Stephen Hargis...Please release your "info"

[PPPpartsp3]

I am actually going to spell it out for your spin doctors. Last 2 years.

Total record of opponents Butch Jones beat at Cincinnati: 97 – 131

Total record of opponents who beat Butch Jones at Cincinnati: 52 – 22

*** Side note, look at how many top 25 teams he has ever beat ***

Lastly, how many SEC teams are currently in the top 10 of the BCS?

 

[VolLee]

I am actually going to spell it out for your spin doctors. Last 2 years.

Total record of opponents Butch Jones beat at Cincinnati: 97 – 131

Total record of opponents who beat Butch Jones at Cincinnati: 52 – 22

*** Side note, look at how many top 25 teams he has ever beat ***

Lastly, how many SEC teams are currently in the top 10 of the BCS?

How does BJ's record compare to Sumlin's from conference USA. This is a question, not a statement.

 

[Vol_Doc]

How does BJ's record compare to Sumlin's from conference USA. This is a question, not a statement.

Yeah, such comparisons are lame.

 

[VolLee]

Yeah, such comparisons are lame.

Serious?

 

[VandyAlum Vol Fan]

This is exactly my point. I want to know more about our AD and what happened with the "deal".

Supposedly there was more to this than we know with the AD being the issue. THIS is what I want to know. I could care a less about Gruden at this point, I want to know more about our AD and whether or not he was the issue behind the non-hire.

That's all.

Clay Travis on Twitter: was told by a prominent UT booster that "Hart couldn't get laid in a whorehouse with a fist full of hundreds"

That really seems to have bore itself out fairly accurately. How many people PUBLICLY turned UT down 2 or 3? Now I wonder how many people privately turned UT down? And all of those people were making less than Hart offered them to come and coach at what was billed as the best open coaching opportunity in the country and they all turned him down.

 

[VandyAlum Vol Fan]

Any word yet if any of the juniors are staying or declaring for the draft?

 

[Vol_Doc]

Serious?

Trying to predict what a coach will do in the SEC, based on their record in a lesser conference, is pointless. Different conference, different talent pool. There will always be unknowns. That's what I meant. Jones has been a winner at every stop. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. Like this hire much more than Dooley's.

 

[PPPpartsp3]

Trying to predict what a coach will do in the SEC, based on their record in a lesser conference, is pointless. Different conference, different talent pool. There will always be unknowns. That's what I meant. Jones has been a winner at every stop. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. Like this hire much more than Dooley's.

Its really simple, do you believe BJ will recruit better than Saban, Miles, Spurrier, etc, or at least some what on par with them?

If he doesn't recruit as good as them, do you believe that he will coach that much better than them, to make up the difference?

All I have to go on right now, is past accomplishments in recruiting and wins. I don't see any great classes at other schools, or see a lot of contacts for the South. I also don't see a win over a top 25 team. Maybe he will hire "the best staff in the country," but I am very skeptical of all of this.

 

[VolLee]

Trying to predict what a coach will do in the SEC, based on their record in a lesser conference, is pointless. Different conference, different talent pool. There will always be unknowns. That's what I meant. Jones has been a winner at every stop. I'll give him the benefit of the doubt. Like this hire much more than Dooley's.

Gotcha. I completely agree. There are coaches like Sumlin that have done well in lesser conferences and then do well in the SEC and then some that have flopped, like it looks Freeze will. It's just a wait and see game, I guess. I choose to be hopeful. Sure beats the alternative.

 

[sanddune50]

I advised you to look at the W-L record of the teams he beat, and the teams he lost too, for the last 2 years. That is 24 games, not 1 game. I gave him a pass on the first year.

You do realize that it is a different set of rules for universities like Cincinnati that don't have the facilities and resources that an SEC type programs don't you?

Surely you understand the difficulty in landing top notch talent in universities with sizable disadvantages.

I mean no one could be that dense just to look at box scores and make up their mind about how good or bad a coach is without doing their due diligence, right?

 

[sanddune50]

Clay Travis on Twitter: was told by a prominent UT booster that "Hart couldn't get laid in a whorehouse with a fist full of hundreds"

That really seems to have bore itself out fairly accurately. How many people PUBLICLY turned UT down 2 or 3? Now I wonder how many people privately turned UT down? And all of those people were making less than Hart offered them to come and coach at what was billed as the best open coaching opportunity in the country and they all turned him down.

