The Impeachment Thread

[37L1]

She has given very specific details about how she became aware of the freeze and when she discussed the freeze with a top aide to Zelensky. Per Axios:

Olena Zerkal could not recall the exact date she read the cable, but she said she asked for a meeting with a senior aide to Zelensky to discuss the freeze on July 30. She said her ministry received the cable at the same time as Zelensky's presidential administration. Finally, Pentagon official Laura Cooper testified that the Ukrainian Embassy had asked about the aid on July 25, hours after Trump's phone call with Zelensky. That corresponds very well with what the former Ukrainian deputy foreign minister said.

Zelensky did not know of the aid freeze at the time of the July 25th call. So how could he comprehend Trump's request as a quid pro quo?

Zelensky himself has acknowledged that “there was no blackmail” during the call, citing as evidence that he “had no idea the military aid was held up” at the time of his July 25 phone conversation with Trump, the NY Times conceded.

Zelensky, as far as I know, has never said that he was being coerced by the President.

 

[RavinDave]

Well, he can't complain, but sometimes he still does.

Life’s been good to him so far.

 

[BowlBrother85]

Zelensky did not know of the aid freeze at the time of the July 25th call. So how could he comprehend Trump's request as a quid pro quo?

Zelensky himself has acknowledged that “there was no blackmail” during the call, citing as evidence that he “had no idea the military aid was held up” at the time of his July 25 phone conversation with Trump, the NY Times conceded.

Zelensky, as far as I know, has never said that he was being coerced by the President.

"Pentagon official, Laura Cooper, testified that the Ukrainian Embassy had asked about the aid on July 25, hours after Trump's phone call with Zelensky." Zelensky was aware of the freeze at the time of the call and he understood he was being pressured. He was set to comply with Trump's demand of going on CNN and announcing an investigation into the Bidens... but then the whistleblower's complaint became known and that changed everything.

I understand what Zelensky has said publicly... but that doesn't change the facts. I don't blame Zelensky for wanting to stay out of the mess that is American politics. He needs the assistance of the Trump administration while his country is at war with Russia. He says.... what he has to say to stay in their good graces. Trump has proven himself to be quite petty and vindictive to those who say things which are damaging to him politically... even when those things are true.

 

[37L1]

"Pentagon official, Laura Cooper, testified that the Ukrainian Embassy had asked about the aid on July 25, hours after Trump's phone call with Zelensky." Zelensky was aware of the freeze at the time of the call and he understood he was being pressured. He was set to comply with Trump's demand of going on CNN and announcing an investigation into the Bidens... but then the whistleblower's complaint became known and that changed everything.

I understand what Zelensky has said publicly... but that doesn't change the facts. I don't blame Zelensky for wanting to stay out of the mess that is American politics. He needs the assistance of the Trump administration while his country is at war with Russia. He says.... what he has to say to stay in their good graces. Trump has proven himself to be quite petty and vindictive to those who say things which are damaging to him politically... even when those things are true.

So who are you going to believe? The President of Ukraine or their Foreign Minister? It all boils down to which one floats your boat. If one contradicts the other, you usually go with the highest card and the one witness who had the conversation that is the focal point. Either way, Zelensky having said what he said, surely puts a reasonable doubt into the whole shebang, weakening your case.

 

[AM64]

If you, or anyone else, was proud of the way Trump handled himself yesterday, I understand the support.
What I don't understand is how anyone could be proud, or even accepting, of that behavior.
These are indeed bizarre times in which we live.

You mean could he have ripped them new AHs more politely, yeah. Could he have been a career diplomat and appeased them in terms nobody would understand, absolutely. Could he have been a JC (Carter, Jimmy ... just in case you don't catch on) and said it hypocritically with lust in his heart, yep. But Trump's gonna Trump, and considering that the slash and burn tactics have been one sided the other way for years ... having the roles reversed is kinda nice. Don't worry it'll be over in another five years unless the GOP finds somebody else with balls ... Nikki looks like the best bet right now. Considering her stance on the SC flag issue, I assume you'd be happier with her anyway ... appeasement for your more sensitive members and all.

 

[BowlBrother85]

So who are you going to believe? The President of Ukraine or their Foreign Minister? It all boils down to which one floats your boat. If one contradicts the other, you usually go with the highest card and the one witness who had the conversation that is the focal point. Either way, Zelensky having said what he said, surely puts a reasonable doubt into the whole shebang, weakening your case.

