Rick Barnes discussion (merged)

#6,501
#6,501
VolGee4 said:
I don’t disagree with much of that, but that doesn’t change the fact that we were deeper. Just the fact that he could move Burns to the pen. When you get double elimination, it’s a different deal in baseball.
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This. The basketball tournament is just a different animal. The talent gap between teams is slim and its single elimination the whole way. One bad shooting might, one bad officiating call is all it takes to put an end to the season. It’s a wonderful sporting event that I love to watch but not really an effective means of determining the best team.
 
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#6,503
#6,503
VolGee4 said:
I don’t disagree with much of that, but that doesn’t change the fact that we were deeper. Just the fact that he could move Burns to the pen. When you get double elimination, it’s a different deal in baseball.
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Burns from the bullpen was a cheat code. Credit Tony for getting him here (even though it was for a short while), but having a guy that dominant come out of the pen was incredibly rare.
 
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#6,504
#6,504
BisonVol said:
I’ll give you Pearl despite the messy ending of his time here, but Devoe and Green both pale in comparison to Barnes, especially Devoe. Even Green never would have won had crazy Kevin not handed him the keys to a Cadillac.

Barnes is at worst the third best coach in the program’s history.
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Devoe early was as good if not better than he tallied off. He was making tournaments when it was a small field. But yes Barnes is probably our 3rd best coach. If he makes an elite 8 he will be 2 and if he can make a final four he could possibly be first. He is also getting paid to do that. Vitello and Pearl were not. We just can not keep losing to lesser teams each and every year. It is time for that to end. If we get beat by Kansas in an elite 8 game then oh well, but losing to a MsSt level team in second round or sweet 16 just is not going to cut it. I would have been less concerned if MsSt had an amazing night like Nebraska did against Purdue. But they are not that good, really didn’t play good and we felt like taking a half off. We have done this every year and it gets magnified when its always in March to team like that. Wondering out loud. If you had Olivier tonight for a little extra size if that makes our team better in these type of games. I know he was not great and was all or nothing. But should not have let him go without adequate replacement. Seems we need him more than we need an extra guard spot in Gainey.
 
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#6,505
#6,505
BisonVol said:
Burns from the bullpen was a cheat code. Credit Tony for getting him here (even though it was for a short while), but having a guy that dominant come out of the pen was incredibly rare.
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Yes but Tony had to make that call and it cost us Burns services this season because he only wanted to be a starter. Greatness requires what Tony did, but man that had to be tough knowing what the outcome could be.
 
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#6,506
#6,506
volplaya8 said:
Devoe early was as good if not better than he tallied off. He was making tournaments when it was a small field. But yes Barnes is probably our 3rd best coach. If he makes an elite 8 he will be 2 and if he can make a final four he could possibly be first. He is also getting paid to do that. Vitello and Pearl were not. We just can not keep losing to lesser teams each and every year. It is time for that to end. If we get beat by Kansas in an elite 8 game then oh well, but losing to a MsSt level team in second round or sweet 16 just is not going to cut it. I would have been less concerned if MsSt had an amazing night like Nebraska did against Purdue. But they are not that good, really didn’t play good and we felt like taking a half off. We have done this every year and it gets magnified when its always in March to team like that. Wondering out loud. If you had Olivier tonight for a little extra size if that makes our team better in these type of games. I know he was not great and was all or nothing. But should not have let him go without adequate replacement. Seems we need him more than we need an extra guard spot in Gainey.
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Respectfully, I quit reading after you said Ms St isn’t that good. We’re both stubborn guys grounded in our views who won’t see eye to eye on this which is fine. Hopefully this is the year we make a deep run.
 
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#6,508
#6,508
BisonVol said:
Respectfully, I quit reading after you said Ms St isn’t that good. We’re both stubborn guys grounded in our views who won’t see eye to eye on this which is fine. Hopefully this is the year we make a deep run.
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Well that’s on you…if you think MSST is a bonafide Sweet 16 team and we won’t face similar or better team to get there then I am not sure what to say.
 
#6,509
#6,509
volplaya8 said:
Well that’s on you…if you think MSST is a bonafide Sweet 16 team and we won’t face similar or better team to get there then I am not sure what to say.
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That’s where understanding a college basketball season comes in. MSU is top 25 KenPom team, a conference opponent, and it was on the road. Great college teams lose these type games literally every week during the season. It’s not unusual. UConn lost 6 of 8 in January/February last year. It happens.
 