Sounds like an accurate assessment. I want Cheek and Susan Martin gone. Hopefully Jones turns out to be a good coach, but if this ends up putting our team back in a ditch the boosters need to do their due diligence and recommend a competent AD.

 

[PPPpartsp3]

You do realize that it is a different set of rules for universities like Cincinnati that don't have the facilities and resources that an SEC type programs don't you?

Surely you understand the difficulty in landing top notch talent in universities with sizable disadvantages.

I mean no one could be that dense just to look at box scores and make up their mind about how good or bad a coach is without doing their due diligence, right?

Have I posted that he can never win here, or has no chance, etc. No, but I am just pointing out the other side to the "stats." He is a winner over bad teams, does that mean he will win over good teams at UT with similar resources? Possibly, but I am very skeptical.

 

[sanddune50]

Have I posted that he can never win here, or has no chance, etc. No, but I am just pointing out the other side to the "stats." He is a winner over bad teams, does that mean he will win over good teams at UT with similar resources? Possibly, but I am very skeptical.

That's what you don't seem to get, they are not similar in any way. He has a top 5 training facility, a stadium that sits 100K, insane tradition with a school that has 6 NC to boast of, and a way more passionate fanbase than he has ever had. Not even in the same galaxy to being similar.

 

[Vol_Doc]

Its really simple, do you believe BJ will recruit better than Saban, Miles, Spurrier, etc, or at least some what on par with them?

If he doesn't recruit as good as them, do you believe that he will coach that much better than them, to make up the difference?

All I have to go on right now, is past accomplishments in recruiting and wins. I don't see any great classes at other schools, or see a lot of contacts for the South. I also don't see a win over a top 25 team. Maybe he will hire "the best staff in the country," but I am very skeptical of all of this.

Like I said, there are a lot of unknowns. Right now, no one is going to outrecruit Saban, especially one of the new guys. As far as prior great classes, I'll go back to the talent pool issue. How many Big East, CUSA, MAC, WAC, etc. teams have top ten recruiting classes? None. Top ten players don't go to those conferences. I'm cautiously optimistic from what little I've seen of Jones. We'll see.

 

[Spartacavolus]

I can not do any thing about it now, other than voice my opinion.

I will not tow the company line when it is wrong. I do that in my job.

I am young (relatively) and will be fairly wealthy one day. I might even take the job as Academic Chancellor myself when I can't run, or jump anymore and my gut catches up with my age. That will be a loooong time. You are right though, in the mean time I do have better things to do with my life.

If I do, I hope I can do my part to restore this program to where it belongs if Butch does not do it first.

I hear ya. I was young once too. And I can't run or jump anymore after 8 knee surgeries and an achilles on the same leg. Maybe that's why i butt heads on here with people that I acted like 20 years ago. I remember being so pissed off about an alabama game that I kicked a table across a room and accidently hit somebody. I remember holes in walls. Stupid stuff. I remember some people telling me to quit whining about stuff out of my control.

And btw, good idea on towing the company line. Yes. Be a sheep. Just do that as long as you have to, listen to everybody and everything going on, network when you have time, spend time brainstorming and creating different paths, plans, and ideas, then bust out of there when you are ready to take a risk, so towing the company line means answering to noone but yourself.

 

[Volinnooga]

I like Hargis but at this point, I'm not convinced he didn't misread some tea leaves in trying to get the "scoop".

 

[Spartacavolus]

Spin it how you want. Here is the other side, he is one of 5 coaches at BCS schools to lose to Dooley, and it wasn't even a close game.

so that Dooley team was the same team that was blown out by Vandy.
That argument is ridiculous. I guess that means ULM's coach that beat Saban is better than him as well.

 

[Spartacavolus]

Yea, I know most of the details about how all of this played out. If these former Dooley lovers, who are now BJ spin doctors, actually knew how far along the Gruden thing was, and how screwed up Hart and Cheek are, they would lose their minds. They are too busy trying to say I told you so, and not focusing on this joke of a search and hire. UT could have united the fan base, and showed the rest of the country that they meant business.

