Richmond is taking down Confederate statues: Is this the end for other Confederate memorials?

[Boca Vol]

Mizzou Students Demand Removal of ‘Racist’ Thomas Jefferson Statue

Student protesters at the University of Missouri have circulated a petition that calls on Mizzou officials to remove a “racist” Thomas Jefferson statue from campus grounds.

The Jefferson statue at the University of Missouri is not the only historical monument to be targeted by leftists in the aftermath of George Floyd’s death. A bust of George Washington’s head was knocked over last week at George Washington University. Some students took to Twitter to praise the vandalism.

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Mizzou Students Demand Removal of 'Racist' Thomas Jefferson Statue​

Can't wait for a movement to rename the city.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

Mizzou Students Demand Removal of ‘Racist’ Thomas Jefferson Statue

Student protesters at the University of Missouri have circulated a petition that calls on Mizzou officials to remove a “racist” Thomas Jefferson statue from campus grounds.

The Jefferson statue at the University of Missouri is not the only historical monument to be targeted by leftists in the aftermath of George Floyd’s death. A bust of George Washington’s head was knocked over last week at George Washington University. Some students took to Twitter to praise the vandalism.

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Mizzou Students Demand Removal of 'Racist' Thomas Jefferson Statue​

Who gives a rat's ass about anything in Columbia Missouri?

 

[NurseGoodVol]

The “colorblindness” idea is trash and has been for a while now. If you’re struggling to understand why, look it up. The “argument” I was referring to is the argument that these statues should come down, as DynaLo or whoever was acting like no one cared until right now, which is a complete lie.

Unfortunately for you I don't struggle with this. I have no need to look this up. A person's actions tell me their character. I don't care about the statues being moved. Move em. There's a place, I'm sure, where they are valued by someone.
When all the monuments are gone and hidden will the character of men change? Can we guarentee that no person hurts another for greed, hatred of a race, biases will be wiped out... Right?

 

[NashVol11]

Unfortunately for you I don't struggle with this. I have no need to look this up. A person's actions tell me their character. I don't care about the statues being moved. Move em. There's a place, I'm sure, where they are valued by someone.
When all the monuments are gone and hidden will the character of men change? Can we guarentee that no person hurts another for greed, hatred of a race, biases will be wiped out... Right?

I’m not sure anything in this post responds to an argument I’ve actually made, especially the blatant strawman idea that removing statues is supposed to singlehandedly “guarantee” the end of racism

 

[tvolsfan]

It’s the go-to argument. People are legitimately scared into thinking that Confederate statues are the only thing holding our history together

It’s too bad we all forgot about the Nazi’s due to the lack of Hitler statues.

 

[carlos86]

Are you a liberal that works to get Trump elected because you were born stupid?

Idk why those names angered you that much. Unless you enjoy simping for confederates and traitors.

 

[davethevol]

Those things have literally nothing to do with each other

They do in that BLM is protesting for equal treatment. Or are they protesting for preferential treatment?

 

[davethevol]

I see people are still clinging to the delusion that removing statues is erasing history.

Keep in mind that many people see those statues as a reminder of those that fought an oppressive government, not of slavery.

 

[zeppelin128]

I would like to offer the following suggestions for renaming bases:
Fort Printer Go Brrr
.

I approve.

 

[McDad]

I approve.
View attachment 285901

I did that one with you in mind.

 

[MontyPython]

I mean he only wrote that racist Declaration of Independence and that George Washington what did ever do to deserve a monument or have a capital city or state named after him?

The Declaration of Independence... for white people. Meanwhile, he owned black slaves.

"We hold these truths to be self-evident, that all men are created equal, that they are endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable Rights..."

 

[Rickyvol77]

The Declaration of Independence... for white people. Meanwhile, he owned black slaves.

So Jefferson is a nazi racist that needs to be purged too? Washington, etc.

 

[zeppelin128]

Why not get private corporations to sponsor the bases like sports arenas? Generate a little revenue.

Fort Chick Fil A
Fort Papa Johns
Fort Walmart
Fort State Farm
Fort Phizer
Fort Boeing

Libertarians after reading your idea.

 

[MontyPython]

So Jefferson is a nazi racist that needs to be purged too? Washington, etc.

Do you deny that he was a slave owner?

