Recruiting Forum Football Talk VI

[butchna]

Idk, you followed it more closely than I did and I don’t like sounding like I’m carrying water for Bonds or any of those guys. He’s a horrible human and I’m not a fan of any of the other guys either. I just think it’s disingenuous to act like MLB wasn’t loving the money and attention during those years.

Who doesn’t? But it was noticeable how Bonds HR season and his subsequent chase of the all-time record wasn’t as heavily hyped. At some point one couldn’t ignore that his head swole to double or triple it’s original size. Selfishly to me was the public pressure from sports yakkin heads for Aaron to pretend everything was kosher and kiss Barry’s artificially enhanced azz…which he refused.

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

You keep saying this. That's your problem, you think your the only one who sees and knows things. We saw it!!, yes, Nebraska was roided all the way up...you're just hung up on only them, though, because they were the poster child for it, AND because no one dominated the way they did; but, it was going on full tilt at other places, as well.

Outside of Nebraska, Miami and FSU ran rough shot in the 80s and 90s. How many titles would FSU had won, if not for...Miami. Also, yes, 95 Nebraska bulldozed everyone; but, 94, they beat who for the National Title?? Miami...and, they only beat them by a touchdown. No bulldozing, because Miami was just as big, just as fast, just as juiced.

In 2012, multiple articles were written about an investigation the AP did on steroid use at the college level. They found that it was RAMPANT. That's an investigation that took part in the 2000s...what do you think was happening in the 80s and 90s??

Quoting...
Controversy arose in 2005, when former Brigham Young University player Jason Scukanec, although never admitting to using steroids himself, stated that steroids were used in many notable Division I programs.[5]

Scukanec, who is the co-host of a sports talk radio show "Primetime With Isaac and Big Suke" on KFXX-AM (AM 1080 "The Fan") in Portland, Oregon, made these statements:

Over the course of my five years at BYU, I have concrete proof of 13 to 15 guys (using steroids), and I would suspect five others...And BYU is more temperate than most programs. Being around NFL and NFL Europe players, they would tell me stuff that blew my mind. I know other schools are worse. I would bet my house you could find at least five guys on every Division I team in the country (using steroids)​

As I said, Nebraska was the poster child for it, with good reason; but, do you, seriously, believe they were the only ones doing it, team wide? Are you seriously, not only thinking that, but saying it...out loud?

I am saying..pretty f'n clearly...that Nebraska did it to a industrial staff-led level...it was ridiculous.

Those other teams put multitudes of guys in the league that dominated after college was over...Cornroiders...not so much, ESPECIALLY when you saw what they looked and played like when at Nebraska.


You can worship at the Nebraska-Tom Osborne altar if you want...I will never.

I'm not arguing about this anymore...I don't give a crap what you think.

 

[Weezer]

Not necessarily about who has the most hits. Bonds had almost 4,000 fewer plate appearances and 1,000 more walks than Rose.

JMO, and though I never saw him bat in person, my vote for best hitter would be Ted Williams.

Another argument against Bonds, IMO, would be career batting average. His was .298.

Ty Cobb is who sits atop that list.

Bonds saw so many walks because he cheated for power. So he created that himself. If he had stayed off the roids, he could have still been one of the greatest players ever, but his quest for power numbers hurt him in more ways than one.

 

[knoxvol52]

Who doesn’t? But it was noticeable how Bonds HR season and his subsequent chade of the all-time record wasn’t as heavily hyped. At some point one couldn’t ignore that his head swole to double or triple it’s original size. Selfishly to me was the public pressure from sports yakkin heads for Aaron to pretend everything was kosher and kiss Barry’s artificially enhanced azz…which he refused.

BOnds was a conceded prick who thought he was above the rules and didn't care who knew it!!!

 

[ReadCT]

Got any examples of someone being sentenced for sitting across the street from a bank with a legally purchased handgun? How about even arrested? How did the police know “intent” without an ATTEMPT?

I suppose I could have been more concise and said, "one can be convicted of 'conspiracy to commit bank robbery'"

Not going to search through all you morans' conviction files her at FBI HQ, so I'll just throw this out:

"A specific action someone plans or carries out does not have to be a crime itself to be considered part of a criminal conspiracy, it only need to play some role in an overall plan that will involve a crime. For example, buying ski masks is not a crime, but if they are being bought as part of a plan to rob a bank, the people buying the masks could still be charged with conspiracy to commit bank robbery.

The crime of conspiracy can be charged whether or not the plan is ever actually carried out, and whether or not the crime is ever committed. The offence depends on the agreement to commit specific actions as part of a plan that involves a crime, rather than any part of the plan actually being carried out.

So, if two people plan to rob a bank and they go to buy ski masks to wear during the robbery, they can be charged with conspiracy to commit bank robbery, even if they never actually rob the bank or even attempt to rob the bank."

Source:
What is criminal conspiracy

 

[Weezer]

Give me Hammerin' Hank over Barry Roids.

 

[drvenner]

He only did it because he seen the success McGwire and Sosa were having.. Bonds didn't like playing second fiddle to anyone...