But it isn't just the word of those two... Pentagon official, Laura Cooper, testified that the Ukrainian Embassy asked about the aid just hours after the July 25th phone call. Once again, there is no apparent motive for Cooper to be lying. I can think of plenty of reasons why Zelensky would lie. He needs to remain in the good graces of the Trump administration while Trump is still in office. His country is at war with Russia and needs U.S. support.

 

[37L1]

But it isn't just the word of those two... Pentagon official, Laura Cooper, testified that the Ukrainian Embassy asked about the aid just hours after the July 25th phone call. Once again, there is no apparent motive for Cooper to be lying. I can think of plenty of reasons why Zelensky would lie. He needs to remain in the good graces of the Trump administration while Trump is still in office. His country is at war with Russia and needs U.S. support.

But still, he said (and still says what he said), it's reasonable doubt that can weaken a case and it doesn't matter that you don't believe him. You are not on the jury. And now it's pretty much moot, isn't it?

 

[37L1]

And now this:

President Trump may have finally broken Joy Behar.

"The View" co-host had a weird outburst on Friday when she appeared to violently try to pull out her earpiece, provoking a gasp from the audience.

"I'm crazy today, he's made me crazy this week," she said. "He's winning because I'm getting nuttier and nuttier." The show had just aired a clip from Trump's speech in which he mentioned his "total acquittal" in the impeachment saga.

Co-host Meghan McCain seemed to sympathize with Behar's distress, saying: "Oh, that's not good."

"I know," she responded. "This weekend, I'm not watching the news, I'm turning it off. I'm going to get a massage and I'm going to drink," she added, before laughing.

"I'm going to eat every carb in the house."

Joy Behar has bizarre outburst after Trump acquittal: He's winning and 'I'm getting nuttier and nuttier'

Now, how can Joyless Behar get any nuttier than she already is?

It looks like it won't be the first time that she ate, "every carb in the house" either.

 

[AM64]

Seems like this one should be shut down

Nah, it's fitting to carry on. I read this morning that Nadler isn't through. Anyway, Vindman is getting his butt shipped off (Siberia I hope), so you know the dims are going to be hot on the Vindman vindication trail. They think the other team should have to play with players who don't abide by team rules, but not so much the same for theirs. This perhaps just needs to be renamed to something like "Everlasting Impeachment - or Kill Donny (Bill was taken)"

 

[AM64]

People talk about Obama's economy. When Trump took office, it was pretty good. Obama took over during the second great depression. (People have forgotten the pages and pages in the Newspaper of foreclosures, the layoffs, etc)

You've heard the phrase about when you are at the bottom everything else looks like up? All Obama had to do was stay the hell out of the way and the US economy would have rebounded. See we are capitalists, and those are the people who always figure out a way to make profitable things happen. Probably if your guys hadn't decided that banks be forced to loan money for houses people couldn't afford, the whole meltdown would have been avoided in the first place. There were some good banking/investment rules in place based on lessons learned in past difficulties ... like the depression, but congress - both parties - liked corporate money enough to sell donations for deregulation.

 

[C-south]

I think that only serves to prove his point.

Or proves his sour grapes and yours.

 

[AM64]

I'm sure it's not, but he also wasn't the POTUS and didn't perjure himself.

Maybe Luther and the boys can find a SS mole who will swear they've been smuggling girls into the WH through tunnels terminating in some obscure office building parking garage. There are probably some leftover Vindmans in the presidential guard detail.

 

[AM64]

Actually, all Democrats quit 3.5 years ago since their rigged election help for Hillary didn't work out so well.
Now, all the Democrats do, is lay down a fresh warm pile of turds day after day.

That "fresh warm pile of turds day after day" thing sounds like a song in the making ... if we could find a non lib version of a Cyndi Lauper.

 

[AM64]

You've heard the phrase about when you are at the bottom everything else looks like up? All Obama had to do was stay the hell out of the way and the US economy would have rebounded. See we are capitalists, and those are the people who always figure out a way to make profitable things happen. Probably if your guys hadn't decided that banks be forced to loan money for houses people couldn't afford, the whole meltdown would have been avoided in the first place. There were some good banking/investment rules in place based on lessons learned in past difficulties ... like the depression, but congress - both parties - liked corporate money enough to sell donations for deregulation.

