Recruiting Forum Off-Topic Thread II

[Bassmaster_Vol]

Fine Methodist

Lol, why does it matter?

 

[Rishvol]

Lol, why does it matter?

I'm a curious man who needs to find answers to non essential questions. It's a life's passion

 

[BaldBiker]

Well, as soon as you can provide the biblical texts that support your position, we will have something to examine. Do you disagree with what Jesus says in John 8 and John 14? Do you have a different interpretation of those verses?

I'm not going to deal with the emotional questions that you are asking, because that wouldn't accomplish anything. But if you acknowledge the existence of hell, as is clearly taught in the Bible, then you also believe that God has created billions of people whom He knew would never believe the gospel, even tho they would hear it, some countless times throughout their lives. He created them knowing they would never believe, and would face His judgment. No matter what you believe about free will and other issues such as this, if you believe in hell, you have the same problem.

No Bass. I disagree with what you make some words in black and white on a piece of paper, in a book, out to be. Is that clear? Because according to you (not God's, or Jesus's word), there are people in this world who were put here with God's full intention of them going to Hell when they die. No, I do not agree with that...and if that is truly the God we are all suppose to worship, then, thanks, but no thanks.

Luckily for me, I know that is not who God is.


Wait...What do you mean No matter what I believe in free will. Those aren't my words Bass, those are God's words. Can you supply a scripture that disputes what God said? See. That crap works two ways buddy. You throw things like that out there in a way that makes people either have to agree with YOUR interpretation or look like they do not believe in God.

Yes I said your interpretation. You read one sentence and take that one sentence as black and white...that's it...there is nothing else. Read the whole Bible man. Put it all together as a whole.......but most of all, remember......EVERY person alive that has read it, has taken a different personal view of what it means to them. That is part of what it means to have your own personal relationship with God.

I'll say no more on this. I only jumped in because I saw you were chastising a fellow Christian, because they did not see things the exact same way you do. Not a very Christian way to be IMO.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

No Bass. I disagree with what you make some words in black and white on a piece of paper, in a book, out to be. Is that clear? Because according to you (not God's, or Jesus's word), there are people in this world who were put here with God's full intention of them going to Hell when they die. No, I do not agree with that...and if that is truly the God we are all suppose to worship, then, thanks, but no thanks.

Luckily for me, I know that is not who God is.


Wait...What do you mean No matter what I believe in free will. Those aren't my words Bass, those are God's words. Can you supply a scripture that disputes what God said? See. That crap works two ways buddy. You throw things like that out there in a way that makes people either have to agree with YOUR interpretation or look like they do not believe in God.

Yes I said your interpretation. You read one sentence and take that one sentence as black and white...that's it...there is nothing else. Read the whole Bible man. Put it all together as a whole.......but most of all, remember......EVERY person alive that has read it, has taken a different personal view of what it means to them. That is part of what it means to have your own personal relationship with God.

I'll say no more on this. I only jumped in because I saw you were chastising a fellow Christian, because they did not see things the exact same way you do. Not a very Christian way to be IMO.

2 things. One, I have not chastised one person on this board.

Two, these are still emotional arguments. Until we examine Scripture, we will get nowhere. You have produced none, but have disagreed with 2, or I guess you have a different interpretation, but haven't provided what that interpretation is.

You completely misunderstood what I meant when I referenced free will. It is fine if you do not want to continue this conversation.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

i'm a curious man who needs to find answers to non essential questions. It's a life's passion

😂

 

[Vols4us]

I believe that God is merciful, but willing disobedience of, or stubborn denial of the truth when it's presented to you, will cause you to be lost. As for the innocently ignorant, they are in Gods hands, however he judges them is going to be fine with me. I trust him, he knows his own.

I thought you said you weren't eloquent? Well put, brother.

:good!:

 

[OGbabyaviVol]

Bear with me a minute and read the following scriptures, then I will try to tie them all together to explain what I think Bassmaster is trying to say.

30 The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent,
31 because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom he has appointed; and of this he has given assurance to all by raising him from the dead." - Acts 17:30-31

3 This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. 1 Timothy 2:3-4

13 “Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. 14 “For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it. Matthew 7:13-14

21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. 22 “Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many [H]miracles?’ 23 “And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness.’ Matthew 7:21-23


God desires that all people everywhere repent and obey the gospel, because He desires all people to be saved. After all, that is exactly why He sent His own Son to this earth...to be the perfect sacrifice that would allow for forgiveness of sins through obedience to Christ's law.

