Should Clowney sit?

#76
#76
Vercingetorix said:
They benefit from it because that's all there is. If college football didn't exist, the NFL would have to run some kind of a developmental league to evaluate talented but young players, and they'd "benefit" from that instead. There's no reason the NFL's only scouting and development mechanism has to be "prospects playing for free while going through the motions of being college students."
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That's assuming all college players are being groomed for the NFL. They're not. Some have to get an education & get a real job. If the NFL was running developmental leagues where would it start? Pee wee ball?
 
#77
#77
govols/cc said:
That's assuming all college players are being groomed for the NFL. They're not. Some have to get an education & get a real job. If the NFL was running developmental leagues where would it start? Pee wee ball?
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Baseball scouts find prospects, don't they? If college baseball shut down tomorrow, MLB would be fine. Football could work the same way. Some players might choose to sign a pro contract with a team and go right to work in the developmental league; other players would sign up for college and all that entails. You can get to the majors either way in baseball; it should work the same way in football. The only reason is doesn't is that college football is older than the NFL so the NFL has never felt like they needed to pay for it.

Barring radical overhaul like that, which obviously will never happen, I don't know what the answer is. All I know is that the system we've got forces players like Marcus Lattimore and Nerlens Noel to assume all that risk themselves, while all the grownups around them get rich and they themselves get "paid" with a scholarship they don't need. And that's crap.
 
#78
#78
Vercingetorix said:
They benefit from it because that's all there is. If college football didn't exist, the NFL would have to run some kind of a developmental league to evaluate talented but young players, and they'd "benefit" from that instead. There's no reason the NFL's only scouting and development mechanism has to be "prospects playing for free while going through the motions of being college students."
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The free market says college football is what the people want and what the players are doing they're not doing for free. If the NFL could have a viable minor league they would.
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#79
#79
Vercingetorix said:
Baseball scouts find prospects, don't they? If college baseball shut down tomorrow, MLB would be fine. Football could work the same way. Some players might choose to sign a pro contract with a team and go right to work in the developmental league; other players would sign up for college and all that entails. You can get to the majors either way in baseball; it should work the same way in football. The only reason is doesn't is that college football is older than the NFL so the NFL has never felt like they needed to pay for it.

Barring radical overhaul like that, which obviously will never happen, I don't know what the answer is. All I know is that the system we've got forces players like Marcus Lattimore and Nerlens Noel to assume all that risk themselves, while all the grownups around them get rich and they themselves get "paid" with a scholarship they don't need. And that's crap.
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There is no market for D league football. The NFL has looked at it. How many leagues have failed in football? What u call players playing for free just isn't the case either. Training, nutrition system, structure, room and board, education and the opportunity to audition for the NFL.
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#80
#80
VolBeef88 said:
There is no market for D league football. The NFL has looked at it. How many leagues have failed in football? What u call players playing for free just isn't the case either. Training, nutrition system, structure, room and board, education and the opportunity to audition for the NFL.
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please, these has been argued many times and players that bring in millions of the schools and the ncaa are not compensated fairly. people get rich off these kids and they see nothing from it other than a scholarship.
 
#81
#81
whocaresgobobcats said:
please, these has been argued many times and players that bring in millions of the schools and the ncaa are not compensated fairly. people get rich off these kids and they see nothing from it other than a scholarship.
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They don't have to play college ball and get all the benefits from doing so. So why do they do it? That's right they do it for the EXACT reasons I laid out.
The NFL has every right to set requirements for their industry just like every other industry.
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#82
#82
volfanngaytorland said:
This is my thought. From a strictly business standpoint, he has everything to lose. It will never happen (and rightfully so) but I would hate for him to blow a knee and lose millions.
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He'd also likely lose that top spot (and millions) for not playing football for a full year
 
#84
#84
If he wasn't willing to play ball, I'd pull his scholarship. People forget that scholarships are a form of payment. They provide the student with an education, food, shelter, etc. These guys have it made. I always hope when somebody receives a scholarship that they appreciate it, work hard, get an education, and leave with skills needed to contribute to society.
 
#85
#85
TrueOrange said:
He'd also likely lose that top spot (and millions) for not playing football for a full year
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He's going top 3, easy. If he stays in shape, matter of fact he could train for year for the combine. He could hurt his chances by playing like a scared cat for fear of getting injured.

I would sit.
 
#86
#86
Jeepkuntry said:
If he wasn't willing to play ball, I'd pull his scholarship. People forget that scholarships are a form of payment. They provide the student with an education, food, shelter, etc. These guys have it made. I always hope when somebody receives a scholarship that they appreciate it, work hard, get an education, and leave with skills needed to contribute to society.
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Yeah, ok.
 
#88
#88
College players need to be paid. It's bush league that universities can make millions off of their likeness and then not give them anything in return.
 
#89
#89
DarthVisor said:
College players need to be paid. It's bush league that universities can make millions off of their likeness and then not give them anything in return.
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If so then the players should pay for their training, conditioning, education, room and board, marketing the players via allowing them to showcase their talents on national telebvision etc... The list goes on and on.
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#90
#90
VolBeef88 said:
The free market says college football is what the people want and what the players are doing they're not doing for free. If the NFL could have a viable minor league they would.
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Minor league baseball is barely "viable," yet MLB teams pay for it anyway because of the value they get in developing their own players. They do it because it's good for their major-league teams, not because there's a market for it.

The NFL has never shown any interest in running a below-the-radar developmental league for college-age players. Running a league for players who weren't good enough in Europe was about marketing, not player development.
 
