The cancel culture is getting out of control

[n_huffhines]

Of course it matters. We need to know how and why words go from accepted to unaccepted and vice versa. It's part of understanding our society.

Why is that important? It doesn't matter to me one bit why it's no longer acceptable to say negro. It doesn't change my life at all. I've never even heard of somebody getting canceled for saying it. I googled that question and found nothing. What is the big deal? People just got uncomfortable with it and stopped saying it. Nobody is saying it's a terrible word that I know of. We just have all collectively disassociated from it.

And to those curious, a quick Google reveals that the United Negro College Fund changed their branding to just the UNCF initialism way back in 2008. IDK what that accomplishes, except to make a statement that the word has fallen out of favor while preventing confusion about who they are and always have been.

 

[EasternVol]

Why is that important? It doesn't matter to me one bit why it's no longer acceptable to say negro. It doesn't change my life at all. I've never even heard of somebody getting canceled for saying it. I googled that question and found nothing. What is the big deal? People just got uncomfortable with it and stopped saying it. Nobody is saying it's a terrible word that I know of. We just have all collectively disassociated from it.

And to those curious, a quick Google reveals that the United Negro College Fund changed their branding to just the UNCF initialism way back in 2008. IDK what that accomplishes, except to make a statement that the word has fallen out of favor while preventing confusion about who they are and always have been.

What interests you is your business of course. Part of this thread is about what words are or are not racist and/or slurs, and understanding a word's usage over time is useful in that, but that's just me.

 

[n_huffhines]

What interests you is your business of course. Part of this thread is about what words are or are not racist and/or slurs, and understanding a word's usage over time is useful in that, but that's just me.

I have no problem with the word being discussed here. What I have a problem with is people repeatedly asking me specifically to answer for the social status of the word, as if I make the rules (somebody actually said that), or as if I have called it racist, or as if it is important to me. All I did was ask Creek why he thinks the word would get the I Have a Dream speech banned, or whatever the hell he was talking about.

 

[LadyVolette]

I think huff and some others are missing the essence of the whole argument and that being "cancel culture". Some words and usage go out of style like many other facets of our lives. That's not really what we are talking about here, though. This is about non evolutionary change; it's about forced change ... change to the dictates of some group of people who wish to force their new, righteous, virtuous ways on society. Generally they way they go about it is destroying by one method or another an existing norm, and often the means to achieve their ends is to slander and demean any malingerers who resist the revolution. The left (although being the party of science and believers in evolution) just doesn't believe in evolution of society; they prefer revolution where they are the Creationists.

‘malingerers’… I gave a like just for that lol.. but you are right, language evolves on its own without our help.. the quickest way to make a word go out if fashion is don’t use it (ie the n word).. as long as certain people continue to use it, (as a term of affection)..it will never leave the lexicon.. I think people now are getting a little too carried away.. if you think you are being insulted.. err on the aide of this person’s intent not being nefarious.. giving them the benefit of the doubt.. if you are truly being insulted, you will know it lol

 

[creekdipper]

So, you're saying that the government is not banning books, but won't allow certain books in school libraries. That dog don't hunt.

What do you mean by "the government?" The public schools are part of "the government." The school systems are generally governed by local school boards who are accountable to the public. Some have elected superintendents; some have appointed (by the school board) superintendents.

During my 30-year teaching career, whenever I filled out any form asking for "employer," the answer was always the same: "___ County Board of Education." They made the rules, and if the public didn't like it, they replaced the board at the next election.

This silly notion that teachers should unilaterally be able to decide what they can do in the classroom is simply bizarre. That's not how the system works.

As for "leave teaching to the professionals," I coukd tell you pkenty of stories about teachers with pkenty of degrees who were fairly incompetent. Two quick examples: When we were deciding upon student ebd-of-year awards and were comparing notes, we had one teacher who literally could not understand that students should not have final averages of, say, 128.9. We had another teacher...a math teacher, mind you...whose grade book just listed letter grades for tests as opposed to numbers. And that teacher only had a couple of grades for each student for each grading period. We found that out because we had to figure out class grades for that teacher when the teacher was out for a few days at the end of a grading period. And both these were tenured teachers.

MacDonald's has managers who make the decisions about dress, employee expectations, menus, etc. The workers then carry out the plan. The school board is the employer; the principal is the manager; the teachers are the workers. Ideally, the teachers are given freedom as to teaching style, methodology, etc. within approved frameworks. There may be some freedom of materials that can be used, but that still must meet board approval.

 

[creekdipper]

I have no problem with the word being discussed here. What I have a problem with is people repeatedly asking me specifically to answer for the social status of the word, as if I make the rules (somebody actually said that), or as if I have called it racist, or as if it is important to me. All I did was ask Creek why he thinks the word would get the I Have a Dream speech banned, or whatever the hell he was talking about.

You mentioned the "connotation" when the word is given an English pronunciation. What "connotation" are you talking about if not a racist connotation?

You said that "we don't use that word anymore." I thought that you were implying that there was something inherently wrong with using the word. Were you simply saying that the term is dated just like any colloquial expression, but otherwise it's a perfectly appropriate word to use?