Now, with that said, here's the part that makes it hard. God is all-knowing. He has foreknowledge to know ahead of time who will actually make the free will choice to obey the gospel and be washed by the blood His Son shed on that cross. Remember God's very own special people in the OT? Rebellious! Always wanted to do what they wanted, although God showed them over and over if they would obey His commands, He would provide for them, keep them safe, and they would be a powerful nation. But they just couldn't help but rebel against Him and disobey. He wanted all of His people to obey but He foreknew they wouldn't.

Fast forward to the dispensation we live under...Christ. God wants everyone to obey the gospel, but knows the rebellious nature of man. He doesn't want that and gives the means that we can have fellowship with Him through His Son. This is where the 2nd set of verses come in. Jesus said the gate is wide and the way broad that leads to destruction and many enter it...the majority is what is sounds like. But the narrow gate and straight way is only entered by few...sounds like the minority. Also, He says many will come to Him on the judgment day thinking they have done all these wonderful things in HIs name, but He tells them to depart he who practice lawlessness. See...God wants all to be saved, but knows the majority will choose to Rebel against His commands versus obeying them and having an eternal home in heaven. I just pray I'm living my life in accordance with His commands and am found to be in the minority who make it to heaven.

Hope this make sense to anyone involved in this discussion.

 

[Glitch]

Fine Methodist

Spanish Inquisition FTW.

 

[Rishvol]

Bear with me a minute and read the following scriptures, then I will try to tie them all together to explain what I think Bassmaster is trying to say.

30 The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent,
31 because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom he has appointed; and of this he has given assurance to all by raising him from the dead." - Acts 17:30-31

3 This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. 1 Timothy 2:3-4

13 “Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. 14 “For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it. Matthew 7:13-14

21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. 22 “Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many [H]miracles?’ 23 “And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness.’ Matthew 7:21-23


God desires that all people everywhere repent and obey the gospel, because He desires all people to be saved. After all, that is exactly why He sent His own Son to this earth...to be the perfect sacrifice that would allow for forgiveness of sins through obedience to Christ's law.

Now, with that said, here's the part that makes it hard. God is all-knowing. He has foreknowledge to know ahead of time who will actually make the free will choice to obey the gospel and be washed by the blood His Son shed on that cross. Remember God's very own special people in the OT? Rebellious! Always wanted to do what they wanted, although God showed them over and over if they would obey His commands, He would provide for them, keep them safe, and they would be a powerful nation. But they just couldn't help but rebel against Him and disobey. He wanted all of His people to obey but He foreknew they wouldn't.

Fast forward to the dispensation we live under...Christ. God wants everyone to obey the gospel, but knows the rebellious nature of man. He doesn't want that and gives the means that we can have fellowship with Him through His Son. This is where the 2nd set of verses come in. Jesus said the gate is wide and the way broad that leads to destruction and many enter it...the majority is what is sounds like. But the narrow gate and straight way is only entered by few...sounds like the minority. Also, He says many will come to Him on the judgment day thinking they have done all these wonderful things in HIs name, but He tells them to depart he who practice lawlessness. See...God wants all to be saved, but knows the majority will choose to Rebel against His commands versus obeying them and having an eternal home in heaven. I just pray I'm living my life in accordance with His commands and am found to be in the minority who make it to heaven.

Hope this make sense to anyone involved in this discussion.

Well put

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

Spanish Inquisition FTW.

👀

 

[Ulysees E. McGill]

I thought you said you weren't eloquent? Well put, brother.

:good!:

I have a small moment every once in awhile.

 

[Vols4us]

Bear with me a minute and read the following scriptures, then I will try to tie them all together to explain what I think Bassmaster is trying to say.

30 The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now he commands all people everywhere to repent,
31 because he has fixed a day on which he will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom he has appointed; and of this he has given assurance to all by raising him from the dead." - Acts 17:30-31

3 This is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior, 4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth. 1 Timothy 2:3-4

13 “Enter through the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is broad that leads to destruction, and there are many who enter through it. 14 “For the gate is small and the way is narrow that leads to life, and there are few who find it. Matthew 7:13-14

21 “Not everyone who says to Me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of My Father who is in heaven will enter. 22 “Many will say to Me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in Your name, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name perform many [H]miracles?’ 23 “And then I will declare to them, ‘I never knew you; depart from Me, you who practice lawlessness.’ Matthew 7:21-23


God desires that all people everywhere repent and obey the gospel, because He desires all people to be saved. After all, that is exactly why He sent His own Son to this earth...to be the perfect sacrifice that would allow for forgiveness of sins through obedience to Christ's law.