#91
#91
VolBeef88 said:
There is no market for D league football. The NFL has looked at it. How many leagues have failed in football? What u call players playing for free just isn't the case either. Training, nutrition system, structure, room and board, education and the opportunity to audition for the NFL.
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You are praising the system that exists for a benefit that's largely derived because that's the only system that exists.
 
#92
#92
Vercingetorix said:
Minor league baseball is barely "viable," yet MLB teams pay for it anyway because of the value they get in developing their own players. They do it because it's good for their major-league teams, not because there's a market for it.

The NFL has never shown any interest in running a below-the-radar developmental league for college-age players. Running a league for players who weren't good enough in Europe was about marketing, not player development.
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Actually the NFL most definately has looked at a D league multiple times. If it was viable they would have one. Period. They have no loyalty to the NCAA and NFL owners hate feling beholding to colleges. The NFL is about money and if the business model would work they would have one.
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#94
#94
The reality is this. There's no developmental league for the NFL because there's no business model in which it works.
Also the NFL put the 3 years removed from high school in order to allow the players to develop physically. For evey one kid physically ready the league there are thousands who aren't. The NFL doesn't require college at all. The players use the school just as the schools use the players. To think otherwise is foolish.
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#95
#95
VolBeef88 said:
Actually the NFL most definately has looked at a D league multiple times. If it was viable they would have one. Period. They have no loyalty to the NCAA and NFL owners hate feling beholding to colleges. The NFL is about money and if the business model would work they would have one.
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To my knowledge the NFL has never looked seriously at the possibility of running a D-league for 18-21 year old players. A post-college D-league for guys who couldn't quite make a roster is irrelevant to the "what should we do about Lattimore/Noel?" argument.

And I get why they wouldn't. 99 percent of players aren't physically ready to play in the NFL until they're over 20. Unfortunately this leaves the 1 percent with a tremendous financial risk that they have to shoulder alone.
 
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#96
#96
Vercingetorix said:
To my knowledge the NFL has never looked seriously at the possibility of running a D-league for 18-21 year old players. A post-college D-league for guys who couldn't quite make a roster is irrelevant to the "what should we do about Lattimore/Noel argument."

And I get why they wouldn't. 99 percent of players aren't physically ready to play in the NFL until they're over 20. Unfortunately this leaves the 1 percent with a tremendous financial risk that they have to shoulder alone.
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They have looked at it. In fact they've had committees study it several times. The problem is the business model just won't work.
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#97
#97
VolBeef88 said:
The reality is this. There's no developmental league for the NFL because there's no business model in which it works.
Also the NFL put the 3 years removed from high school in order to allow the players to develop physically. For evey one kid physically ready the league there are thousands who aren't. The NFL doesn't require college at all. The players use the school just as the schools use the players. To think otherwise is foolish.
Posted via VolNation Mobile
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The idea that top players like Clowney "use" schools when the money is so lopsided is just silly. Clowney was an obvious future millionaire coming out of high school. But he had to pick a college and spend three years playing for free to get there. He's not "using" South Carolina at all. Unless of coure you're making the argument that the NFL would never have found him otherwise, which is silly.

What about Nerlens Noel? He would have been a multimillionaire without the NBA's arbitrary age limit. Now he's going to make less money and he's got a painful rehab to go through, all because he had to play for a scholarship that he doesn't need. Did he "use" Kentucky?
 
#98
#98
Vercingetorix said:
To my knowledge the NFL has never looked seriously at the possibility of running a D-league for 18-21 year old players. A post-college D-league for guys who couldn't quite make a roster is irrelevant to the "what should we do about Lattimore/Noel?" argument.

And I get why they wouldn't. 99 percent of players aren't physically ready to play in the NFL until they're over 20. Unfortunately this leaves the 1 percent with a tremendous financial risk that they have to shoulder alone.
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If Clowney didn't wanna risk anything & was a shoe in for millions of dollars then just sit out until you're eligible. However some do play the game because that's what they love & it's worth the risk.
 
#99
#99
Vercingetorix said:
The idea that top players like Clowney "use" schools when the money is so lopsided is just silly. Clowney was an obvious future millionaire coming out of high school. But he had to pick a college and spend three years playing for free to get there. He's not "using" South Carolina at all. Unless of coure you're making the argument that the NFL would never have found him otherwise, which is silly.

What about Nerlens Noel? He would have been a multimillionaire without the NBA's arbitrary age limit. Now he's going to make less money and he's got a painful rehab to go through, all because he had to play for a scholarship that he doesn't need. Did he "use" Kentucky?
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Clowney did not have to go to college. He could have just trained and prepared to enter the draft in 3 years. But guess what? He didn't do that for a reason. The school gave him an opportunity to showcase his talent, therefore he did use the school.
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#100
#100
Vercingetorix said:
The idea that top players like Clowney "use" schools when the money is so lopsided is just silly. Clowney was an obvious future millionaire coming out of high school. But he had to pick a college and spend three years playing for free to get there. He's not "using" South Carolina at all. Unless of coure you're making the argument that the NFL would never have found him otherwise, which is silly.

What about Nerlens Noel? He would have been a multimillionaire without the NBA's arbitrary age limit. Now he's going to make less money and he's got a painful rehab to go through, all because he had to play for a scholarship that he doesn't need. Did he "use" Kentucky?
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How much money did Nerlens Noel make from ESPN doing three episodes on UK basketball, with him being one of the stars?

$0
 
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