State of the Union Address

#506
#506
Most jobs are paid based on how easy the position can be replaced. A teaching position is easy to switch out and the new teacher can come right in where the old teacher left off.
 
#509
#509
Ihatethebuckeyes said:
No. That is not high level stress worthy of of 80K or 100K a year. Sorry but it's not. The guy standing at the Wendy's drive through has to deal with pissed off people all day long and orders getting mixed up and co workers who porobably don't care. Does he deserve 45K? Hell no.

Stress is having quotas placed on your head and someone standing directly behind you who you know is there who is itching to take your job for less. That is stress.

Every person on here who is an exec or sales rep or small business owner knows the over the shoulder feel and having quotas. Tjose jobs never turn off. They never clock out. You live with it.

Teachers don't do this.
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Moving target. You said stress was "situation you can't control," and I pointed out that teachers deal with out-of-control situations. Now you're changing your definition of stress.

That's fine, I dunno, I'm not a high school teacher. Seems stressful to me.

I'm not sure "stress level" should dictate pay anyway. In sales, the market dictates pay--you make what you're worth, depending on the value you bring to your company and who else could do your job.

Teaching is a different animal--they aren't making us any immediate money by selling products.

Rather, they're training our kids.

I'd like the incentives to be good so that talented people WANT to teach my kids for 8 hours a day.

Even if it's glorified babysitting, I'm not sure I want the cheapest babysitter available! JMO, though.
 
#511
#511
bam15 said:
Yes.

How many associate managers have three degrees?
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Degrees do not have a single thing to do with how hard a job is.

Bill Gates does not have a degree. You show me the teacher that can replace him.

Degrees do not dictate salary. I'm sorry but they don't. Unless you have a MBA or a PHD (for practicing medicine) the education does not change your pay ability.

I know this ticks you off because you feel that a person who spends a decade in school jumping through hoops deserves more but they don't.
 
#512
#512
Ihatethebuckeyes said:
Ok so you work 50 hours a week for about 45K?

About what an associate manager would make for the same hours.

The associate manger is probably in control of about 5-15 employees and has to make sure the scheduling is done and stock is available.

Is a teacher more important than this person?
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I guess that's what it boils down to. I think "yes," because I have 4 young kids.

Society basically thinks "no."

*shrug*
 
#513
#513
droski said:
and you've witnessed them working over 50 hours a week?
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how many times are you going to ask? Yes

Ihatethebuckeyes said:
Most jobs are paid based on how easy the position can be replaced. A teaching position is easy to switch out and the new teacher can come right in where the old teacher left off.
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and the exact same could easily be said of your associate manager position. Thing is teachers aren't really plug and play
 
#517
#517
I'm sorry but if you have 3 degrees and are a PS teacher you made a bad career choice.
 
#519
#519
utvolpj said:
no they're not. The assumption that every teacher is the same is a very bad one
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They're not all the same but they're still plug and play.

That's like saying the animals you hunt are not plug and play. Yes they are. One animal may be faster. Another may be more skilled at hiding. But in the end you are still hunting the same animal.

Plug and Hunt the deer but its still a deer.
 
#520
#520
i haven't seen any evidence teachers are paid worse they they were say 30 years ago when we led the world in education. i assure you my teachers when i was younger were no geniuses either. it's about the parents. teachers certainly matter, but i don't see what raising wages say 20% is going to do.
 
#521
#521
Ihatethebuckeyes said:
Degrees do not have a single thing to do with how hard a job is.

Bill Gates does not have a degree. You show me the teacher that can replace him.

Degrees do not dictate salary. I'm sorry but they don't. Unless you have a MBA or a PHD (for practicing medicine) the education does not change your pay ability.

I know this ticks you off because you feel that a person who spends a decade in school jumping through hoops deserves more but they don't.
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You could say that about a lot of jobs.

You must have a degree to teach school.

How many other jobs provide 45K for three degrees?
 
#522
#522
Ihatethebuckeyes said:
They're not all the same but they're still plug and play.

That's like saying the animals you hunt are not plug and play. Yes they are. One animal may be faster. Another may be more skilled at hiding. But in the end you are still hunting the same animal.

Plug and Hunt the deer but its still a deer.
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couldn't be more wrong on that one either. Different game requires completely different tactics. Heck the same game in different parts of the country aren't hunted the same way
 
#523
#523
droski said:
teachers certainly matter, but i don't see what raising wages say 20% is going to do.
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I'm somewhat in agreement with this.

Many times I think we need to take a good look at what we did when we did leadthe world in education and see if that just might be worth going back to.
 
#524
#524
tigervol9802 said:
I'm somewhat in agreement with this.

Many times I think we need to take a good look at what we did when we did leadthe world in education and see if that just might be worth going back to.
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then you'd have to put blame on the students and we can't have that
 
#525
#525
droski said:
not sure you know what marxist means. i'm certainly not suggesting those trade schools get paid for by the public.
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I believe Marx said education should be linked to the means of production. I absolutely agree, AND I think it should be included in the public education system.
 
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