Recruiting Forum Football Talk IV

[BigSteve09]

Tell a fan to tell a fan! We have to maintain this spot if we want to continue the big wins like Nico, and KEEP our best guys. We have to be a mile ahead of the second best if we want to stop missing on transfers and losing recruits (like big boy OL) to other teams.

 

[you]

Spoiler: Charts

View attachment 477681

In his fall camp kick-off presser Sunday Heupel was asked by Brent Hubbs if during the offseason Heupel and the staff during their self-scout had found any rhyme or reason why we didn’t fare so well statistically in the 2nd quarters of some of our games. Josh thanked him for pointing that out. lol.

In the first quarter even against the big 3 last year we did pretty well winning 2 out of the 3. Overall we outscored our opponents last year in the 1st quarter in 11 of our 13 games. Only Florida and Ole Miss put more points on the board in the first quarter than we did.

In the 2nd quarter we were outscored in 7 of the 13 games. We lost the 2nd quarter to BGSU, Kentucky, Ole Miss, Pittsburgh, Purdue, Alabama, and Georgia.

We only lost 3 of the 13 3rd quarters, South Carolina, Florida, and Georgia.

We lost 5 of the 13 4th quarters, Vanderbilt, Purdue, Florida, Alabama, and Georgia.

We lost the only overtime period last year to Purdue.

Football, it is often said, is about winning one-on-one matchups. It’s also said that execution is critical. Jim Chaney throughout his time here claimed that he approaches his coordinator role as a chess player. Fans from schools all over often complain that coordinators whether offense or defense are too slow to make adjustments when things aren’t working.

One of the more common critiques of Heupel’s offense is that it is too simple and relies heavily on attacking the defense when it is not ready or properly aligned. It’s thought that the tempo challenges communication on the defensive side of the ball and allows us to take advantage of catching the defense off-guard so to speak. One analyst for On3 who has high regard for the Briles offense claims that Heupel’s version is janky. I had to look up that word. It means poor quality. I mean that’s like his opinion. jmo.

In the 3 Power 5 losses not among the big 3 SEC teams on our schedule it would seem that we lost the game in the 2nd quarter. Overall we won the 1st quarters of those games as well as marginally coming out ahead in the 3rd and 4th quarters. We got blasted by those 3 teams in the 2nd quarter, 57-13. We lost the 2nd quarter to our big 3 permanent SEC opponents by a score of 38-7.

In the 7 games we won we outscored our opponents in the 2nd quarter by a score of 89-48 so it would seem like whatever the issue may be isn’t related to all of our opponents.

In wins, we won 1Q 119-10, 2Q 89-48, 3Q 87-34, and 4Q 56-35.

In losses, we won 1Q 71-41. We lost 2Q 20-95, 3Q 27-41, and 4Q 42-71.

Josh’s answer to Brent was that the 2nd quarter was pretty poignant in some of our games. He said there was no magic potion. He said it was some of the things that we controlled in those ball games, in particular on the offensive side of the football. He talked about everything we’re doing in the weight room and our offseason program and how they’ve related everything to 4 quarters. Honestly, to an extent, it all that sounded like coach-speak to me and I would have been just as pleased if Josh told Brent that what they were doing to address the issue was none of his business. lol..

Here’s what has been said that I think answers Brent’s question. First, in the spring Alex Golesh said that our offense would continue to evolve. Second, it has been said Hooker and the other guys have a much better grasp of our offense heading into year two. Third, it has been said that we are adding option elements to our offense and in fact were practicing that in the spring.

Last year Heupel got a lot of praise for his scheme and rightly so for the results it produced compared to our recent experience on offense but apparently what we were doing last year will only take us so far depending on the quality of our opponent, both players on the field and opposing coaches. I learned from Booger McFarland not to dismiss outside critiques that I may not want to hear. His preseason claim that we would be abysmal in 2017 yielded the worst on-field performance for a Tennessee football team in the entire history of the program. At the time on VolNation McFarland was the devil incarnate. jmo.

I think most critiques from rival fans can be dismissed but if those critiques are coming from someone not wedded to a fanbase I think they’re worth looking into. After I had posted a number of times about our defense and expectations for the coming year on that side of the ball one forum regular noted that no one talks about the offense.

This is my thinking on the offense. Heupel and Golesh are evolving the offense in order to address the issues we faced last year against some of the better teams on our schedule. I think they don’t want too many specifics of that ongoing evolution getting out but they’ve told us that they know we need to make some adjustments and they’ve let us know as much as they can that they have a plan. jmo.