Now, with that said, here's the part that makes it hard. God is all-knowing. He has foreknowledge to know ahead of time who will actually make the free will choice to obey the gospel and be washed by the blood His Son shed on that cross. Remember God's very own special people in the OT? Rebellious! Always wanted to do what they wanted, although God showed them over and over if they would obey His commands, He would provide for them, keep them safe, and they would be a powerful nation. But they just couldn't help but rebel against Him and disobey. He wanted all of His people to obey but He foreknew they wouldn't.

Fast forward to the dispensation we live under...Christ. God wants everyone to obey the gospel, but knows the rebellious nature of man. He doesn't want that and gives the means that we can have fellowship with Him through His Son. This is where the 2nd set of verses come in. Jesus said the gate is wide and the way broad that leads to destruction and many enter it...the majority is what is sounds like. But the narrow gate and straight way is only entered by few...sounds like the minority. Also, He says many will come to Him on the judgment day thinking they have done all these wonderful things in HIs name, but He tells them to depart he who practice lawlessness. See...God wants all to be saved, but knows the majority will choose to Rebel against His commands versus obeying them and having an eternal home in heaven. I just pray I'm living my life in accordance with His commands and am found to be in the minority who make it to heaven.

Hope this make sense to anyone involved in this discussion.

Your post reflects your heart and your understanding - which points back to your obedience. Well done.

The word "obey" is viewed so negatively by the world today and in the past. It is seen as a violation of free will. Which only points to the general view of "it's all about me and what I want". The view that "nobody else is perfect and they have no right to impose their view on me or anybody else" causes me to intentionally and unintentionally impose my will on others. Which is what Satan wants as he proved in the garden of Eden with the woman and knowledge event.

To obey your Creator is to grant you the loving freedom to participate in his much bigger plan for his creation with great personal happiness that you would never gain by doing your own thing in the world He created. You simply acknowledge that he has your best interests in mind before you are even born and despite the evil that has been present since the beginning by man's nearly immediate rebellion. With the personal acknowledgment you begin a journey of becoming obedient and turning back to Him as you fail. This is why a remnant always survives the many rebellions toward God by Israel through recorded history. There have always been Hebrews that remained true to Him. His plan as stated in Revelations is for the remnant to accept His Son and be reconciled to Him through the Son's act of grace on the cross. For some this is a no-brainer. For others there is the failure to launch.

That God knows in advance who will and who will not turn to Him is not of importance to our individual decision making. We can only control what we have been given the ability to control, which is our own personal decision and to make others aware (plant the seeds). Then it is simply our decisions to accept or reject. As stated in others posts, God desires none to perish. He wants all of us with him for eternity. He provided the perfect method through the Son to reconcile the sinner (us) back to Him as the Creator of everything. He has provided everything we need to give Him our hearts and obey for the sake of our own happiness and eternal futures.

 

[Glitch]

Well said.

 

[utvolmaniac]

Funny that I waited until Sunday to catch up on this thread.

 

[VolsDoc81TX]

2 things. One, I have not chastised one person on this board.

Two, these are still emotional arguments. Until we examine Scripture, we will get nowhere. You have produced none, but have disagreed with 2, or I guess you have a different interpretation, but haven't provided what that interpretation is.

You completely misunderstood what I meant when I referenced free will. It is fine if you do not want to continue this conversation.

Hi, remember me?
You did attempt to make my religious views and beliefs incorrect...

:hi:

 

[JacketVol]

Hi, remember me?
You did attempt to make my religious views and beliefs incorrect...

:hi:

Paul did say to work out our own salvation. The part people leave out is ............. with fear and trembling.

But, you are to search the Scriptures and listen with your heart and spirit. The things of God confuse and seem foolish to the wise. That is what makes it hard on those who try to figure God out with their human minds. Trying to figure out the creator of something so complex (think DNA for that matter) will always leave us lacking.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

Hi, remember me?
You did attempt to make my religious views and beliefs incorrect...

