a couple of established vets working in as transfers. The D-line and LB rooms are experienced and loaded. No more BS excuses allowed.

If the O scoring returns to closer to its 2022 performance, making the playoffs should be the expectation. So now I expect the manage expectations crowd on here to rush in with their 8-9 win projections.

You assume no injury problems.

 

[VolNash17]

Also for the many other times I’ve said this. I’m not advocating for a Head Coach firing

That’s fair to have concerns. You’re exactly right that his clock starts ticking this next year. Overall he’s exceeded expectations so far but the circumstances change and with that comes renewed expectations

A few guys on staff could leave though

 

[VolNash17]

There should be no more excuses by anyone if secondary performance does not improve. Banks/Martinez have handpicked talent at their disposal with a couple of established vets working in as transfers. The D-line and LB rooms are experienced and loaded. No more BS excuses allowed.

If the O scoring returns to closer to its 2022 performance, making the playoffs should be the expectation. So now I expect the manage expectations crowd on here to rush in with their 8-9 win projections.

Expectations from me personally not that they matter at all because they don’t obviously… but 10 wins is a reasonable amount looking at the schedule next year and comparing it to the rosters across the conference. Not to mention it’s one of the weaker SEC schedules for 2024

 

[SSVol]

Everything not on Joe. Was he Hendon? No. Was he JG? No. Go look at his numbers, he actually had a solid year despite everyone blaming all our failures on him. I've said all season our play calling and gameplans were lacking. That's on the coaches.

Yes, he did have a solid year...because play calling was adapted to what he could do well. We also weren't nearly as explosive on offense...because play calling was limited by what he couldn't do well.