Hog, as I catch up, I'm seeing you and others already pointed this stuff out. I guess redundancy is one of the problems in playing catch up ... obviously so many great minds at work here despite luther and his gang.

 

[luthervol]

You mean could he have ripped them new AHs more politely, yeah. Could he have been a career diplomat and appeased them in terms nobody would understand, absolutely. Could he have been a JC (Carter, Jimmy ... just in case you don't catch on) and said it hypocritically with lust in his heart, yep. But Trump's gonna Trump, and considering that the slash and burn tactics have been one sided the other way for years ... having the roles reversed is kinda nice. Don't worry it'll be over in another five years unless the GOP finds somebody else with balls ... Nikki looks like the best bet right now. Considering her stance on the SC flag issue, I assume you'd be happier with her anyway ... appeasement for your more sensitive members and all.

That's a low scorer on the AM64 post continuum.
Confusing rudeness and immaturity with strength and standing up for ones self is ridiculous and highlights precisely a big part of what makes Trump a negative. You see it in the political forum constantly.
Confusing dignity and decorum with weakness is even more ridiculous.
The truth is much closer to the opposite of what you claim.
But again, that's Trumism in its purest form.
Horrendous despicablity is not a desirable trait. Certainly not one that should be encouraged and admired.

 

[AM64]

500,000 jobs added to health-care sector under Obamacare, Goldman Sachs estimates

Gotta have manufacturing to produce income to pay for services. It just doesn't work any other way ... well, it kinda does until you run out of other people's money. You see we had a progression of presidents before Trump that didn't understand that and were willing to let US manufacturing go. A pure service economy can never work because unless you can find a magic way to neglect frictional losses it's just like an imaginary perpetual motion machine and in the end there is no free lunch. You have to study thermodynamics to understand; and economists, politicians, and BS grads don't study thermodynamics. Taxes and energy are just two sources of friction that a service economy cannot overcome ... eventually a service economy will screw itself into the ground. Globalists who think it will all come out in the wash (that if they make the whole world rather than a country the system) don't understand the pyramidal relationship of creators vs labor and how the disparity in standards of living undermines their whole argument.

 

[SpaceCoastVol]

Life’s been good to him so far.

Maybe Joe's available for SuperBowl LV


Even stoned he would be better than what it has had lately.

 

[RockyTop85]

Lol. Sure thing in order for you to push this as bipartisan you’re either trolling or way dumber than I’ve given you credit for. Up to you whichever you chose

When they kick you out of the cult for this, you better not show up at my place begging to crash.

 

[C-south]

Gotta have manufacturing to produce income to pay for services. It just doesn't work any other way ... well, it kinda does until you run out of other people's money. You see we had a progression of presidents before Trump that didn't understand that and were willing to let US manufacturing go. A pure service economy can never work because unless you can find a magic way to neglect frictional losses it's just like an imaginary perpetual motion machine and in the end there is no free lunch. You have to study thermodynamics to understand; and economists, politicians, and BS grads don't study thermodynamics. Taxes and energy are just two sources of friction that a service economy cannot overcome ... eventually a service economy will screw itself into the ground. Globalists who think it will all come out in the wash (that if they make the whole world rather than a country the system) don't understand the pyramidal relationship of creators vs labor and how the disparity in standards of living undermines their whole argument.

Why would we need more lawyers? What does a lawyer do if nobody needs their services? Post on message boards all day?

 

[CagleMtnVol]

 

[Orange_Vol1321]

Looks like his gig was up.

 

[0nelilreb]

Now he can retire , move to Ukraine , and take that position he was offered three times by them .

 

[GVF]

Maybe Luther and the boys can find a SS mole who will swear they've been smuggling girls into the WH through tunnels terminating in some obscure office building parking garage. There are probably some leftover Vindmans in the presidential guard detail.

Yeah, Bill and Hill built those tunnels. Wouldn't be surprised if she had her own entertainment smuggled in. The back door was a revolving door in his 8 years.

 

[NorthDallas40]

When they kick you out of the cult for this, you better not show up at my place begging to crash.

 

[DynaLo]

Maybe Luther and the boys can find a SS mole who will swear they've been smuggling girls into the WH through tunnels terminating in some obscure office building parking garage. There are probably some leftover Vindmans in the presidential guard detail.

You followed the Arkansas governor’s Little Rock antics as well huh?