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#6,511
#6,511
VolGee4 said:
That’s where understanding a college basketball season comes in. MSU is top 25 KenPom team, a conference opponent, and it was on the road. Great college teams lose these type games literally every week during the season. It’s not unusual. UConn lost 6 of 8 in January/February last year. It happens.
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And when we make the tournament run UConn does then it will all go away…but when we continually do this over and over each and every year with the same result then it is harder and harder to deal with and take…again MsSt is not a great team nor did they play a great game like Nebraska did last night vs Purdue…Tennessee came out flat, basically didn’t play for a half…tried to win a game in one half and came up short…we lost because of ourselves, not because of the other team or refs…it’s repeat after repeat with Barnes…he is a good coach, i guess he will soon be a hall of fame coach…but there is room for improvement that many can see and the more years that go by it seems that improvement is not coming and we are what we are…just a solid, good basketball team…I want to be better than that…I expect to be and Barnes is paid a top salary to be
 
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#6,513
#6,513
I'm not mad at all. MST is good and on the road, but I do think we are a bit overrated at this point. College basketball is pretty wide open, but a lot of the better teams have very good big men. We struggle mightily against that. Santi just isn't clicking at all so far. Gainey fell off a cliff. Dillione barely sees the court. Awaka can't defend anyone taller than him, etc.

JJJ has put together some great all around performances, but he still isn't a go to scorer, which isn't a knock at all. Shew, ZZ is on one. He and Knecht could carry you further than you should go if they are on. Aidoo has spurts of brilliance, but those bigger guys give him fits. Jahmai is a great energy defender with some offensive spurts thrown in. It's just very inconsistent. I think we are ~15 ish in the country. A 3-4 seed who goes to the sweet 16. Which is a good season imo, but I think some of the early season hooplah is going to leave fans disappointed.
 
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#6,515
#6,515
Ttucke11 said:
I'm not mad at all. MST is good and on the road, but I do think we are a bit overrated at this point. College basketball is pretty wide open, but a lot of the better teams have very good big men. We struggle mightily against that. Santi just isn't clicking at all so far. Gainey fell off a cliff. Dillione barely sees the court. Awaka can't defend anyone taller than him, etc.

JJJ has put together some great all around performances, but he still isn't a go to scorer, which isn't a knock at all. Shew, ZZ is on one. He and Knecht could carry you further than you should go if they are on. Aidoo has spurts of brilliance, but those bigger guys give him fits. Jahmai is a great energy defender with some offensive spurts thrown in. It's just very inconsistent. I think we are ~15 ish in the country. A 3-4 seed who goes to the sweet 16. Which is a good season imo, but I think some of the early season hooplah is going to leave fans disappointed.
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Exactly…but isn’t this almost every season under Barnes..it’s the exact point…
 
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#6,518
#6,518
volplaya8 said:
Yeah wonder where our 25 pt a game potential freshmen are…hopefully he portals to us next year
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Hubbard isn’t a 25 point per game freshman. He just had a great night tonight. Those literally doesn’t exist outside of rare NBA lottery talents. I’m just stunned at your repeated bad arguments.
 
#6,519
#6,519
berryvol said:
Hubbard isn’t a 25 point per game freshman. He just had a great night tonight. Those literally doesn’t exist outside of rare NBA lottery talents. I’m just stunned at your repeated bad arguments.
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Again read 25 pt potential…do we have any freshman that can score 15 in a game?
 
#6,520
#6,520
berryvol said:
Hubbard isn’t a 25 point per game freshman. He just had a great night tonight. Those literally doesn’t exist outside of rare NBA lottery talents. I’m just stunned at your repeated bad arguments.
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you need reading literacy in a bad way
 
#6,521
#6,521
volplaya8 said:
Did MsSt play great or did the vols play bad for 20 mins and we cost ourselves the game. Did we get beat or did we beat ourselves…simple as that. We beat ourselves tonight.
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Wasn’t Vescovi sitting with foul trouble for most of those 20 minutes? Wasn’t he guarding Hubbard when his production dropped off?
 
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#6,522
#6,522
Thunder Good-Oil said:
Wasn’t Vescovi sitting with foul trouble for most of those 20 minutes? Wasn’t he guarding Hubbard when his production dropped off?
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To be honest you need to be able to trust a super senior with 2 fouls…he also gave us next to nothing tonight…on the other hand you didn’t mind playing Jonas with 4 fouls and getting him fouled out before crunch time so why can’t you trust Vescovi to play with 2 fouls in first half and keep the game closer
 
#6,525
#6,525
volplaya8 said:
Again read 25 pt potential…do we have any freshman that can score 15 in a game?
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We do not and almost every team in P6 basketball does not. Your list of complains is growing. Our 3+5 losses will be 10 losses and make us a 4 seed. We beat ourselves tonight. We will get bounced from the tourney early. We don’t have freshmen with the “potential” to score 25 a game. What’s next?
 
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