I think across our program deficiencies identified last year by the staff and players are being addressed. We have more talent, more experience and development, a better grasp of our schemes, and have added wrinkles to our schemes to throw at some of the better teams on our schedule which is why I do not think it is pie in the sky wishful thinking that our performance this year has the potential to shock the world. jmo.

Simply stated… our opponents adjusted to us in the 2Q, we adjusted at half time, then the opponent adjusted in 4Q

 

[engineerVOL]

Unleash Spyre, Donde.

 

[BigSteve09]

You're 100% a racist...

I see white guys catching passes, I turn into Belichick

 

[Jimmy Football]

 

[berryvol]

This is the code. I use mobile app and the app is called “Premiere League: Official App”. In the app there is a fantasy tab and you just have to go make a team first and then you go to “Join Leagues” and enter the code.

Just joined. Gonna have to get more active in the EPL thread this year. Sometimes I forgot this site exists outside of the recruiting and hoops forum lol

 

[jpope9]

Tell a fan to tell a fan! We have to maintain this spot if we want to continue the big wins like Nico, and KEEP our best guys. We have to be a mile ahead of the second best if we want to stop missing on transfers and losing recruits (like big boy OL) to other teams.

I like how everyone has a legal collective, yet Miami has 1 booster directly paying players out of his own pocket.....

 

[Volsdeep4]

I was just talking to someone about this, they wanted to try shrooms and wanted my advice. Its all about having a plan. Where you do it, who you do it with and your frame of mind when you do it all matter a great deal. Ive pretty much always had a great trip but Ive always been in nature with good peeps. Its been about a year since I did it and probably 8 years since I went deep but I still feel shrooms are the bestest of drugs. 100% from the earth meant to open the third eye.

Oh definitely have to have a plan and good mindset. 1st time had a fire, a clear night, and sober gf to take care of everything. Spectacular time. 2nd time I was fishing it started to thunderstorm real bad. I swear it took me 25 mins to run up an incline made for wheelchairs and hyperventilating the whole time. Haha

 

[sjt18]

So it just so happens that most of the talent Saban recognizes are highly rated 4 and 5* guys.

No. I have explained that over and over. For whatever reason you don't want to see it. There is a cause-effect relationship.

Your what if scenario about the recruiting services is moot. Recruiting services exist and here are the FACTS.

Well, no it isn't. You just rightly recognize that it blows your faith in the recruiting sites out of the water.

1. The teams with the most 4 and 5* players win at the highest rate.

Do they? Drop Bama, UGA, OSU, and Clemson who are the top 4 recruiting programs over the last few years. Suddenly the rankings do NOT predict winning at the "highest rate" any more. According to 247's 4 year talent composite, LSU is next. They were 6-7 last year. OU was after them at 11-2 but UF was next at 6-7. TAM was after them and finished 8-4 which is good... but not reflective of top 10 talent. Oregon is next at 10-4 but they were also monkey stomped in the Pac12 CG by Utah whose composite is 32. USC rounds out 247's top 10 most talented teams according to recruiting rankings at 4-8.

The combined record last year of the teams that the recruiting sites said had talent ranked 5th through 10th... was 45-32. And you think the rankings accurately predict wins?

2. The big 4? Bama, UGA, OSU and Clemson? Has been responsible for 10 of the last 13 national championships.

Correct. So according to you the recruiting sites just so happen to see their recruits as elite COMPLETELY independent of the programs that are recruiting them... That's just dumb.

Those 2 facts are irrefutable. Those facts blow your narrative to pieces.

Not even close. Those two "irrefutable facts" don't come close to proving your contention. Not even ballpark close. The recruiting rankings don't even accurately predict winners and losers in the SEC after Bama and UGA.

Here are the standings from last year and the 4 year composite talent ranking in the SEC according to 247:

UGA- 2
UK- 12
UT- 7
MU- 13
USCe- 8
UF- 4
Vandy- 14

Bama- 1
OM- 9
Ark- 10
MSU- 11
TAM- 5
Aub- 6
LSU- 3

You can attribute part of that to coaching but the West according to the talent 247 says each program has... is essentially upside down. They can take cues from UGA and Bama but when they have to evaluate more on their own... they don't predict winners.

 

[TheRain]

Bamas not going undefeated.

 

[BarnesIsCaliparisDaddy]

DAMMIT COME ON HADDEN

 

[Nash_Vol97]

Just joined. Gonna have to get more active in the EPL thread this year. Sometimes I forgot this site exists outside of the recruiting and hoops forum lol

Haha the EPL thread and this thread is where I spend 99% or my time on VN. I forget about the rest. Also love the smoking and grilling thread in the Pub but forget about it a lot haha.

