Republicans Who Have Ruined Their Political Careers Over Trump

#52
#52
lawgator1 said:
Ok, but what is he doing policy wise that's different so as to be worth selling out on the more traditional tenets of the GOP?
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The GOP sold out it's traditional tenets years ago, they just paid lip service to them. They took their voters for granted and they have paid for that mistake.

Policy wise, I abhor the out of control spending but that was going to happen no matter who was elected. I like the changes in tax policy, I like his trade policy with China and other nations (we'll be better off in the long run), and I like the fact that no new wars have been started.
 
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#53
#53
n_huffhines said:
You're just deflecting. Things have changed with Trump. That's the point. You're trying to play BS semantic games. The fact of the matter is Trump has transformed attitudes and positions among R's in undesirable ways. Own it, or hide from it. It makes no difference to me.
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Undesirable to who ? If you are going to have a spine , then stop faking it and find it . That’s what the Rs finally found . I don’t how they survived all these years with that propensity to shove their head in the sand every time a Dem would screech at them about something .
 
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#55
#55
hog88 said:
The GOP sold out it's traditional tenets years ago, they just paid lip service to them. They took their voters for granted and they have paid for that mistake.

Policy wise, I abhor the out of control spending but that was going to happen no matter who was elected. I like the changes in tax policy, I like his trade policy with China and other nations (we'll be better off in the long run), and I like the fact that no new wars have been started.
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#56
#56
n_huffhines said:
You treat this like it's entertainment. It's not about what you enjoy, it's about making things better for Americans. I asked you what good does it do and your answer is "I like a fighter. Most people like a fighter." JFC
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It’s all entertainment . You and a couple of others have the best seat in the house . You sit straddling a fence b!tching about both sides like harpies telling everybody what’s good or bad but never having to throw your hat in the ring . Oh I may vote for some guy out of Arizona , Utah , Wisconsin, Montana with no hope of even sniffing the Oval Office . “ at least he’s this or that “ ... blah blah blah . Be hot or cold don’t be luke warm , nobody like tepid water .

Odd ..I thought that was all just in my head . I’ve got to work on that inside outside voice thing more .
 
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#63
#63
The debate you guys are having is silly to me. You aren't arguing traditional GOP actionable policies have changed because of Trump. You are mostly arguing the traditional GOP talking points on policy have changed. If my wife is chronically unfaithful while constantly telling me she loves me and will be faithful, more attention will I pay to what she will do not what she will say.
I find it refreshing. At least they stopped lying to me about responsible spending, small government, self reliance, and family values. The pretense is stripped away. Good. My only hope is more people will see what they really are. They are lying, self serving politicians.
Politics isn't about making life better for Americans. It is about making life better for politicians.
 
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#64
#64
McDad said:
The debate you guys are having is silly to me. You aren't arguing traditional GOP actionable policies have changed because of Trump. You are mostly arguing the traditional GOP talking points on policy have changed. If my wife is chronically unfaithful while constantly telling me she loves me and will be faithful, more attention will I pay to what she will do not what she will say.
I find it refreshing. At least they stopped lying to me about responsible spending, small government, self reliance, and family values. The pretense is stripped away. Good. My only hope is more people will see what they really are. They are lying, self serving politicians.
Politics isn't about making life better for Americans. It is about making life better for politicians.
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And life is good for them.
 
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#65
#65
McDad said:
The debate you guys are having is silly to me. You aren't arguing traditional GOP actionable policies have changed because of Trump. You are mostly arguing the traditional GOP talking points on policy have changed. If my wife is chronically unfaithful while constantly telling me she loves me and will be faithful, more attention will I pay to what she will do not what she will say.
I find it refreshing. At least they stopped lying to me about responsible spending, small government, self reliance, and family values. The pretense is stripped away. Good. My only hope is more people will see what they really are. They are lying, self serving politicians.
Politics isn't about making life better for Americans. It is about making life better for politicians.
Click to expand...

You're making a completely different point than me. I don't disagree with what you're saying. My focus is not on the politicians. I'm calling out the voters. They're the ones who have changed. Either they stopped caring about responsible government or they stopped pretending they care about responsible government. Same with family values. Etc.
 
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#66
#66
n_huffhines said:
You're making a completely different point than me. I don't disagree with what you're saying. My focus is not on the politicians. I'm calling out the voters. They're the ones who have changed. Either they stopped caring about responsible government or they stopped pretending they care about responsible government. Same with family values. Etc.
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You mean those voters who love their gargantuan military, their farm subsidies, and zealous pursuit of soft drug users?
 
