Recruiting Forum Football Talk XLI

[drvenner]

[twitter] https://twitter.com/Cover22_/status/927263724683120640[/twitter]

 

[SlappyVol]

Food for thought...Mullen is 24 games above .500 at MSU. Before he got there MSU was a .500 program in their history. (Almost exactly)

We win 68% of our games.

If Mullen out performs schools history at UT like MSU we would all be very happy. (Not sure he could do that obviously)

 

[InVOLuntary]

Many thanks goes out to Doug Dickey for that one

Lol, I agree.

 

[InVOLuntary]

He had agreed to the job then overheard Dickey talking to Floyd about taking it. I am sure when he declined it was not PG material out of his mouth.

Bobby Scott and Tim Floyd were/are friends. Bobby facilitated the call.

 

[MrVolton]

I think there is 2 sides to the draw of great assistants.

1. As you pointed out. $ UT checks that box.
2. Does your head coach or can your head coach attract the great ones? That I don't know about Mullen.

He 'll get better players here than what he can draw at MSU. And I think he's a safe/solid hire. But I don't think he's in the top 3.

He's had a couple of good DC's during his time at Miss State, just couldn't afford to keep them when bigger programs came calling.

 

[BeecherVol]

Bobby Scott and Tim Floyd were/are friends. Bobby facilitated the call.

Met Mr Scott through a mutual friend at the SC game.

Was a pleasure.

 

[kw3953]

Food for thought...Mullen is 24 games above .500 at MSU. Before he got there MSU was a .500 program in their history. (Almost exactly)

We win 68% of our games.

If Mullen out performs schools history at UT like MSU we would all be very happy. (Not sure he could do that obviously)

Croom was a bad mofo tho! :matrix:

 

[Volwark]

Many thanks goes out to Doug Dickey for that one

Man I have a love/hate relationship with Dickey. Our football was great under his stewardship, and he kept our nose clean from the NCAA.

But did he ever sell out our basketball program.

 

[Nashvegas31]

He's had a couple of good DC's during his time at Miss State, just couldn't afford to keep them when bigger programs came calling.

Yep lost Diaz to Miami and Collins to Florida.

 

[volamite86]

Sorry I'm trying to catch up. Is there a report Sumlin out at aTm?

Report saying an anonymous source from another anonymous insider that he's been told he's not coming back and will coach out the rest of the season.

 

[InVOLuntary]

Met Mr Scott through a mutual friend at the SC game.

Was a pleasure.

He's a cool dude. A gentleman for sure.

 

[crazyguy]

Food for thought...Mullen is 24 games above .500 at MSU. Before he got there MSU was a .500 program in their history. (Almost exactly)

We win 68% of our games.

If Mullen out performs schools history at UT like MSU we would all be very happy. (Not sure he could do that obviously)

I’ll take that over an unproven Frost. Sorry Bass.

 

[Chief Vol 13]

Man I have a love/hate relationship with Dickey. Our football was great under his stewardship, and he kept our nose clean from the NCAA.

But did he ever sell out our basketball program.

He knew that if football was right anything else would be gravy. And that if it wasn't right, it didn't matter how good any of the other sports are. He also didn't mind bucking big Jim from my understanding.

 

[ChattaTNVol]

I understand your pessimism regarding Mullen.

However, I would ask two things:

Do you believe Tennessee could offer more money to hire better assistants around Mullen?

Do you think Tennessee allows him to recruit a higher quality athlete?

I'll ask the question like this:

Can Dan consistently beat Saban in recruiting if Dan comes to Tennessee?
Can Dan consistently beat Smart in recruiting if Dan comes to Tennessee?

Fill in LSU, Auburn, Florida, Ohio State, So. Cal, Michigan, Penn State, Oklahoma, Clemson, FSU, Miami, etc.

There are only so many blue chip players to go around and we recruit nationally. In fact, I think there are only 100 top 100 players every year. I think we need 15-20 of the highest blue chips year in and year out to have sustained success against our schedule.

I don't think Dan is a game changer in recruiting. I think he's a better coach than perhaps some of the alternatives but I think his upside is only marginally better in recruiting against our competition. jmo.

