The future Liberals want

Daily news reports, the domestic and foreign mess we are seeing, always injustice or a war raging somewhere, and environmental destruction. One step forward, four steps back. But OK, you win.
Confirmation bias.

we are living longer. world wide death by violence is at the lowest rate its ever been. literacy, access to clean water, health care, access to food; we are all at the best we have ever been. doesn't mean its perfect. its life, and we are human we will never be perfect. but if you think we are taking a net 3 steps back you aren't paying attention.
 
Daily news reports, the domestic and foreign mess we are seeing, always injustice or a war raging somewhere, and environmental destruction. One step forward, four steps back. But OK, you win.

I don't know about you but I wouldn't wanted to live back in the 1200-1600s. I think humans have made a of things better since then.
 
I don't doubt it when you say, "I hate to break it to you, but nothing you mentioned will help." People smarter than I can ever hope to be have advanced wonderful ideas, even advocated policies that could solve various problems, if implemented in earnest. In addition to the reasons you gave, there's more.
Humans gonna human. They will claim to be all gung ho, but really aren't. Just PR horse excretion. Or vow war against what's holding the status quo together, then like a New Year's Resolution, abandon it shortly after. Or engage in some legal or other BS maneuvering to delay implementation until it dies altogether. In short, humans aren't committed to change for the better, nope, just the opposite.
I'll give you something to consider. In order to make your plan of throwing more money at the problem work, you have to take something away. If there was no guaranteed retirement for teachers, i.e. defined benefit retirement plan, they would work harder to make coin. That's what happened in my industry. Prior to the big three airlines going bankrupt in the mid 2000s and shedding all of the defined benefit retirement plans, pilots were limited BY CONTRACT to only being paid for 75 hours per month. (I know that doesn't sound like much work, but we don't get paid until the airplane starts moving. The addage is that if you can see a pilot, he isn't getting paid.) Anyway, after the dust settled from the bankruptcies, the unions negotiated to work up to FAA limits (of which there are many different ones, but the main one here is 100 hours/month.) Initially there were a lot of guys that wouldn't work any more than they had to, but after tasting that larger paycheck, working harder became the norm rather than the exception. Southwest Airlines exploited that from their inception. Have you ever noticed how fast they taxi? Check it out sometime and compare it to others. It's all because of the way they are paid.

So I would say that if you want to incentivize teachers to do a better job - although I believe that is an impossible task in inner city schools - you have to remove the disincentive to work for it, and that is the DB plan. Frankly, I think that ALL DB plans for taxpayer funded entities should be killed. No more retiring after 20 years of government work to a taxpayer funded retirement for the rest of your life.

Sorry for the long post.
 
I'll give you something to consider. In order to make your plan of throwing more money at the problem work, you have to take something away. If there was no guaranteed retirement for teachers, i.e. defined benefit retirement plan, they would work harder to make coin. That's what happened in my industry. Prior to the big three airlines going bankrupt in the mid 2000s and shedding all of the defined benefit retirement plans, pilots were limited BY CONTRACT to only being paid for 75 hours per month. (I know that doesn't sound like much work, but we don't get paid until the airplane starts moving. The addage is that if you can see a pilot, he isn't getting paid.) Anyway, after the dust settled from the bankruptcies, the unions negotiated to work up to FAA limits (of which there are many different ones, but the main one here is 100 hours/month.) Initially there were a lot of guys that wouldn't work any more than they had to, but after tasting that larger paycheck, working harder became the norm rather than the exception. Southwest Airlines exploited that from their inception. Have you ever noticed how fast they taxi? Check it out sometime and compare it to others. It's all because of the way they are paid.

So I would say that if you want to incentivize teachers to do a better job - although I believe that is an impossible task in inner city schools - you have to remove the disincentive to work for it, and that is the DB plan. Frankly, I think that ALL DB plans for taxpayer funded entities should be killed. No more retiring after 20 years of government work to a taxpayer funded retirement for the rest of your life.

Sorry for the long post.

Explain pilot pay a little more please. Do you guys not get paid when sitting in the plane during a delay? When you say "moving" is that wheels up or push back from the gate?
 
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Explain pilot pay a little more please. Do you guys not get paid when sitting in the plane during a delay? When you say "moving" is that wheels up or push back from the gate?
For the most part, we don't start getting paid until we push back from the gate. The preflight walkaround is not part of that compensation. Don't get me wrong, we are well compensated, but we are hourly employees and are not 'on the clock' until the red flashing light on the airplane is turned on right before we push back. There is a per diem component, but that is for meals.
 