 

[TheRain]

John Ruiz is a collective unto himself.

 

[Ron Swanson]

Tell a fan to tell a fan! We have to maintain this spot if we want to continue the big wins like Nico, and KEEP our best guys. We have to be a mile ahead of the second best if we want to stop missing on transfers and losing recruits (like big boy OL) to other teams.

1. Spyre Sports Group (Tennessee)
No collective to date has pushed the envelope more – or been bolder and more ambitious – than this Tennessee-centric collective. Spyre Sports Group is the clear No. 1. As one industry source said, “Spyre is not messing around. They are big spenders and are smart about it.”
Spyre is also not shy about publicizing its grand vision, putting figures behind its ambition. Spyre president and co-founder Hunter Baddour said the collective is aiming to generate at least $25 million annually. The money would be put into the pockets of student-athletes (or recruits). In an ultra-competitive landscape in the SEC, this could help lure an increasing number of five-star prospects to Knoxville.
Baddour didn’t mince words to The Athletic: “We realized being involved in recruiting was going to be a priority. Then we realized how much money we were going to need to be elite. And we’re shooting to be No. 1.”
The state of Tennessee also relaxed its state NIL law to create a friendlier landscape for NIL collectives. That gives Spyre more room to create NIL deals with. – Jeremy Crabtree

Not. Messing. Around.

 

[UpstateVol613]

 

[Enki_Amenra]

It’s a much more relaxed format then NFL fantasy football. Your players earn points each week and the winner is total points at the end of the season. Only allowed one free transfer a week, so not much shuffling and daily concentration on who has a good matchup that week. Also, there’s no draft. You get 100M and you have to buy a starting 11 and 4 subs. People can buy the same players it’s just about who buys and maintains the best collective team over the course of the season. It’s fun and will be a very relaxed league. Just fans of EPL looking for more reasons to watch more games other than our own teams.

It's good to play this stuff for people who like to make bets on soccer games. I didn't know a thing about EPL or soccer in general, until I started researching which bets to make. By the end of the year, I could pretty much tell you which teams would or wouldn't score and why. I didn't really focus on which teams would win. . . that's a terrible bet to make in soccer, because of the draw, but I was around 80% accuracy on btts Y/N+o/u2.5.

 

[TheMagnificantOne]

Spoiler: Charts

View attachment 477681

In his fall camp kick-off presser Sunday Heupel was asked by Brent Hubbs if during the offseason Heupel and the staff during their self-scout had found any rhyme or reason why we didn’t fare so well statistically in the 2nd quarters of some of our games. Josh thanked him for pointing that out. lol.

In the first quarter even against the big 3 last year we did pretty well winning 2 out of the 3. Overall we outscored our opponents last year in the 1st quarter in 11 of our 13 games. Only Florida and Ole Miss put more points on the board in the first quarter than we did.

In the 2nd quarter we were outscored in 7 of the 13 games. We lost the 2nd quarter to BGSU, Kentucky, Ole Miss, Pittsburgh, Purdue, Alabama, and Georgia.

We only lost 3 of the 13 3rd quarters, South Carolina, Florida, and Georgia.

We lost 5 of the 13 4th quarters, Vanderbilt, Purdue, Florida, Alabama, and Georgia.

We lost the only overtime period last year to Purdue.

Football, it is often said, is about winning one-on-one matchups. It’s also said that execution is critical. Jim Chaney throughout his time here claimed that he approaches his coordinator role as a chess player. Fans from schools all over often complain that coordinators whether offense or defense are too slow to make adjustments when things aren’t working.

One of the more common critiques of Heupel’s offense is that it is too simple and relies heavily on attacking the defense when it is not ready or properly aligned. It’s thought that the tempo challenges communication on the defensive side of the ball and allows us to take advantage of catching the defense off-guard so to speak. One analyst for On3 who has high regard for the Briles offense claims that Heupel’s version is janky. I had to look up that word. It means poor quality. I mean that’s like his opinion. jmo.

In the 3 Power 5 losses not among the big 3 SEC teams on our schedule it would seem that we lost the game in the 2nd quarter. Overall we won the 1st quarters of those games as well as marginally coming out ahead in the 3rd and 4th quarters. We got blasted by those 3 teams in the 2nd quarter, 57-13. We lost the 2nd quarter to our big 3 permanent SEC opponents by a score of 38-7.

In the 7 games we won we outscored our opponents in the 2nd quarter by a score of 89-48 so it would seem like whatever the issue may be isn’t related to all of our opponents.

