So Legendary Coach Pat Summit was forced out...

#178
#178
You can't let someone with dementia be in charge of a decision like that.
Doesn't matter who you are or the great things you have done.

This dialogue about a legend, with dementia, leaving on her own terms is crazy. She couldn't remember play calls people. And this was well before these meetings. You act as if they put her on the street. She is and will be involved with the university as long as she can or wants to be.

Just more people looking for blood in a blood thirsty world.
 
#179
#179
Advol said:
If this suit or info was brought forward by Coach, I would agree with you.

NOT Jennings. She is using Coach to make a point about her firing.... Jennings is wrong and sick on this process.
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Yep. This is truly pathetic and shows what a piece of garbage she is.
 
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#181
#181
Look I'm in no way suggesting Pat has made the mistakes that Paterno made. But the situation is reminiscent of when PSU fans gave Paterno so much unquestioned power that he could dictate when he left. When you can no longer do the job you are paid to do, it's the AD who is responsible for making the call. You are paid to do a job, and she was well paid during her time here. It's not the employer's responsiblity to keep paying her (they wouldn't for any of us).

(Pat is clearly a better person that Joe, but you have to have organization control.)
 
#182
#182
Spartacavolus said:
You can't let someone with dementia be in charge of a decision like that.
Doesn't matter who you are or the great things you have done.

This dialogue about a legend, with dementia, leaving on her own terms is crazy. She couldn't remember play calls people. And this was well before these meetings. You act as if they put her on the street. She is and will be involved with the university as long as she can or wants to be.

Just more people looking for blood in a blood thirsty world.
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This.

Coaches are successful because they are strong willed and believe they can accomplish the impossible. Most have trouble knowing when to leave without having to deal with a major illness. Add a terrible disease that distorts a persons view of reality & it would be a disaster for Hart to let Pat set her own timetable.

Anyone who thinks coaches earn the right dictate retirement terms doesn't understand college athletics. College sports makes us feel good but the reality is they are a multimillion dollar corporation. If the VP of Apple or Google can't get the job done a change is made. They don't get to dictate the terms just because they helped start the company or have been there a long time.

You may not think it's right but that is reality.
 
#183
#183
Pat was going to step down at the end of the season regardless. That was going to happen.

What should NOT have happened was for Dave Hart to tell her she was going to step down. Let her make the decision. It was completely unnecessary to dictate that to her, especially while the season was still going on.

It's one thing if she she had come in after the season and said she wanted to coach two more years. Then Hart could have had the discussion with her about what was best. But to dictate a decision before even asking what she was considering, and to make that decision right before the team was scheduled to leave for the most important games of their season was horribly wrong.
 
#184
#184
DeerPark12 said:
Pat was going to step down at the end of the season regardless. That was going to happen.

What should NOT have happened was for Dave Hart to tell her she was going to step down. Let her make the decision. It was completely unnecessary to dictate that to her, especially while the season was still going on.

It's one thing if she she had come in after the season and said she wanted to coach two more years. Then Hart could have had the discussion with her about what was best. But to dictate a decision before even asking what she was considering, and to make that decision right before the team was scheduled to leave for the most important games of their season was horribly wrong.
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We don't know that. What if UT made the Final Four? What if Pat started to think she was feeling better? What if Pat couldn't let go?

Okay, so he shouldn't have told her till after the season. Mistakes happen. I'm sorry here, it's a terrible, no-win situation but Hart made the right decision. It's not horribly wrong. She needed to leave. Horribly wrong is giving Paterno absolute power.
 
#185
#185
zjcvols said:
We don't know that. What if UT made the Final Four? What if Pat started to think she was feeling better? What if Pat couldn't let go?

Okay, so he shouldn't have told her till after the season. Mistakes happen. I'm sorry here, it's a terrible, no-win situation but Hart made the right decision. It's not horribly wrong. She needed to leave. Horribly wrong is giving Paterno absolute power.
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And why the fawk is Debbie Jennings bringing this up and you know that she requested this affidavit from Pat. What the hell does it have to do with the jennings case?
 
#186
#186
BearCat204 said:
And why the fawk is Debbie Jennings bringing this up and you know that she requested this affidavit from Pat. What the hell does it have to do with the jennings case?
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To prove the point that Dave Hart hates women, since that's basically her lawsuit.

Also, isn't it possible that Jennings goes to Pat and "tells" her what happens? I mean, I've seen this up close. People are very, very gullible in situations like this because they want to remember, but can't. Not saying it happened, but still.
 
#187
#187
DeerPark12 said:
Pat was going to step down at the end of the season regardless. That was going to happen.

What should NOT have happened was for Dave Hart to tell her she was going to step down. Let her make the decision. It was completely unnecessary to dictate that to her, especially while the season was still going on.

It's one thing if she she had come in after the season and said she wanted to coach two more years. Then Hart could have had the discussion with her about what was best. But to dictate a decision before even asking what she was considering, and to make that decision right before the team was scheduled to leave for the most important games of their season was horribly wrong.
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If this is how it happened, and I believe it is, I completely agree. If it comes down to a question of honesty and integrity between Pat and Hart, I'm with Pat every day and all day long.
 
#188
#188
Slydell said:
If this is how it happened, and I believe it is, I completely agree. If it comes down to a question of honesty and integrity between Pat and Hart, I'm with Pat every day and all day long.
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Again, who has the disease that affects every part of your mind again? I'm not saying Pat is lying on purpose.
 
