Senators Call for the Grounding of the 737 MAX

#252
#252
So no senior execs at Boeing noticed that Capt Fortner didn't advise the FAA of the existence of an entirely new flight control system. It's hard to believe that conspiracy charges and more arrests won't be coming.
 
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#253
#253


2023-04-14_04-03-13.png
 
#261
#261
Wireless1 said:
That's what happens when a bunch of "business" people start to run a "technology" company. They think the value is in the product rather than the results.
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AM64 said:
There's nothing a business major or financial "wizard" can't kill.
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The best business leaders I’ve seen are the ones that put talented people in the right position, use their frontline employees as a resource and then get out of their way and turn them loose to let them do what they know how to do. Don’t know why it’s such a hard concept for some…maybe because their ego outweighs their leadership capabilities.
 
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#262
#262
Vol737 said:
The best business leaders I’ve seen are the ones that put talented people in the right position, use their frontline employees as a resource and then get out of their way and turn them loose to let them do what they know how to do. Don’t know why it’s such a hard concept for some…maybe because their ego outweighs their leadership capabilities.
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Absolutely agree, and those people really are few. You get the feeling it's insecurity of a sort - that if the person at the top doesn't have all the answers and make all the decisions, then he/she must not be the only person qualified for the job.

My other big issue is the extreme desire for "efficiency" - all organisms and organizations need a little "fat" for those times when things don't go quite as planned. There's also a bad habit of thinking that business is all important and people are there to feed it, rather than understanding that without a healthy country with people who have the means and desire to purchase goods and services, then there is no market for business. That's where people at the top fail - they just don't see the importance of everyone else whether a consumer or an employee, and a lot really can't seem to connect the dots between consumer and employee.
 
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#266
#266
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#268
#268
Matt2496 said:
I haven't seen the one on Netflix, but I have watched several others on youtube. It truly is egregious what went on in the design of this aircraft.
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not only that, the intentional puropse of covering up the new fcs feature and not telling pilots it was even there, so they wouldnt have to retrain mass of piolts, blamed the pilot for the Japan crash, etc
check it out if you can.
 
#269
#269
Orangeburst said:
not only that, the intentional puropse of covering up the new fcs feature and not telling pilots it was even there, so they wouldnt have to retrain mass of piolts, blamed the pilot for the Japan crash, etc
check it out if you can.
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It highlights the dangers of trying to cut-costs at the expense of safety and just general good engineering design. The MCAS only relying on a single AoA sensor is just unfathomable from a design perspective. In digital control system design you typically always have a 2/3 logic for Boolean variables (such as an on/off level switch) or a median value from 3 sensors so that if a sensor fails or gives a junk value the control system just ignores it.

Boeing's MCAS design was just astronomically bad.
 
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#270
#270
Matt2496 said:
It highlights the dangers of trying to cut-costs at the expense of safety and just general good engineering design. The MCAS only relying on a single AoA sensor is just unfathomable from a design perspective. In digital control system design you typically always have a 2/3 logic for Boolean variables (such as an on/off level switch) or a median value from 3 sensors so that if a sensor fails or gives a junk value the control system just ignores it.

Boeing's MCAS design was just astronomically bad.
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Isn’t that a departure from the way previous Boeing’s were designed? I always understood there to be 3 AoA sensors and the 3 values were constantly compared. If one was giving wild readings compared to the other 2, that one outlier would be discarded and not reported. If they somehow all started providing inconsistent readings, the pilots are warned.
 
#271
#271
DC_Vol said:
Isn’t that a departure from the way previous Boeing’s were designed? I always understood there to be 3 AoA sensors and the 3 values were constantly compared. If one was giving wild readings compared to the other 2, that one outlier would be discarded and not reported. If they somehow all started providing inconsistent readings, the pilots are warned.
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Previous iterations of the 737 and even the 737 Max had 2 AoA sensors. The problem is that the MCAS originally only relied on one of them, which is just beyond stupid design. The new, updated MCAS system relies on both and deactivates if the difference is too high.

Airbus on the other hand does it right and has a superior design (no surprise there). They actually use the voting based on 3 AoA sensors that you are describing.
 
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#272
#272
Matt2496 said:
Previous iterations of the 737 and even the 737 Max had 2 AoA sensors. The problem is that the MCAS originally only relied on one of them, which is just beyond stupid design. The new, updated MCAS system relies on both and deactivates if the difference is too high.

Airbus on the other hand does it right and has a superior design (no surprise there). They actually use the voting based on 3 AoA sensors that you are describing.
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Interesting, I didn’t know that. Thanks.
 
#273
#273
#275
#275
Well, they did get some alarms, but I have to admit that this would have probably been a hard thing to trace down on maintenance (at least in my mind). It wasn't a door but a door plug that failed.

Door plug that blew out of Boeing plane is found in Portland backyard

Alaska Airlines recorded that the plane’s auto-pressurization fail light — which is designed to signal failures in controlling cabin pressure — had illuminated on three flights in the weeks before Friday’s incident. Those reports, on Dec. 7, Jan. 3 and Jan. 4, prompted tests and a reset from maintenance, Jennifer Homendy, chair of the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB), said in a news conference Sunday evening.
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Flight 1282 was on its way to Ontario, Calif., from Portland before it was forced to return to the airport after the door plug — an exit that is paneled off, usually because it is deemed optional in safety regulations — separated from the plane midair, shortly after takeoff.
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