 

[Rickyvol77]

Do you deny that he was a slave owner?

no, but a lot of people were back then, he also called slavery a blot on history, and wrote about what he hated about it, as well as stopped the slave trade in Virginia

 

[NashVol11]

Keep in mind that many Confederate sympathizers see those statues as a reminder of those that fought an oppressive government, not of slavery.

FYP

 

[hog88]

Libertarians after reading your idea.

Can't be. I don't hear any bitching, complaining, indignation and no one is claiming "they didn't vote for that".

 

[MontyPython]

no, but a lot of people were back then, he also called slavery a blot on history, and wrote about what he hated about it, as well as stopped the slave trade in Virginia

So, he thought it was morally wrong to own slaves... yet, he owned slaves.

All men are created equal... except for black people.

What a guy.

What's acceptable back in the day isn't necessarily acceptable today. While Jefferson obviously contributed greatly to our nation, he was a hypocrite slave owner. If I were black, I'd have an issue with his statues at, say, the University of VA.

 

[Rickyvol77]

So, he thought it was morally wrong to own slaves... yet, he owned slaves. What a guy.

What's acceptable back in the day isn't necessarily acceptable today. While Jefferson obviously contributed greatly to our nation, he was a hypocrite slave owner. If I were black, I'd have an issue with his statues at, say, the University of VA.

All men have flaws even great ones. And yet Thomas Jefferson is one of the greatest men who ever lived. And you well you post sometimes

 

[hog88]

So, he thought it was morally wrong to own slaves... yet, he owned slaves.

All men are created equal... except for black people.

What a guy.

What's acceptable back in the day isn't necessarily acceptable today. While Jefferson obviously contributed greatly to our nation, he was a hypocrite slave owner. If I were black, I'd have an issue with his statues at, say, the University of VA.

So much dumb going around some got on you.

 

[MontyPython]

So much dumb going around some got on you.

Heh. I've got plenty of stupid to start out with.

We've actually been having an ongoing debate at work for like the past 6 months (pre-CV19) about whether one can separate the product/services of a person and their beliefs/actions. Example: HP Lovecraft. One dude at work thinks his art is the bomb, and has collected prints and books about the guy for years. Now he's come to understand that the man was a unrepentant white supremacist. Can we separate and accept his art (great) for what it is, despite the fact that the man was fundamentally flawed (racist)? Where do you draw the line on this sort of thing? Say you had a beautiful original painting by Hitler. Do you burn it as a statement against everything the man stood for, or do you hide the fact that it was by him, or do you openly just accept the art for what it is - regardless of the artist?

 

[LouderVol]

Come on. The idea that we need Confederate statues as some kind of visual aid for history, and that they’re the only thing preventing us from forgetting our entire historical record, is alarmist garbage

Based on modern realities.
As someone pointed out look at any of the cultural revolutions. The stuff destroyed was forgotten. You can even look at the saying "history is written by the victors".

Removing the statues dehumanizes them and disconnects them from an area. Meaning when some version of the Civil War is tought the kids will have no way to understand these were real people. They will have no way to recognize that someone like me can end up a very bad person. "Oh it's only because they were racists. Even though I am also denying people their rights it's ok because I am not like those racists."

To.come full circle, if its meaningless to have bad statues up, why have good ones? Why have any visual reminder when you can just set the narrative however you want?

 

[LouderVol]

Yes I’d rather watch NCIS than read about how incompetent and racist of Jeb Stuart, Braxton Bragg, John Bell Hood and Lewis Benning were.

Interesting to hear your thoughts on how they were incompetent? Evil, misguided, delusional, whatever else, sure? Incompetent? Hard to see that argument.

 

[LouderVol]

These sound much better.

Fort Benning > Ft. Sherman
Fort Bragg > Ft. Howard
Fort Lee > Ft. Thomas
Fort Hood > Ft. Buford
Fort Polk > Ft. Butler
Fort Pickett > Ft. Hancock
Fort AP Hill > Ft. Sheridan
Camp Beauregard > Cp. Anderson
Fort Gordon > Ft. Gibbon
Fort Rucker > Ft. Chamberlain

Tongue in cheek or do you just not know history for most of those? It always amazes me that Americans dont remember how most of the northern generals gained their stars working out west hunting down the Native Americans.

 

[utvolpj]

Tongue in cheek or do you just not know history for most of those? It always amazes me that Americans dont remember how most of the northern generals gained their stars working out west hunting down the Native Americans.

Most think Teddy R was a war hero too