You got so caught up in internet bs it won't let go of you. If you knew how wrong you were, you would feel like an idiot.
You get your info from anonymous internet posters.
I don't.

 

[SolidRockGolf]

You got so caught up in internet bs it won't let go of you. If you knew how wrong you were, you would feel like an idiot.
You get your info from anonymous internet posters.
I don't.

Official Grudenites Conspiracy Head gear

 

[PPPpartsp3]

so that Dooley team was the same team that was blown out by Vandy.
That argument is ridiculous. I guess that means ULM's coach that beat Saban is better than him as well.

Maybe you can get with your sources and figure out the year that UT played Cincy, and what the result of the Vandy game was that year. I think its ironic he lost to Dooley. I would give your Saban reply its due, if BJ had ever beaten a top 25 team. I mean Saban only had multiple SEC championships and a NC by that time, so based on the past evidence, it sound reasoning that the ULM loss was an outlier, and not the norm. Some are trying to spin BJs resume the same way, with winning championships on every level, without even beating a top 25 team.

 

[Red Forman]

You are misrepresenting it I believe. Federal funds include the Pell grant for tuition and Grants.

State funds are what is reimbursed to UT, based on retention and graduation, after tuition from the whole state is collected. It does not get back as much as it puts in.

Places like Martin get that piece.

Building projects athletic and otherwise get their funding from endowments and gifts, from Boosters.

The same boosters that your homies just thumbed their nose at.

I didn't misrepresent anything. This entire conversation indicates you totally clueless to UT structure and funding. I gave you facts, yet you continue to believe your own ignorance. To deny that UT is a state funded university is beyond the realm of absurdity.

 

[Spartacavolus]

Maybe you can get with your sources and figure out the year that UT played Cincy, and what the result of the Vandy game was that year. I think its ironic he lost to Dooley. I would give your Saban reply its due, if BJ had ever beaten a top 25 team. I mean Saban only had multiple SEC championships and a NC by that time, so based on the past evidence, it sound reasoning that the ULM loss was an outlier, and not the norm. Some are trying to spin BJs resume the same way, with winning championships on every level, without even beating a top 25 team.

My 12 yr old wouldn't base his opinion of a coach over one early season game on the road against a team playing 5 or 6 NFL players on offense.

 

[bcartervol98]

My 12 yr old wouldn't base his opinion of a coach over one early season game on the road against a team playing 5 or 6 NFL players on offense.

Amazing that is the one argument I hear posed.

If we didnt have 12 men on the field when we stopped #1 LSU in their home stadium, would that mean Les Miles is someone you wouldn't want because he lost to Dooley?

Shallow argument imo.

 

[PPPpartsp3]

Originally Posted by Spartacavolus View Post
My 12 yr old wouldn't base his opinion of a coach over one early season game on the road against a team playing 5 or 6 NFL players on offense.

Amazing that is the one argument I hear posed.

If we didnt have 12 men on the field when we stopped #1 LSU in their home stadium, would that mean Les Miles is someone you wouldn't want because he lost to Dooley?

Shallow argument imo.

Here is the argument, since I need to spell it out for you too. No wins ever against a top 25 team. These are the records for the teams he beat and lost too the last 2 years.

W: 5-7, 3-9, 4-7, 7-5, 6-5(Fordham, FCS), 4-8, 6-6, 6-5(Del. St, FCS), 6-6, 3-8(Austin Peay, FCS), 1-11, 8-5, 4-8, 7-6, 5-7, 6-7, 6-7, 5-7, 5-7

L: 9-3, 10-2, 9-3, 5-7, 10-3, 9-4

Total record of opponents Butch Jones beat at Cincinnati: 97 – 131

Total record of opponents who beat Butch Jones at Cincinnati: 52 – 22

Now, its possible that he can now start winning against good teams, since he has the facilities and tradition that UT has. I am just pointing out the other side of coin of these Championships he has won, or tied for. I don't understand why you both are having a hard time understanding skepticism with BJ.

 

[alaVOL]

Do you really think hargis is gonna come on this board and spill his guts? If he knew anything he would probably be breaking his fingers writing an article. That's what those guy do.

If Hargis decides to tell what he knows he'll do it in a book if he wants to make a few bucks.