Santorum

#126
#126
MUR73 said:
OK, leave morality out of the equation for now then, just from a realistic not ideological only standpoint, since the inception of mutually assured destruction has been implicated and basically all/most of the worlds ecomonies are directly tied together and our exporting/importing of oil/goods, etc.... isn't inaction the same as a form of action because either way our way of life, security, economy, trade, well being is going to be greatly affected/changed in this event and just sitting idly by would lead to events/policies/ trade pricing being dictated to us somewhat against our will by another outside force/countries actions?
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We have plenty of resources in this country or in our hemisphere.
 
#127
#127
MUR73 said:
OK, leave morality out of the equation for now then, just from a realistic not ideological only standpoint, since the inception of mutually assured destruction has been implicated and basically most/all of the worlds economies are directly tied together and our exporting/importing of oil/goods, etc.... isn't inaction the same as a form of action because either way our way of life, security, economy, trade, well being is going to be greatly affected/changed in this event and just sitting idly by would lead to events/policies/ trade pricing being dictated to us somewhat against our will by another outside force/countries actions?
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OK...
 
#128
#128
From Reason's FB page:

Yesterday in Concord, New Hampshire, a member of Students for Sensible Drug Policy (SSDP) asked Rick Santorum, "As a champion of family values and keeping America strong, would you continue to destroy families by sending nonviolent drug offenders to prison?" Santorum's response: "Uh...wow...the federal government doesn't do that." That will come as a surprise to the nearly 100,000 drug offenders in federal prison, who account for almost half of all inmates.
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Rick Santorum Does Not Know Drug Offenders Have Families - Hit & Run : Reason Magazine
 
#129
#129
Rasputin_Vol said:
We have plenty of resources in this country or in our hemisphere.
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I greatly agree with this point. By i am talking about the here and now and how we do not manufacture things here any more due to global markets, overregulations, tax loopholes, for instance doesn't it take appox a decade just to approve/build a new oil refinery due to regulation.

In other words we aren't/don't utilize our resources.
 
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#131
#131
MUR73 said:
OK, leave morality out of the equation for now then, just from a realistic not ideological only standpoint, since the inception of mutually assured destruction has been implicated and basically most/all of the worlds economies are directly tied together and our exporting/importing of oil/goods, etrc.... isn't inaction the same as a form of action because either way our way of life, security, economy, trade, well being is going to be greatly affected/changed in this event and just sitting idly by would certainly lead to events/policies/ trade pricing being dictated to us somewhat against our will by another outside force/countries actions?
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I don't kill persons or encourage persons to be killed so that I can receive some beneficial trade-value.
 
#132
#132
MUR73 said:
I greatly agree with this point. By i am talking about the here and now and how we do not manufacture things here any more due to global markets and the fact that it takes appox a decade just to approve/build a new oil refinery due to regulation.

In other words we aren't/don't utilize our resources.
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You are making the case to remove the regulations immediately. I don't think the GOP establishment has the same sense of urgency, though.
 
#133
#133
therealUT said:
I don't kill persons or encourage persons to be killed so that I can receive some beneficial trade-value.
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I don't think you know what you would do if the worst case scenerio occured and you could not afford something as simple as food/medicine for your family.
 
#134
#134
MUR73 said:
I don't think you know what you would do if the worst case scenerio occured and you could not afford something as simple as food/medicine for your family.
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Misdirected anger. Your anger should be at the people and institutions that have left us less self-sufficient over the last 40 years, not some blockade halfway around the world.
 
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#135
#135
MUR73 said:
I don't think you know what you would do if the worst case scenerio occured and you could not afford something as simple as food/medicine for your family.
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Hypothetically speaking, if your good ole American neighbor down the street had those things for your family wouldn't it make more sense to just go jack him up for it?

(Basically just saying you need to be very mindful of where this argument takes you)
 
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#136
#136
hndog609 said:
Hypothetically speaking, if your good ole American neighbor down the street had those things for your family wouldn't it make more sense to just go jack him up for it?

(Basically just saying you need to be very mindful of where this argument takes you)
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He's basically saying we need to fight wars halfway around the globe for oil when we have resources in this hemisphere. Hell, I might halfway respect that position if they were willing to send troops to Mexico or Venezuela. :unsure:
 
#137
#137
Rasputin_Vol said:
He's basically saying we need to fight wars halfway around the globe for oil when we have resources in this hemisphere. Hell, I might halfway respect that position if they were willing to send troops to Mexico or Venezuela. :unsure:
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In #129 responding to you I think you are correct. I was commenting on #133 and his query to TRUT.
 
#138
#138
Rasputin_Vol said:
He's basically saying we need to fight wars halfway around the globe for oil when we have resources in this hemisphere. Hell, I might halfway respect that position if they were willing to send troops to Mexico or Venezuela. :unsure:
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why Venezuela? Not like they can sell that stuff to just anyone
 
#139
#139
utvolpj said:
why Venezuela? Not like they can sell that stuff to just anyone
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Not sure what you mean, but I'm butting in. He's talking about their rich oil supply and the fact that they are unfriendly, and close geographically.
 
#140
#140
MUR73 said:
I don't think you know what you would do if the worst case scenerio occured and you could not afford something as simple as food/medicine for your family.
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I do know that I will not kill someone. I will kill myself before I ever kill someone in a situation in which I am not purely reacting for my own self-defense.
 
#141
#141
therealUT said:
I do know that I will not kill someone. I will kill myself before I ever kill someone in a situation in which I am not purely reacting for my own self-defense.
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How close are you to the idea that even SD does not justify killing?
 
#142
#142
hndog609 said:
How close are you to the idea that even SD does not justify killing?
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Closer than most; I am not sure I would even use the term 'justify' as much as I would use the term 'excuse'.

Personally, I find that if one is in a situation in which they can consciously think through and deliberate before killing someone in 'self-defense' then they are in a situation in which they can choose to die. That said, I no more expect myself nor anyone else to make that choice; though, I see that as the righteous and highest moral choice in said situation.

This, of course, if a moral area that I find extremely complex and am still working to figure out. I think I have a moral obligation to extend my life; however, does that exceed my moral obligation not to kill someone else. Again, this is something I have to work through.
 
#144
#144
therealUT said:
Closer than most; I am not sure I would even use the term 'justify' as much as I would use the term 'excuse'.

Personally, I find that if one is in a situation in which they can consciously think through and deliberate before killing someone in 'self-defense' then they are in a situation in which they can choose to die. That said, I no more expect myself nor anyone else to make that choice; though, I see that as the righteous and highest moral choice in said situation.

This, of course, if a moral area that I find extremely complex and am still working to figure out. I think I have a moral obligation to extend my life; however, does that exceed my moral obligation not to kill someone else. Again, this is something I have to work through.
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Situations will obviously vary tremendously but in any case of "classic" SD I rather put the onus on the other person. I don't want to kill anyone. However, if I'm at home and someone breaks in I will use lethal force. In my mind this circumstance in entirely of their making, little different in function than them playing Russian Roullette and having the hammer fall on the loaded chamber. It's all happening because of their decisions and actions, not mine.

Life can get awfully muddled though.
 
#145
#145
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Aohgrn1peA&feature=g-u&context=G2b84cb1FUAAAAAAAAAA[/youtube]
 
#149
#149
rick_santorum_is_rocky.jpg


Whoever the Republican nominee is, I will always think of their opponent in 2012 as a

















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#150
#150
Rasputin posts a video in which Santorum pretty much says he disagrees with the principles that America was founded upon and GS responds by implying that he will still vote for Santorum over Obama because Obama is the traitor. Am I following this correctly?
 
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