For the most part, we don't start getting paid until we push back from the gate. The preflight walkaround is not part of that compensation. Don't get me wrong, we are well compensated, but we are hourly employees and are not 'on the clock' until the red flashing light on the airplane is turned on right before we push back. There is a per diem component, but that is for meals.

Are y'all paid during a delay? Like a ground stop once you are taxiing?
 
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For the most part, we don't start getting paid until we push back from the gate. The preflight walkaround is not part of that compensation. Don't get me wrong, we are well compensated, but we are hourly employees and are not 'on the clock' until the red flashing light on the airplane is turned on right before we push back. There is a per diem component, but that is for meals.
You ever find something concerning in your preflight walkabout?
 
Confirmation bias.

we are living longer. world wide death by violence is at the lowest rate its ever been. literacy, access to clean water, health care, access to food; we are all at the best we have ever been. doesn't mean its perfect. its life, and we are human we will never be perfect. but if you think we are taking a net 3 steps back you aren't paying attention.
OK.
 
I don't know about you but I wouldn't wanted to live back in the 1200-1600s. I think humans have made a of things better since then.
I'd rather live in an era we haven't had. An era with people who have enough sense to banish hate, destructive exploitation of people and resources, that doesn't designate vast economies to ever-increasing means to kill people, and creates excuses to continue being vile t one another. We're even killing our planet but don't care enough to collectively do anything about it. Indeed, governments push policies to prevent doing anything about it. We, you and me, prefer different eras, obviously. Even the man you may or may not believe in said, "Except those days be shortened, no flesh will be saved." No flesh? Ummm. I take it to mean all living things. You see, humans , in general, are destructive and self-destructive by nature because we choose to be. Just look at the venom spouted in this forum for a microorganism of that very thing.

Leo, baby, you got it right. Everyone thinks of changing the world, but no one thinks of changing himself. --Leo Tolstoy
 
I'd rather live in an era we haven't had. An era with people who have enough sense to banish hate, destructive exploitation of people and resources, that doesn't designate vast economies to ever-increasing means to kill people, and creates excuses to continue being vile t one another. We're even killing our planet but don't care enough to collectively do anything about it. Indeed, governments push policies to prevent doing anything about it. We, you and me, prefer different eras, obviously. Even the man you may or may not believe in said, "Except those days be shortened, no flesh will be saved." No flesh? Ummm. I take it to mean all living things. You see, humans , in general, are destructive and self-destructive by nature because we choose to be. Just look at the venom spouted in this forum for a microorganism of that very thing.

Leo, baby, you got it right. Everyone thinks of changing the world, but no one thinks of changing himself. --Leo Tolstoy

Well lead the way and work to make the world into what you wish it was.
 
I'd rather live in an era we haven't had. An era with people who have enough sense to banish hate, destructive exploitation of people and resources, that doesn't designate vast economies to ever-increasing means to kill people, and creates excuses to continue being vile t one another. We're even killing our planet but don't care enough to collectively do anything about it. Indeed, governments push policies to prevent doing anything about it. We, you and me, prefer different eras, obviously. Even the man you may or may not believe in said, "Except those days be shortened, no flesh will be saved." No flesh? Ummm. I take it to mean all living things. You see, humans , in general, are destructive and self-destructive by nature because we choose to be. Just look at the venom spouted in this forum for a microorganism of that very thing.

Leo, baby, you got it right. Everyone thinks of changing the world, but no one thinks of changing himself. --Leo Tolstoy
Even Captain Jean Luc Picard didn't see that era. I'm afraid you won't either
 
Well lead the way and work to make the world into what you wish it was.
I'm not Jesus, but you know that, don't you. Besides that, you twister you, you know I said verbosely, humans won't get better because we choose to not do so. You know that too, don't you, twister?

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Well lead the way and work to make the world into what you wish it was.
I'm not Jesus, but you know that, don't you. Besides that, you twister you, you know I said verbosely, humans won't get better because we choose to not do so. You know that too, don't you, twister? Your response is the kind of thing that validates what I said about this forum being a microorganism of why humans will remain destructive and self-destructive.