Edit: Had to make a hasty edit upon seeing that I'd put two "o's" in the second use of "connotation" above (instead of two n's). Proofreading is our friend.

 

[creekdipper]

You're moving the goalposts you fkn fraud. Why did you write 500 words about the school library system if this doesn't count as banning? Nobody said anything about a book being entirely illegal in the US. You're not fooling anyone.

I suppose I wrote 500 words because I've been there and know what I'm talking about.

 

[creekdipper]

I get what you're saying but removing books from a school library because the majority (hardly ever is the majority, just the most vocal) wants them removed is the same as a book ban. Now, if parent A doesn't want their kid to read XYZ book I have no issue with them informing the school and the school enforcing their wishes by not allowing the kid to check out the book. But I have a problem with other parents deciding what is acceptable reading material for my kid, I pay taxes also.

And no porn shouldn't be in a school library so let's just take that absurd discussion off the table.

Why shouldn't porn be in a school library? Are you calling for book bans?

 

[hog88]

Why shouldn't porn be in a school library? Are you calling for book bans?

Of course, just has to be one.

 

[Sandman 423]

Why shouldn't porn be in a school library? Are you calling for book bans?

Can you point me to a porn book?



Never mind, I found one. I'll be back in a few minutes.

 

[n_huffhines]

You mentioned the "connotation" when the word is given an English pronunciation. What "connotation" are you talking about if not a racist connotation?

You said that "we don't use that word anymore." I thought that you were implying that there was something inherently wrong with using the word. Were you simply saying that the term is dated just like any colloquial expression, but otherwise it's a perfectly appropriate word to use?

Edit: Had to make a hasty edit upon seeing that I'd put two "o's" in the second use of "connotation" above (instead of two n's). Proofreading is our friend.

Why would you infer that? It's a non-sequitur conclusion. I just think people are uncomfortable with the word now. I have clarified several times that I haven't called it racist and I also pointed out that I can't find anybody who has been canceled for using the word. Harry Reid got in trouble for saying something in conjunction with the word, but his entire statement was insensitive, and he still didn't get canceled.

You are really good at asking questions but not very good at answering them, and I'm gonna move on with my life.

 

[creekdipper]

Why would you infer that? It's a non-sequitur conclusion. I just think people are uncomfortable with the word now. I have clarified several times that I haven't called it racist and I also pointed out that I can't find anybody who has been canceled for using the word. Harry Reid got in trouble for saying something in conjunction with the word, but his entire statement was insensitive, and he still didn't get canceled.

You are really good at asking questions but not very good at answering them, and I'm gonna move on with my life.

Okay, got it.

Nothing wrong with the term. It just makes people uncomfortable to hear mentioned, kind of like "genital warts."

 

[AM64]

Why is there a need for parents to tell the government what books their kid shouldn't read? Shouldn't it be the parents telling their kids not to read certain books?

The other way of looking at this is that the counter culture are a group of bigots (just a different target for their hatred) and they want to stock libraries with books reflective of their taste. If you took a headcount, they'd almost certainly be in the minority; and the secondary or maybe primary issue is whether the people wanting to restock school library shelves are even parents of the kids in those schools. This is about indoctrination to a new way of thinking and people wanting to use public schools as their platform to reeducate to their new agenda. It's not an evolutionary process where norms change with acceptance; rather this is revolutionary change where a minority is stuffing their view down the throat of everyone else.

 

[AM64]

I get what you're saying but removing books from a school library because the majority (hardly ever is the majority, just the most vocal) wants them removed is the same as a book ban. Now, if parent A doesn't want their kid to read XYZ book I have no issue with them informing the school and the school enforcing their wishes by not allowing the kid to check out the book. But I have a problem with other parents deciding what is acceptable reading material for my kid, I pay taxes also.

And no porn shouldn't be in a school library so let's just take that absurd discussion off the table.

But then you have to define "porn", and how do you do that when people have different standards - the point where individuals draw the line. The other point is whether the people wanting to change what's in a school library are actually parents or just activists changing the culture.

Revolutionary change isn't reflective of societal drift; it's the forced change of activists. We've seen forced change in countries when communists and fascists (it there is a difference come to power), but if government bends to the will and supports the will of those pushing radical change, the result is still the same. Radical change doesn't have the measured thought of evolutionary change, and often the outcome is failure - too much change and too little thought - an agenda rather than change to fit real need.

 

[Orangeslice13]

Not a topic I have to worry about. Won’t listen to a Jason Aldean song, nor one from Morgan Wallen nor any other of that country rap or bro country bull that Nashville tries to convince us is country music. If you grew up on George Jones, Johnny Cash and George Strait, you know that this tripe ain’t real country music. Nothing more than pop pablum.

Southern rock
Southern hip hop

 

[hog88]

But then you have to define "porn", and how do you do that when people have different standards - the point where individuals draw the line. The other point is whether the people wanting to change what's in a school library are actually parents or just activists changing the culture.

