Syrian Kurds are close to declaring Independence

#604
#604
Mick said:
Well you did say that then you mealy mouthed to rationalize Trump's decision. Right now I'm trying to figure out the world play, since NATO is sidelined.
What's your opinion on the world play? exclude any dem or trump ref. It you have that feeling, form it in the context of "We, the United States".
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I'll link the appropriate posts when I'm on a laptop.
 
#607
#607
I'm curious. Since my return, is it safe to remove luther from ignore or is he still silly as all get out?
 
#609
#609
Grand Vol said:
I'm curious. Since my return, is it safe to remove luther from ignore or is he still silly as all get out?
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He's still silly but harmless. If you ignore him you will miss his hilarious posts when he's really trying to be serious.
 
#610
#610
VolStrom said:
I haven't talked to one person I know that gives two sh!ts about Syria. Why any American politician would care if Trump pulled the plug on that piece of crap is beyond me.
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Probably want Putin, Trump, and Erdogan assume will be the case.
 
#611
#611
Mick said:
No to your question.
Do you feel we abandoned the Kurds?
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I thought I answered it in a back and reasonable forth with LG today (it happens rarely enough that it was memorable), but apparently, I did early this morning instead.

Grand Vol said:
I was initially taken aback over "dumping" an ally, even a conditional one, to allow another nation to go after them with overwhelming force. And truth be told, I'd likely pick the side of the Kurds anyway since I despise the Turks. So, yeah, I was bothered over the way it went down.

However, taking a step back and looking over it objectively, I tried to see what other options there were. There really aren't any good avenues we could have taken as a nation. We tried negotiating, that didn't work and the Turks were going to go in after they walked away.

Regardless, we were faced with either continuing to support the Syrian Kurds and opposing Turkey, a NATO ally, and putting our forces in harm's way or stepping back. Neither choice was good. But I'll err on the side of keeping our troops safe for the moment and see how this unfolds.

Again, past failures to actually set up a legitimate and recognized Kurdish homeland with a democratically elected government are coming back to haunt us. And that's on Trump. And Obama. And Bush 43. And Bush 41. This problem transcends political parties and Presidencies. There's more to it overall, but I won't bore you with the complicated details since, in the words of one of your lawyer buddies, it's "simple."
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You might have missed it in your anti-Trump tizzy you normally throw. Now, the thought of dropping an ally like a hot rock certainly doesn't stand in my world, but objectively, what choice do we have? The Turks do have a debatable security concern since they labeled many of the Turk groups as terror organizations (and a few are labeled as such by us as well). So, which side do we pick? Or do we back out and support neither?

That's the real question. Right or wrong is up for debate, I think Trump picked the lesser of three evils by backing away.
 
#612
#612
Mick said:
Well you did say that then you mealy mouthed to rationalize Trump's decision. Right now I'm trying to figure out the world play, since NATO is sidelined.
What's your opinion on the world play? exclude any dem or trump ref. It you have that feeling, form it in the context of "We, the United States".
Click to expand...

My opinion? It's complex. You sure you want to hear it and rationally discuss it without invoking Trump every other sentence?
 
#619
#619
carlos86 said:
The average American can name a city in Afghanistan, name a terror group besides Al-Qaeda and can’t tell you the the strategic importance of U.S. troops in Syria.
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I'll ask you. Tell me the strategic importance of if having US troops in Syria. How will that put meat and bread on the average American dinner table, save their jobs and wages and better secure their civil liberties and quality of life on Main Street America?
 
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#620
#620
Seems genius to me. Trump gets the media on the side of the Kurds so then he can turn around and take Erdogan down a notch or 2 after he “attacked the Kurds” and it makes all the war hawks show their cards, The Rubios, that lil homo Kinzinger and Graham’s are pulling the same games as the dems in Ukraine but this causes lives and is under the guise of spreading freedom while pushing more and more on the tax payers. Pull the masks of some of these Rhinos and we’ll be getting somewhere in the next term. We know the dems hate Trump, let’s see now what ’publicans’ are out to get him.
 
#621
#621
Rasputin_Vol said:
I'll ask you. Tell me the strategic importance of if having US troops in Syria. How will that put meat and bread on the average American dinner table, save their jobs and wages and better secure their civil liberties and quality of life on Main Street America?
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Foreign policy most of the time a matter of just playing the game, not getting bent over, and forcing your opponent to show up so you can look him in the eye. In this you prevent one man from running the table (Russia)

Also need continue to fight ISIS, to deny Hezbollah freedom of movement and supply and access to oil fields, to keep the Israeli security concerns at bay (because if they feel that Iran is in any way a threat it won’t look good and they will flex their muscles) and most of all to prevent Russia from having a complete foothold in In the Middle East and prevent certain nations from drifting into Russian influence.
 
#622
#622
carlos86 said:
Foreign policy most of the time a matter of just playing the game, not getting bent over, and forcing your opponent to show up so you can look him in the eye. In this you prevent one man from running the table (Russia)

Also need continue to fight ISIS, to deny Hezbollah freedom of movement and supply and access to oil fields, to keep the Israeli security concerns at bay (because if they feel that Iran is in any way a threat it won’t look good and they will flex their muscles) and most of all to prevent Russia from having a complete foothold in In the Middle East and prevent certain nations from drifting into Russian influence.
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You didn't say one thing that answered my question.

Thanks
 
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#624
#624
Rasputin_Vol said:
Most Voters Agree With Trump's Withdrawal From 'Endless Wars'
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Huge difference between reducing our foreign involvement and simply moving our troops out of the way so Turkey can massacre our allies. That’s like defending enormous tax raises and then citing a poll and article saying “most Americans prefer a balanced budget.”

A poll more relevant to the discussion would be what percent of Americans think it’s okay to abandon the Kurds to slaughter with no tangible benefit to the United States?
 
#625
#625
tvolsfan said:
Huge difference between reducing our foreign involvement and simply moving our troops out of the way so Turkey can massacre our allies. That’s like defending enormous tax raises and then citing a poll and article saying “most Americans prefer a balanced budget.”

A poll more relevant to the discussion would be what percent of Americans think it’s okay to abandon the Kurds to slaughter with no tangible benefit to the United States?
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You keep speaking like the Kurds are some defenseless group...
 
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