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Well lead the way and work to make the world into what you wish it was.
I'm not Jesus, but you know that, don't you. Besides that, you twister you, you know I said verbosely, humans won't get better because we choose to not do so. You know that too, don't you, twister? Your response is the kind of thing that validates what I said about this forum being a microorganism of why humans will remain destructive and self-destructive.You ole Chubby Checker, you.

View attachment 654628
 
But humans have gotten better.

How do you know? Have you tried walking on water? Really, really deep water?
No, but I accidentally discovered I could fly.
We've gotten better at finding more effective ways of killing people enmass. Yes sir, we am doggone good at that, umm-hmm.
 
I'm not Jesus, but you know that, don't you. Besides that, you twister you, you know I said verbosely, humans won't get better because we choose to not do so. You know that too, don't you, twister? Your response is the kind of thing that validates what I said about this forum being a microorganism of why humans will remain destructive and self-destructive.

View attachment 654628
You really want things to get better? Then you need to be willing to give up your time and your money to try to make a difference. Most people are only willing to talk about it but not actually do it.

The only thing you have been correct about is that for most people "we choose not to".
 
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But humans have gotten better.

How do you know? Have you tried walking on water? Really, really deep water?
No, but I accidentally discovered I could fly.
We've gotten better at finding more effective ways of killing people enmass. Yes sir, we am doggone good at that, umm-hmm.
You really want things to get better? Then you need to be willing to give up your time and your money to try to make a difference. Most people are only willing to talk about it but not actually do it.

The only thing you have been correct about is that for most people "we choose not to".
OK> That was the only thing? I get it, Jesus was wrong in what He said about divine interference is necessary before we completely self-destruct. OK, cool, you wanna tell Him that?
 
No, but I accidentally discovered I could fly.
We've gotten better at finding more effective ways of killing people enmass. Yes sir, we am doggone good at that, umm-hmm.

OK> That was the only thing? I get it, Jesus was wrong in what He said about divine interference is necessary before we completely self-destruct. OK, cool, you wanna tell Him that?
If I see Him, it will be too late for me to do anything in this world. Until then, I will do what I can. What do you do, just sit on a computer and type gibberish all day?
 
No, but I accidentally discovered I could fly.
We've gotten better at finding more effective ways of killing people enmass. Yes sir, we am doggone good at that, umm-hmm.

And better at saving people, feeding people, treating people, housing people, ext ext.
 
If I see Him, it will be too late for me to do anything in this world. Until then, I will do what I can. What do you do, just sit on a computer and type gibberish all day?
Well, you said you'll do what you can. Maybe my computering my doing what I can do. Uh, you do know you recently agreed with my gibberish, don't you? So my gibberish must be doing something right, on some level. BTW, you can meet Jesus via prayer if so inclined, just ask your priest or pastor.

To quote you:
825VOL said:
You really want things to get better? Then you need to be willing to give up your time and your money to try to make a difference. Most people are only willing to talk about it but not actually do it.

The only thing you have been correct about is that for most people "we choose not to".
 
And better at saving people, feeding people, treating people, housing people, ext ext.
Providing they can pay for it, which too many people can't. They're either burdened by debt, or just die. Practically all our improvements are motivated at nursing at the teats of common people's wallets. The Man, did also say that the LOVE of money is the root of ALL evil. Is that true or False? Only you and Clairol know for sure.
 
Providing they can pay for it, which too many people can't. They're either burdened by debt, or just die. Practically all our improvements are motivated at nursing at the teats of common people's wallets. The Man, did also say that the LOVE of money is the root of ALL evil. Is that true or False? Only you and Clairol know for sure.

Even poor people live longer these days.
 
Even poor people live longer these days.
We are better at getting worse. But nevermind, tell Putin to push the button, arm North Korea and other known terrorist factions (he promised he would) and get the business over with. The prophecy is infallible. Like you, I once had some of the highest aspirations, and belief in humans jumping higher, grabbing a handful of stars, and saying, "We did it!" Then over time, especially in these rather recent times, I saw more clearly what our determined course of in repeating history was leading unto. I felt arm-twisted into realizing we are what wiser folks than I will ever be, said we are. And what was coming. I poohed-poohed this back in the early 1980s when I encountered a book talking about the information age and how it would be a harbinger pf the very things we are seeing today. And here we are. I also poo-poohed the first dooms day prepper small group speeches way back then as well. Now, grudgingly admit they were right. But you know, we ain't seen nothing yet. It's both here and coming. I've learned not to laugh at it anymore.
 

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