In wins, we won 1Q 119-10, 2Q 89-48, 3Q 87-34, and 4Q 56-35.

In losses, we won 1Q 71-41. We lost 2Q 20-95, 3Q 27-41, and 4Q 42-71.

Josh’s answer to Brent was that the 2nd quarter was pretty poignant in some of our games. He said there was no magic potion. He said it was some of the things that we controlled in those ball games, in particular on the offensive side of the football. He talked about everything we’re doing in the weight room and our offseason program and how they’ve related everything to 4 quarters. Honestly, to an extent, it all that sounded like coach-speak to me and I would have been just as pleased if Josh told Brent that what they were doing to address the issue was none of his business. lol..

Here’s what has been said that I think answers Brent’s question. First, in the spring Alex Golesh said that our offense would continue to evolve. Second, it has been said Hooker and the other guys have a much better grasp of our offense heading into year two. Third, it has been said that we are adding option elements to our offense and in fact were practicing that in the spring.

Last year Heupel got a lot of praise for his scheme and rightly so for the results it produced compared to our recent experience on offense but apparently what we were doing last year will only take us so far depending on the quality of our opponent, both players on the field and opposing coaches. I learned from Booger McFarland not to dismiss outside critiques that I may not want to hear. His preseason claim that we would be abysmal in 2017 yielded the worst on-field performance for a Tennessee football team in the entire history of the program. At the time on VolNation McFarland was the devil incarnate. jmo.

I think most critiques from rival fans can be dismissed but if those critiques are coming from someone not wedded to a fanbase I think they’re worth looking into. After I had posted a number of times about our defense and expectations for the coming year on that side of the ball one forum regular noted that no one talks about the offense.

This is my thinking on the offense. Heupel and Golesh are evolving the offense in order to address the issues we faced last year against some of the better teams on our schedule. I think they don’t want too many specifics of that ongoing evolution getting out but they’ve told us that they know we need to make some adjustments and they’ve let us know as much as they can that they have a plan. jmo.

I think across our program deficiencies identified last year by the staff and players are being addressed. We have more talent, more experience and development, a better grasp of our schemes, and have added wrinkles to our schemes to throw at some of the better teams on our schedule which is why I do not think it is pie in the sky wishful thinking that our performance this year has the potential to shock the world. jmo.

Hard to believe you live in Chatt and never heard the word "janky"

 

[Jack Burton]

Hyperbole much?

I’m just poking fun at the cult. I don’t think every discussion has to be taken SO seriously.

“Kentucky plays cupcakes.”

“We play cupcakes, too.”

“BURN THE WITCH!”

 

[TheRain]

 

[Jackcrevol]

All i see is a copperhead.

 

[TheRain]

 

[butchna]

I’m just poking fun at the cult. I don’t think every discussion has to be taken SO seriously.

“Kentucky plays cupcakes.”

“We play cupcakes, too.”

“BURN THE WITCH!”

Sounds like when George Costanza got pissed that the carpet cleaning cult wasn’t interested in converting him.

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

Yep. Our goal should be in the top 25 in recruiting. All the teams above us are wrong on their evaluations. Right

Nope our goal is to sign the best possible players we can based on our evaluations RECOGNIZING we do not get pick and choice. On field production by each class show us that star rankings are PROJECTED potential at the next level but the draft results show us mixed results. On top of that we are probably pursuing MOST of the 5 star pool but only a very limited subset of the 4 star pool not all 3-4 hundred and a tiny fraction of the lower pools based on our evals and perception of being in play.

We and NONE of the teams we are trying to catch are dealing with the masses of kids who are GOOD HS players with a pulse and get a low star ranking each year. Sometimes they are all wrong as shown historically by late bloomers from non ranked teams being drafted ahead of the higher ranked kids. ONE TIME may change their exit school in the mobile future.

Signing day establishes projections, performance measures their accuracy 3-4 years later. Some kids who developed early get the stars but hit their ceilings early and get passed by lower rated later bloomers in college. Just the realities of physical and mental variables. No way for services to project that. All that before you have to factor in injury and attitude issues and depth charts.

I.e. I think several of our current FR class maybe MISSES by the various services. Harrison, Joseph, White and Sampson lead the way for me. Yes I think they have high potential to out perform lots of higher ranked players and HOPEFULLY some on the teams we are chasing in conference. Time will tell.

That is the only way gain ground till we get in the favored priority group of HS stars with on field success.

 

[Enki_Amenra]

Copperhead apparel?

 

[Jackcrevol]

curious if the Black keep watch on those damn treacherous Luxembourgers.