#67
#67
McDad said:
You mean those voters who love their gargantuan military, their farm subsidies, and zealous pursuit of soft drug users?
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I personally know "small government" Republicans who are against farm subsidies and the war on drugs who are unwavering in their Trump support. Republicans used to blast W for not being conservative enough. Remember the blowback from him saying that he's a "compassionate conservative"? Remember the grief he got over unfunded medicare liability? Remember how he got blasted for the bailout? Things have changed.

It's easy to reconcile a large military with ideas about responsible government. It's impossible to reconcile "Who the hell cares about the budget?" with ideas about responsible government.
 
#68
#68
n_huffhines said:
I personally know "small government" Republicans who are against farm subsidies and the war on drugs who are unwavering in their Trump support. Republicans used to blast W for not being conservative enough. Remember the blowback from him saying that he's a "compassionate conservative"? Remember the grief he got over unfunded medicare liability? Remember how he got blasted for the bailout? Things have changed.

It's easy to reconcile a large military with ideas about responsible government. It's impossible to reconcile "Who the hell cares about the budget?" with ideas about responsible government.
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I personally know them, too. I have a hard time knowing when we (the general we of this forum) allow anecdotal evidence.

There are a few of us true blue folks posting here. In retrospect, the Republican party left me before I was even born.
 
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#69
#69
McDad said:
I personally know them, too. I have a hard time knowing when we (the general we of this forum) allow anecdotal evidence.

There are a few of us true blue folks posting here. In retrospect, the Republican party left me before I was even born.
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In this case, IDK what to call on other than anecdotal evidence.

I can't even tell that we disagree. Are you saying Trump hasn't dramatically changed R voter attitudes/responses to certain components of politics? I thought that's the one thing that everybody agreed upon, that he was a powerful persuader. Trade protectionism was a deal-breaker for small government conservatives in the 90's. Now they don't care.
 
#70
#70
n_huffhines said:
In this case, IDK what to call on other than anecdotal evidence.

I can't even tell that we disagree. Are you saying Trump hasn't dramatically changed R voter attitudes/responses to certain components of politics? I thought that's the one thing that everybody agreed upon, that he was a powerful persuader. ****ing free trade was a deal-breaker for small government conservatives in the 90's. Now they don't care.
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No I don't think Trump changed voter attitudes at all, the IDGAF about spending or personal issues attitude was there and had been there for a long time. Voters were tired of candidates that pretended they still cared.
 
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#71
#71
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#72
#72
n_huffhines said:
In this case, IDK what to call on other than anecdotal evidence.

I can't even tell that we disagree. Are you saying Trump hasn't dramatically changed R voter attitudes/responses to certain components of politics? I thought that's the one thing that everybody agreed upon, that he was a powerful persuader. Trade protectionism was a deal-breaker for small government conservatives in the 90's. Now they don't care.
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If we dug deep enough, I'm sure we could find nuances of disagreement.
What I am saying is nothing has effectively changed in DC. The voters are fickle. It is a popularity contest. Have they abandoned their principles or are they simply invested in victory? Perhaps it is inevitable the country continues to slide towards big, centralized, socialistic government as it has since the election of Washington. (I caught some of the biopic on History channel last night about him).
I feel what your saying though. People here didn't like my opinion against tariffs. They didn't like my opposition to the border wall. They agree spending is out of control but guard their own sacred cows vehemently.
 
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#73
#73
McDad said:
If we dug deep enough, I'm sure we could find nuances of disagreement.
What I am saying is nothing has effectively changed in DC. The voters are fickle. It is a popularity contest. Have they abandoned their principles or are they simply invested in victory? Perhaps it is inevitable the country continues to slide towards big, centralized, socialistic government as it has since the election of Washington. (I caught some of the biopic on History channel last night about him).
I feel what your saying though. People here didn't like my opinion against tariffs. They didn't like my opposition to the border wall. They agree spending is out of control but guard their own sacred cows vehemently.
Click to expand...

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#74
#74
n_huffhines said:
You're making a completely different point than me. I don't disagree with what you're saying. My focus is not on the politicians. I'm calling out the voters. They're the ones who have changed. Either they stopped caring about responsible government or they stopped pretending they care about responsible government. Same with family values. Etc.
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We have changed and for the better. Have you ever agreed with someone you voted for on every single issue?
 
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