Religious debate (split from main board)

[OrangeEmpire]

Are you sure?

 

[bam15]

Ok, you will have to explain the whole guns are evil thing.

Personal experience?

Being the big, evil, scary Democrat I am, I guess it's human nature.

 

[BeecherVol]

I am still confused as to how one is supposed to believe the word of God to then be able to understand the word of God...

Especially in the case of some some of us skeptics who originally believed the word of God, and then fell away as we read the word of God in the context of other sorts of knowledge.

Think of it like science.

Do you understand science better now, or after your 6th grade science class?

You a were learning the basics/foundation then, and your understanding grew as you studied more.

 

[KingNick865]

Most of the people I know, parents, relatives, friends, say that the KJV is the one to read. Any other one is incorrect.

 

[T-TownVol]

The thing that is mind-boggling to me is this:

Your Presbyterian friend will tell you what he thinks

Your Baptist friend will tell you what he thinks

Your Catholic friend will tell you what he thinks

etc.

Read the KJV

No! That's not correct, read the NIV! No, RSV! No, ESV!

Technically who is correct?

The Holy Spirit....ask him...he will guide you.
I attend a church with the Baptist name on the sign, but I try my best to answer questions as to what the Bible says, not what the Baptist Church says.

 

[T-TownVol]

Presumably, won't they also be in Heaven if they are Christians?

Is materialism more important than eternal security?

I know it's human nature.

They will and I will have an eternity with them in heaven. Life here on earth is a gift and I plan to enjoy it while I am here on earth.
It is pretty simple really. Too many people over think all this salvation stuff. I did for 35 years.
I thanks God every day that he lifted the burden of being "religious" from my life.

 

[BeecherVol]

No.

But I also do not believe he would have committed acts of self-defense. He let God direct him, and I do not believe God would be one who condones acts of violence. Hence God lets you live to spread the gospel, not do acts which I do not believe are satisfactory - violence, self-defense.

Do you let yourself die? Or does God decide when you die? Presumably I'm going off the inference that God isn't factoring in non-Christians and those who decide a firearm and worldly affairs are more important than Heaven.

I think this is where we disagree.
What is violence? Defending yourself? Or your family maybe?
Or provoking a situation in which you take life, for something other than defending yourself?

I tend to think it is the later.

 

[bam15]

Think of it like science.

Do you understand science better now, or after your 6th grade science class?

You a were learning the basics/foundation then, and your understanding grew as you studied more.

I don't necessarily agree with the argument. You studied works that you may have not agreed with, correct?

Non-Christians can understand biblical works just as well as Christians. Thomas Jefferson studied the Bible devoutly - he was a non-Christian.

 

[T-TownVol]

Are you sure?

yep......Bible tells us that our ways are not his ways.....pretty plain and simple to me

 

[Oldvol75]

I am a Baptist minister. Being a Baptist will not save you, as well as any other denomination will not save you. Only a personal relationship with Jesus Christ can do that. Denominations are for one thing and one thing only, fellowship with like minded believers. I preach out of the KJV, but only because I am use to it. I do use others versions to study by at times. I judge a Bible by Romans 1, for personal reasons.

 

[bam15]

I think this is where we disagree.
What is violence? Defending yourself? Or your family maybe?
Or provoking a situation in which you take life, for something other than defending yourself?

I tend to think it is the later.

I agree, but killing someone is killing someone, cold-blooded or not.

I'm personally a fan of Tolstoy if that tells you anything.

 

[bam15]

They will and I will have an eternity with them in heaven. Life here on earth is a gift and I plan to enjoy it while I am here on earth.
It is pretty simple really. Too many people over think all this salvation stuff. I did for 35 years.
I thanks God every day that he lifted the burden of being "religious" from my life.

Interesting.

 

[KingNick865]

Here's another question I have....

Is the Bible God's word, or man's interpretation of God's word? I hear people say that it's "God's word" all the time, but God himself didn't write it?

 

[Oldvol75]

Interesting.