Totally irrelevant

 

[knoxvol52]

Totally irrelevant

Agree to disagree

 

[drvenner]

Greenies were the only thing that fueled the great Yankees dynasty of the 50’s & 60’s!

Not nearly the same effect as PED

 

[drvenner]

Greenies fueled everyone….. babe took sheep testosterone….. pitchers have used multiple substances on baseballs…. Several players corked their bats…. The list goes on and on.

And none of that is relevant to the argument about PED

 

[drvenner]

Agree to disagree

Sure

 

[drvenner]

Just going to throw this on the fire and then go about my day…

Prime Barry Bonds was the greatest hitter who ever lived, steroids or no, and it’s not particularly close.

Y’all have a good weekend!

I am most upset for Henry Aaron.

 

[volbeast33]

And none of that is relevant to the argument about PED

It depends on what you are arguing.

 

[Weezer]

While we're on the subject of baseball, sad news about Shohei.

 

[drvenner]

I’m not a water carrier for Bonds and don’t personally like him…. I just don’t care that he used steroids…… The only difference between Bonds and those other players is that steroids were better than what the players during those eras were using to cheat…. If a man will take something from a sheep testicle…. He would take steroids.

I'm sorry but that's a silly argument. Were the greenies against the rules? PED sure as hell were and no testing happened because the players union fought it for years and years

 

[butchna]

Agreed. Again, a lot of this seems disingenuous. Turn a blind eye to our sins but get indignant towards the sins of others because theirs were “worse”.

Players getting paid for their talents vs taking drugs to enhance their talents? I’ll wrap myself in that cloak and sleep like a baby.

 

[drvenner]

To reiterate about Bonds HR record, if Ken Griffey JR could have stayed healthy he would be all time HR King and no PED's for him...

Possibly. Still think Williams would have hit more if not for all those missed seasons being a patriot

 

[butchna]

I'm sorry but that's a silly argument. Were the greenies against the rules? PED sure as hell were and no testing happened because the players union fought it for years and years

And we can still legally mash up sheep nuts and inject it…because it doesn’t do anything.

 

[knoxvol52]

Who doesn’t? But it was noticeable how Bonds HR season and his subsequent chade of the all-time record wasn’t as heavily hyped. At some point one couldn’t ignore that his head swole to double or triple it’s original size. Selfishly to me was the public pressure from sports yakkin heads for Aaron to pretend everything was kosher and kiss Barry’s artificially enhanced azz…which he refused.

This conversation shows why no matter if you like Roger Goodell or not the NFL is the best run Professional Sport by far....

 

[85SugarVol]

Never been a proponent of WAR. Seems like something nerds made up to appear smarter. Some great players weren’t a part of winning organizations. Early 90’s Pirates were a machine…even outside Bonds. Mariners weren’t until the middle of the decade.

Sure I get that.

But WAR is an individual metric, a comparison against your peers (the average replacement player of your era).

Ted Williams didn’t play on the juggernaut teams Joe DiMaggio did, but his WAR is much higher.

It’s the best stat we have to compare individual accomplishments across time.

 

[85SugarVol]

Not nearly the same effect as PED

It was a joke.

 

[knoxvol52]

While we're on the subject of baseball, sad news about Shohei.

Yea that just means he will get 525 million instead of 550 million...on his new contract next season...

 

[LaagerVol]

Players getting paid for their talents vs taking drugs to enhance their talents? I’ll wrap myself in that cloak and sleep like a baby.

You’re probably right. I’m sure no UT football players ever juiced.
I do however agree with you and another poster. I hate it for Henry Aaron.

 

[85SugarVol]

I get it, I do. Bonds is hard to argue against...ive got him at #2, SV!! Oh, yeah, I watched clean Bonds...my brother and I almost burnt down the house whenever Bream scored. I was way more into baseball back then at 15,16,17. Honestly, though, I haven't watched watched baseball in many years. Use to be a Braves fan, going back to Dale Murphy. I'll admit, I don't even know what these newer stats are. I'm still stuck in the Avg HR RBI Hits Runs SB days.

Again, I can only go by what I saw, you'll know the numbers better than I...but, Griffey just looked greater, imo...more graceful than anyone else I ever seen, with some of the greatest power ANY OF US have ever seen. As great as Bonds was with the glove, and he was on a level unto himself, Griffey took it to ANOTHER level from THERE, and made it look easy.

Yeah...The Kid, my friend!!! This should tell you how I feel about Griffey Jr...he's one of the five I wish I could go back and watch play again, along with Manning, Bird, Jordan, and Magic.

Griffey was the much more likeable player, and person. Everyone has favorites. Nothing wrong with that.

 

[knoxvol52]

You’re probably right. I’m sure no UT football players ever juiced.
I do however agree with you and another poster. I hate it for Henry Aaron.

Someone will come along and Break Bonds all time HR record. Records that want be touched DiMaggio 56 game hitting streak and Cal Ripken's consecutive games played streak...