I think Gruden is a game changer in recruiting for us and no one else is close. I don't thing Gruden is perfect but I do think he would be the perfect "fit" (hire) for us and our national recruiting landscape. Again, jmo.

I think with Dan, as with some of the other names being mentioned, our floor for wins would rise and I agree with the 9-10 win seasons but I don't at the moment think he or any of the others build us back into the dominant power in the SEC - unless everyone else implodes and we're positioned to take advantage of that. We need to set our goal on challenging Saban now while he is still alive rather than waiting until he kicks the bucket. Some of us also may be gone by the time that day comes around. jmo.

"Soon" is not just a hope. It's also a necessity when you're running out of time.

I think some people may see Dan and a few others as a safe hire while others may see Gruden as more high risk high reward. I'm all in $$-wise on the Gruden hire and sort of blah about most others. I would also step up for John Harbaugh.

Whoever we get most everyone of us will get behind. It's why #EmptyNeyland was a bust and why we boom 3-star recruits with 5-star hearts. We don't have any choice. We're vols and for the most part that's how we behave in situations like this. We give eveyone a chance and we should but again some of us may not have that many chances left to give.

#Tempus Fugit

 

[Catbone]

In fact, I think there are only 100 top 100 players every year.

Source?

 

[Vols4us]

I see our offense looking a lot like 05-08 Florida if we got Mullen. He'd be able to recruit those same type of athletes here. He'd also be given the money to bring a top defensive staff in. I'd say we'll be winning 9 or 10 regular season games on the regular and be in contention for the east pretty much every year.

100% agree. If Mullen had the rosters Butch recruited this past 4+ years they would be stronger, there would be less injuries, there would have been strong skills development as football players, he would have adapted his O to what his roster could do, they would play physical and tough, we would actually have fully developed QB's, the coaching staff would have been more proven for SEC competition because he's been on the big stage - not a wannabe like Butch Jones. IMO add two wins per season on average and that means at least 2 SECCG appearances in the 5 years.

From there we would all be clamoring for a spot in the NC playoff instead of hoping to only lose 7 games this season. If no Gruden - you hire Mullen. Not the sexy hire some posters/fans want. Just a dang good football coach that has his career primed for the big stage. He's just 45 years old and not a candidate for the NFL.

 

[kw3953]

I'll ask the question like this:

Can Dan consistently beat Saban in recruiting if Dan comes to Tennessee?
Can Dan consistently beat Smart in recruiting if Dan comes to Tennessee?

Fill in LSU, Auburn, Florida, Ohio State, So. Cal, Michigan, Penn State, Oklahoma, Clemson, FSU, Miami, etc.

There are only so many blue chip players to go around and we recruit nationally. In fact, I think there are only 100 top 100 players every year. I think we need 15-20 of the highest blue chips year in and year out to have sustained success against our schedule.

I don't think Dan is a game changer in recruiting. I think he's a better coach than perhaps some of the alternatives but I think his upside is only marginally better in recruiting against our competition. jmo.

I think Gruden is a game changer in recruiting for us and no one else is close. I don't thing Gruden is perfect but I do think he would be the perfect "fit" (hire) for us and our national recruiting landscape. Again, jmo.

I think with Dan, as with some of the other names being mentioned, our floor for wins would rise and I agree with the 9-10 win seasons but I don't at the moment think he or any of the others build us back into the dominant power in the SEC - unless everyone else implodes and we're positioned to take advantage of that. We need to set our goal on challenging Saban now while he is still alive rather than waiting until he kicks the bucket. Some of us also may be gone by the time that day comes around. jmo.

"Soon" is not just a hope. It's also a necessity when you're running out of time.

I think some people may see Dan and a few others as a safe hire while others may see Gruden as more high risk high reward. I'm all in $$-wise on the Gruden hire and sort of blah about most others. I would also step up for John Harbaugh.

Whoever we get most everyone of us will get behind. It's why #EmptyNeyland was a bust and why we boom 3-star recruits with 5-star hearts. We don't have any choice. We're vols and for the most part that's how we behave in situations like this. We give eveyone a chance and we should but again some of us may not have that many chances left to give.

#Tempus Fugit

I couldn't agree with this more on the analysis between Gruden and Mullen. Gruden IMMEDIATELY makes Tenn the "in thing" for the next year.