Its because T-Town found a personal relationship and left "religion" behind, its simple really. (sorry for speaking for you here T)

 

[bam15]

I am a Baptist minister. Being a Baptist will not save you, as well as any other denomination will not save you. Only a personal relationship with Jesus Christ can do that. Denominations are for one thing and one thing only, fellowship with like minded believers. I preach out of the KJV, but only because I am use to it. I do use others versions to study by at times. I judge a Bible by Romans 1, for personal reasons.

I agree.

But I hear that this is not true from many people. Those who propagate that acts of Baptism are required for salvation, etc.

Would you preach out of the NIV? Even if it changes certain words? Doesn't it damage the initial true meaning 'KJV?'

 

[BeecherVol]

I don't necessarily agree with the argument. You studied works that you may have not agreed with, correct?

Non-Christians can understand biblical works just as well as Christians. Thomas Jefferson studied the Bible devoutly - he was a non-Christian.

So what your saying is, there is no way I could fully understand evolution, because I do not believe it to be true?

 

[T-TownVol]

I am a Baptist minister. Being a Baptist will not save you, as well as any other denomination will not save you. Only a personal relationship with Jesus Christ can do that. Denominations are for one thing and one thing only, fellowship with like minded believers. I preach out of the KJV, but only because I am use to it. I do use others versions to study by at times. I judge a Bible by Romans 1, for personal reasons.

Will Too!!!!(but only if you sit on the back row)

 

[Oldvol75]

Here's another question I have....

Is the Bible God's word, or man's interpretation of God's word? I hear people say that it's "God's word" all the time, but God himself didn't write it?

God's Word, God wrote the first 10 Commandments, which Moses threw. Form that point on, God gave the information directly to man to write down. Perhaps you should look at what the early Jewish scribs did and the care they took to translate everything correctly without mistakes.

 

[T-TownVol]

Its because T-Town found a personal relationship and left "religion" behind, its simple really. (sorry for speaking for you here T)

:hi:

 

[bam15]

So what your saying is, there is no way I could fully understand evolution, because I do not believe it to be true?

No, but you can study the 'theory' of evolution.

Those who deny Christianity most likely study it, but simply don't believe it to be true.

 

[salutethehill]

I agree.

But I hear that this is not true from many people. Those who propagate that acts of Baptism are required for salvation, etc.

Would you preach out of the NIV? Even if it changes certain words? Doesn't it damage the initial true meaning 'KJV?'

Would you agree that obedience is required for salvation? How about the act of believing? Is Jesus my personal savior, or did he come to save the world?

 

[KingNick865]

God's Word, God wrote the first 10 Commandments, which Moses threw. Form that point on, God gave the information directly to man to write down. Perhaps you should look at what the early Jewish scribs did and the care they took to translate everything correctly without mistakes.

But that's the thing. Old English wasn't the first language that the Bible was written in. You can have screw-ups in the translation that can render something that was written in one language and meant one thing, mean a completely different thing in another language.

 

[T-TownVol]

No, but you can study the 'theory' of evolution.

Those who deny Christianity most likely study it, but simply don't believe it to be true.

guess what...God covers that in the Bible.....he tells us that "not all will come to believe"

 

[Oldvol75]

I agree.

But I hear that this is not true from many people. Those who propagate that acts of Baptism are required for salvation, etc.

Would you preach out of the NIV? Even if it changes certain words? Doesn't it damage the initial true meaning 'KJV?'

KJV is written in "old english", for example the NKJV is written in more modern english. I haven't found any place where word meaning has been changed from old english to new english. And to answer your question, I have, I use a different translation alot espically for Bible study nights.

 

[BeecherVol]

I agree, but killing someone is killing someone, cold-blooded or not.

I'm personally a fan of Tolstoy if that tells you anything.

Bam, Im from Cheatham Co., TN.
Who is this Tolstoy feller?

As far as "killing" goes. Its not hard to find the difference in 1st degree murder, and taking a life to save your own or your familiy.