#189
#189
ladyvols1 said:
My point was that Hart came in and all of a sudden twice as many women were outted over males. Also the NCAA requires a minimum of 1 female on the Athletic board, so they got rid of every woman on the board but one. Check the article in ESPNW. In Coach Summitt's affidavit she stated: "-- Pat Summitt said in an affidavit that she initially felt she was being forced to step down as the Lady Vols' basketball coach by Tennessee athletic director Dave Hart, who later told Summitt that she had misinterpreted his comments."
According to the Affidavit, Hart told Coach Summitt she woudl have to step down before the NCAA Tournament and then in a later meeting told her she had misunderstood. Pat Summitt initially felt forced out by Tennessee Lady Volunteers - ESPN
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LV1 ~ To your point on the bolded part...Cronan and Francois were really the only women in upper mgmt. before the reshuffle, as best as I can recall...that said, if you know different my mind could be changed because it's obvious now that Dave Hart lies on a fairly consistent basis. The logo issue and Pat Summitt saying he lied about it PUBLICLY, leaves me with no faith in Hart.

Hart did it to Summitt and Hamilton did it to Pearl...WHY DO YOU HAVE THAT CONVERSATION or MAKE A STATEMENT RIGHT BEFORE THE Tourney?
 
#191
#191
zjcvols said:
To prove the point that Dave Hart hates women, since that's basically her lawsuit.

Also, isn't it possible that Jennings goes to Pat and "tells" her what happens? I mean, I've seen this up close. People are very, very gullible in situations like this because they want to remember, but can't. Not saying it happened, but still.
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The next time my boss decides to fire someone what I am friends with, I am going to send my boss an email and claim that its discriminatory and wrong..........see how long I stay employed. This suit will not be ruled in favor of jennings and will only cast a negative light on the University for a while. Hart didnt handle Pat the best way possible, but nothings was discriminatory or illegal.
 
#193
#193
BearCat204 said:
The next time my boss decides to fire someone what I am friends with, I am going to send my boss an email and claim that its discriminatory and wrong..........see how long I stay employed. This suit will not be ruled in favor of jennings and will only cast a negative light on the University for a while. Hart didnt handle Pat the best way possible, but nothings was discriminatory or illegal.
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That's the worst part. Debbie Jennings is a clown. Someone who says she "loves the university" is trying to do whatever it can to bring out **** to help make the university bad.
 
#195
#195
Slydell said:
Well, I'll shut up. Didn't realize you had already graduated and set up practice.
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She has dementia. I don't care how "healthy" she was, she can't coach a basketball team, especially one with that much stress.

I'm not a doctor. But I know enough about the disease to know it's really hard to do things like that.

Also, did you see her last year? It's one of the saddest things I've ever seen. You want that to be the final image, her final legacy?
 
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#196
#196
zjcvols said:
That's the worst part. Debbie Jennings is a clown. Someone who says she "loves the university" is trying to do whatever it can to bring out **** to help make the university bad.
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Personally, I'm not sure who the clown is in this one...Jennings or UT. I think the lawsuit going forward at some point will have an international eye on it.
 
#197
#197
DeerPark12 said:
Pat was going to step down at the end of the season regardless. That was going to happen.

What should NOT have happened was for Dave Hart to tell her she was going to step down. Let her make the decision. It was completely unnecessary to dictate that to her, especially while the season was still going on.

It's one thing if she she had come in after the season and said she wanted to coach two more years. Then Hart could have had the discussion with her about what was best. But to dictate a decision before even asking what she was considering, and to make that decision right before the team was scheduled to leave for the most important games of their season was horribly wrong.
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Pat told you that she was going to step down? We can assume that but no one
really knows.

For all we know Hart told her he needed a plan in place and she failed to come up with one or her timetable was slower than his.

Maybe Hart could see her condition and was afraid that it might deteriorate after the season making the change more difficult?

How can we be entirely sure that Pats illness hasn't distorted her memory of the events?

There are a thousand hypothesis. An AD like any good CEO needs to be proactive & ahead of the curve. Hart demonstrated he is a good CEO.
 
#198
#198
Slydell said:
Personally, I'm not sure who the clown is in this one...Jennings or UT. I think the lawsuit going forward at some point will have an international eye on it.
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I'm not going to lie. Some of this has been fishy with Hart and women. But it could be someone who believes that he's doing what is best for the athletic department and it's just an ugly side of things. I'll take Hart's side right now unless I see more proof he is some sort of sexist demon.
 
#199
#199
zjcvols said:
She has dementia. I don't care how "healthy" she was, she can't coach a basketball team, especially one with that much stress.

I'm not a doctor. But I know enough about the disease to know it's really hard to do things like that.

Also, did you see her last year? It's one of the saddest things I've ever seen. You want that to be the final image, her final legacy?
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I'm just trying to say there are many degrees to it. Some, not talking about you Z, put her into a wheelchair and rolled her into an institution last year. And, yes. I know a bit about the disease.
 
#200
#200
zjcvols said:
I'm not going to lie. Some of this has been fishy with Hart and women. But it could be someone who believes that he's doing what is best for the athletic department and it's just an ugly side of things. I'll take Hart's side right now unless I see more proof he is some sort of sexist demon.
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I know. It's all speculation at this point. As I said earlier in one of the threads, I think most knew it was Pat's last year. IF, she was pushed out as is being presented, that would be the problem for me.
 
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