:hi:

Chastisement and correcting error are not the same. I did not rebuke you sharply or anything close to that. What I want you to do is consider why you believe what you believe. But clearly you don't want to be challenged and that is fine

 

[BJHSVol]

Chastisement and correcting error are not the same. I did not rebuke you sharply or anything close to that. What I want you to do is consider why you believe what you believe. But clearly you don't want to be challenged and that is fine

And everyone wants to talk about Darth being condescending...

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

I guess that we now live in a world where if we challenge someone's belief, especially their religious beliefs or interpretations, we are seen as being condescending and chastising others. Is truth not important enough to have real conversations and challenge one another's beliefs? I have no problem with you guys challenging me on what I believe, as long as we are able to examine our world views, our interpretations, and our authorities.

I sincerely apologize to anyone who has taken me in a negative fashion. I promise that my attitude has remained the same from beginning to end, and it is a concern for the gospel, and for all of you to know the gospel.

 

[Vols4us]

I guess that we now live in a world where if we challenge someone's belief, especially their religious beliefs or interpretations, we are seen as being condescending and chastising others. Is truth not important enough to have real conversations and challenge one another's beliefs? I have no problem with you guys challenging me on what I believe, as long as we are able to examine our world views, our interpretations, and our authorities.

I sincerely apologize to anyone who has taken me in a negative fashion. I promise that my attitude has remained the same from beginning to end, and it is a concern for the gospel, and for all of you to know the gospel.

No need to apologize to anybody IMO. You have presented the Word. It challenges, convicts, and confirms on its own without any help from us. It was the subject of the recent pages in the thread, which is Off-Topic. If folks don't like what's said and don't want to have their personal beliefs challenged - they shouldn't post or challenge the statements.

 

[Vols4us]

OGbabyaviVol - FWIW - Matthew 7 has been the subject of our pastor's sermon for the past two weeks. He will finish the chapter next week.

Also FWIW, a 55 year old man (really nice guy) that had been in church all of his life and had accepted Christ at a young age came forward. He stated he was personally convicted that he had only checked the boxes of going forward, being baptized, living a good life. He now realizes that he needed to settle 7:21-23 and fully enter into that relationship with the Lord. You could see the burden fall from his shoulders right on the spot. He now knows that he knows.

 

[Darth_Shiveman]

Dewey had a pretty interesting take on it all


http://www.dailymotion.com/video/xzpb5k_dewey-the-ant-hill-god_fun

 

[VolsDoc81TX]

Chastisement and correcting error are not the same. I did not rebuke you sharply or anything close to that. What I want you to do is consider why you believe what you believe. But clearly you don't want to be challenged and that is fine

So you on your mile high horse knows "the truth"?

If you took the self-righteous lecture out of your schtick, you might be more tolerant of others.
Instead you are the know all be all internet prophet.

My Christianity is one of tolerance.
Yours does not appear to be.

You keep directing my to examine myself and my beliefs.
Maybe I did that decades ago.
I am in my happy place.
You make it extremely difficult to "Love thy neighbor as thyself."

I totally agree with BaldBiker.

 

[Bassmaster_Vol]

So you on your mile high horse knows "the truth"?

If you took the self-righteous lecture out of your schtick, you might be more tolerant of others.
Instead you are the know all be all internet prophet.

My Christianity is one of tolerance.
Yours does not appear to be.

You keep directing my to examine myself and my beliefs.
Maybe I did that decades ago.
I am in my happy place.
You make it extremely difficult to "Love thy neighbor as thyself."

I totally agree with BaldBiker.

It's funny that you keep accusing me of self righteousness when I have repeatedly said in this forum that the gospel calls us to forget our works, I.e., our self righteousness and trust in Christ alone. I'm sorry that "your Christianity" does not match with what the Bible clearly teaches. But we can't even have that discussion because you will not actually present any textual reasons for your beliefs. You just continue to belittle me with false accusations

 

[VolsDoc81TX]

It's funny that you keep accusing me of self righteousness when I have repeatedly said in this forum that the gospel calls us to forget our works, I.e., our self righteousness and trust in Christ alone. I'm sorry that "your Christianity" does not match with what the Bible clearly teaches. But we can't even have that discussion because you will not actually present any textual reasons for your beliefs. You just continue to belittle me with false accusations

Your interpretation does not necessarily make it infallible TRUTH.
Each should interpret the Bible and come to their own conclusions and interpretations.
There are many ways to get there as long as God and Jesus are the destination.