Senate passes stem cell bill

#26
#26
(volmanjr @ Jul 18 said:
and if we had ways to keep that from happening would it be wrong to not stop it if we could? How about this? We have a military mission to perform and we know that if we proceed soldiers will die. We can control that situation by not engaging the enemy, is it wrong to not fight?
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One big difference - military service is voluntary.
 
#30
#30
(Orangewhiteblood @ Jul 18 said:
Yes, because they're people.
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Prove to me that an unborn baby is not a person. Upon proving this, I might listen to your point.
 
#34
#34
Ok, a Doctor in a third world country needs penicillian to keep his patients from dieing and the quickest source is the black market, does he use the stolen property to save those lives or take the high moral ground and wait for proper channels to send him the medicine?
 
#36
#36
Prove to me that an unborn baby is not a person. Upon proving this, I might listen to your point.
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Prove that they are. I'm not saying that they are or not, I'm just saying that there are valid points on both sides, it is not cut and dried.
 
#37
#37
(volmanjr @ Jul 18 said:
Ok, a Doctor in a third world country needs penicillian to keep his patients from dieing and the quickest source is the black market, does he use the stolen property to save those lives or take the high moral ground and wait for proper channels to send him the medicine?
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Keep in mind what the bill is about - stem cell research is not outlawed. What the pres said he would not support is releasing the existing embryos and federally funding stem cell research.

I mention that because the last 2 analogies have involved someone breaking the law to save an individual person with a known cure. Stem cell research is not illegal.
 
#38
#38
(volmanjr @ Jul 18 said:
it is not cut and dried.
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That's my problem with it though. I don't know either. And if it's not cut and dried, I know which side I'd rather err on.
 
#42
#42
(GAVol @ Jul 18 said:
That's my problem with it though. I don't know either. And if it's not cut and dried, I know which side I'd rather err on.
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Just to add to that if I may: The "cures" from stem cell research are not guaranteed. They may be called stem CELLS but they have to be taken from an entity and that entity is destroyed in the case of embryos. Stem cells can also come from umbilical cords and clearly both entities attached are "live".

That said I not comfortable saying lets destroy thousands, millions of things that we aren't if they are "live" or not to potentially find cures.
 
#43
#43
(volinbham @ Jul 18 said:
At what point do you believe life begins - what is the transformation point?
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That's not my call, it's not W's call either.
 
#44
#44
(volinbham @ Jul 18 said:
Just to add to that if I may: The "cures" from stem cell research are not guaranteed. They may be called stem CELLS but they have to be taken from an entity and that entity is destroyed in the case of embryos. Stem cells can also come from umbilical cords and clearly both entities attached are "live".

That said I not comfortable saying lets destroy thousands, millions of things that we aren't if they are "live" or not to potentially find cures.
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Plus, there's no money in the cure. It's all in the treatments. We don't want to mess with big business pharmaceutical companies..
 
#45
#45
(Orangewhiteblood @ Jul 18 said:
That's not my call, it's not W's call either.
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It is his call since he has decision power over the decision to use taxpayer dollars to destroy embryos for research. It is also the Senate's call to over turn his decision.
 
#46
#46
W says he's against it because "murder is wrong".. Am I the only one who finds that statement a bit ironic?
 
#47
#47
(volinbham @ Jul 18 said:
It is his call since he has decision power over the decision to use taxpayer dollars to destroy embryos for research. It is also the Senate's call to over turn his decision.
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That doesn't mean he knows anything about it..
 
#48
#48
(Orangewhiteblood @ Jul 18 said:
Plus, there's no money in the cure. It's all in the treatments. We don't want to mess with big business pharmaceutical companies..
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I think you forgot to put the "I'm just kidding of course" emoticon after that statement :blush2:
 
#49
#49
(Orangewhiteblood @ Jul 18 said:
That doesn't mean he knows anything about it..
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It's the type of question that we may never know the answer too. Still, it is his call by virtue of the position he is in.
 
#50
#50
We as a society kill thousands of "live" things every day: animals, trees, various fruits and vegetables and for things quite less noble than research.
 
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