Revolutionary change isn't reflective of societal drift; it's the forced change of activists. We've seen forced change in countries when communists and fascists (it there is a difference come to power), but if government bends to the will and supports the will of those pushing radical change, the result is still the same. Radical change doesn't have the measured thought of evolutionary change, and often the outcome is failure - too much change and too little thought - an agenda rather than change to fit real need.

I guess that’s our problem, people are so dumb now a days they need a definition of porn.

 

[AM64]

I guess that’s our problem, people are so dumb now a days they need a definition of porn.

Sometimes people make what seemed simple difficult. For example, most of us didn't have a problem with genders, who was what, which piece of equipment did what, what the roles were ... most of it all figured out centuries ago and having passed the test of time. According to a younger crowd we didn't know much, so they feel the need to teach kids the new way of things.

 

[creekdipper]

It's nature's way of telling us
Something's wrong....

 

[RikidyBones]

I get what you're saying but removing books from a school library because the majority (hardly ever is the majority, just the most vocal) wants them removed is the same as a book ban. Now, if parent A doesn't want their kid to read XYZ book I have no issue with them informing the school and the school enforcing their wishes by not allowing the kid to check out the book. But I have a problem with other parents deciding what is acceptable reading material for my kid, I pay taxes also.

And no porn shouldn't be in a school library so let's just take that absurd discussion off the table.

So there is a line and parents or somebody is deciding what is and isn't appropriate. Your line is reasonable. But it's an arbitrary line and we have common ground that a line should be drawn. No one is limiting the book at home.

 

[creekdipper]

Since some are so hung up on the word "ban" and insist upon equating being selective with banning, then fine...books are being banned just as they have always been banned out of sheer necessity. School libraries aren't the Library of Congress. Public libraries constantly weed ("ban") books to make space for others.

Banning books is good when they're considered to be harmful by the majority of the public just as other harmful substances, objects, and activities are banned. Nudity is banned. What? Are we teaching kids to be ashamed of their bodies?

 

[GreyWolf1129]

Southern rock
Southern hip hop

It's out there, you just have to look for it now.

Steel Woods, for example.

But yeah, I read somewhere that a famous country artist once said that there hadn't been true country music in over 20 years, or words to that effect. I tend to agree.

Go Vols.

 

[ClearwaterVol]

What do you mean by "the government?" The public schools are part of "the government." The school systems are generally governed by local school boards who are accountable to the public. Some have elected superintendents; some have appointed (by the school board) superintendents.

During my 30-year teaching career, whenever I filled out any form asking for "employer," the answer was always the same: "___ County Board of Education." They made the rules, and if the public didn't like it, they replaced the board at the next election.

This silly notion that teachers should unilaterally be able to decide what they can do in the classroom is simply bizarre. That's not how the system works.

As for "leave teaching to the professionals," I coukd tell you pkenty of stories about teachers with pkenty of degrees who were fairly incompetent. Two quick examples: When we were deciding upon student ebd-of-year awards and were comparing notes, we had one teacher who literally could not understand that students should not have final averages of, say, 128.9. We had another teacher...a math teacher, mind you...whose grade book just listed letter grades for tests as opposed to numbers. And that teacher only had a couple of grades for each student for each grading period. We found that out because we had to figure out class grades for that teacher when the teacher was out for a few days at the end of a grading period. And both these were tenured teachers.

MacDonald's has managers who make the decisions about dress, employee expectations, menus, etc. The workers then carry out the plan. The school board is the employer; the principal is the manager; the teachers are the workers. Ideally, the teachers are given freedom as to teaching style, methodology, etc. within approved frameworks. There may be some freedom of materials that can be used, but that still must meet board approval.

I honestly have no idea why you spent that much time responding to my post to agree that the school board is the government.

 

[Orangeslice13]

It's out there, you just have to look for it now.

Steel Woods, for example.

But yeah, I read somewhere that a famous country artist once said that there hadn't been true country music in over 20 years, or words to that effect. I tend to agree.

Go Vols.

I like a variety of things.
Music changes over time.
If people don’t like it they should not listen.
If they feel the need to run down someone else’s art that doesn’t make them pure or special ….it just makes them a doosh

See the country music thread as an example. There dooshbagerey is a one sided fight

 

[hog88]

So there is a line and parents or somebody is deciding what is and isn't appropriate. Your line is reasonable. But it's an arbitrary line and we have common ground that a line should be drawn. No one is limiting the book at home.

Parents should draw the line. People should be present enough to know books with descriptive sex or extreme violence shouldn't be available to elementary school kids but a couple guys holding hands isn't descriptive sex and Huckleberry Fin isn't extreme violence. People just need to get their panties out of a wad and use common sense.

 

[RikidyBones]

Parents should draw the line. People should be present enough to know books with descriptive sex or extreme violence shouldn't be available to elementary school kids but a couple guys holding hands isn't descriptive sex and Huckleberry Fin isn't extreme violence. People just need to get their panties out of a wad and use common sense.

That's a line drawn in a school library. A subjective and undefined one at that. You are for the moderation of books in school libraries. I don't know of the context of the gay guys holding hands book but I know huckleberry fin and I agree with you on that but let's not act like you're not for intervention into the selections in school libraries.