The argument that needs more attention is Mullen vs the up and comers. I don't have a side on that one to be honest. I guess it depends on the up and comer.

 

[ChattaTNVol]

Source?

lol:

 

[BarrythesnoUT]

Let's play this game:

If the VOLS actually get Gruden as their head coach you'll ____________?

wear a big, ****-eating grin around all offseason.

 

[Volnerd]

In fact, I think there are only 100 top 100 players every year.

#Tempus Fugit

Really?

 

[BJHSVol]

Auburn had a 4-year recruiting average around #10 but rode Cam to national championship. Same with Clemson and Deshaun Watson to their championship game lose(and then it took an even bigger leap forward)

I don't think it's too much of a stretch to assume Mullen would get our recruiting around there considering the successes Butch and Dooley and Kiffin had. And he definitely has a track record of finding and coaching some great college QBs.

I think he's proven enough that he should be considered before any up-and-comers

 

[Volwark]

wear a big, ****-eating grin around all offseason.

The offseason would be fun as hell. Even better than an offseason after a NC, IMO.

 

[TruVolFann]

We have talent we have had great recruiting classes under BJ if they could just be coached... Lb is lacking but it isn't all about high profile recruits.
You don't have to have 20 top 100 recruits
Just have to recruit to your style and teach.
Most 3 stars and up have the physical talents
So up mental ability and you can win without the top 100.
Iowa State proves that

 

[Catbone]

I don't see why Mullen couldn't get us to an SEC East championship once per 3-4 years. I think that's all we should be asking for realistically

 

[Kingston Vol]

I'll ask the question like this:

Can Dan consistently beat Saban in recruiting if Dan comes to Tennessee?
Can Dan consistently beat Smart in recruiting if Dan comes to Tennessee?

Fill in LSU, Auburn, Florida, Ohio State, So. Cal, Michigan, Penn State, Oklahoma, Clemson, FSU, Miami, etc.

There are only so many blue chip players to go around and we recruit nationally. In fact, I think there are only 100 top 100 players every year. I think we need 15-20 of the highest blue chips year in and year out to have sustained success against our schedule.

I don't think Dan is a game changer in recruiting. I think he's a better coach than perhaps some of the alternatives but I think his upside is only marginally better in recruiting against our competition. jmo.

I think Gruden is a game changer in recruiting for us and no one else is close. I don't thing Gruden is perfect but I do think he would be the perfect "fit" (hire) for us and our national recruiting landscape. Again, jmo.

I think with Dan, as with some of the other names being mentioned, our floor for wins would rise and I agree with the 9-10 win seasons but I don't at the moment think he or any of the others build us back into the dominant power in the SEC - unless everyone else implodes and we're positioned to take advantage of that. We need to set our goal on challenging Saban now while he is still alive rather than waiting until he kicks the bucket. Some of us also may be gone by the time that day comes around. jmo.

"Soon" is not just a hope. It's also a necessity when you're running out of time.

I think some people may see Dan and a few others as a safe hire while others may see Gruden as more high risk high reward. I'm all in $$-wise on the Gruden hire and sort of blah about most others. I would also step up for John Harbaugh.

Whoever we get most everyone of us will get behind. It's why #EmptyNeyland was a bust and why we boom 3-star recruits with 5-star hearts. We don't have any choice. We're vols and for the most part that's how we behave in situations like this. We give eveyone a chance and we should but again some of us may not have that many chances left to give.

#Tempus Fugit

I'm not trying to argue for Mullen over Gruden. If Gruden wants the job it's his and should be. I'm skeptical of the Grumors and prefer to remain that way until we get him. For that reason I'm trying to advocate for Mullen.

To your recruiting questions - I'll be honest I don't think we'd out-recruit Saban or Smart most years. However, over the past 5 years, Tennessee and Clemson have had the same average class ranking. They compete for national championships and we have competed for life championships. My point being, recruiting isn't the only part of the process. Mullen has been competitive with the 25th-ish ranked class at Mississippi State year in and year out. I think he could consistently beat any competition with the 5th to 10th ranked classes he would get here.

I also think he's one of the best in the country at developing the most important position on the field: Quarterback.