The Impeachment Thread

#17,051
#17,051
MontyPython said:
True. And I recognize the Republican "look over here!" distractions are core to their Trump defense.

BUT...

I probably fall into the camp of ALLOWING the Republicans to call ANYONE they want.

As evidenced even here, a huge percentage of Trump backers are cynical, conspiracy-theory-driven, HS educated, middle class, disinfranchised white men. They look to Trump as their anti-hero who will look out for them... even though this couldn't be any further from the truth (see: tax cut for billionaires), but it beat the alternative (HRC... the establishment). They will point to the impeachment proceedings and cry foul. Claim rigged. So, I support giving them what they want: Let's hear from the WB, Hunter Biden, the tooth fairy... whoever they want to call on the witness stand.

The target audience really is the independent voter and a very small percentage of people who are otherwise disinterested or undecided on Trump.

If the needle moves to, say, 55-60% support for impeachment? Game over. The moderate GOP Senators will flip en mass.

What will this circus prove for the Republicans? That they're desperate. That they are conspiracy theorists. That they have nothing to pull straws from but process, not form.

Go for it! Let them show their asses in public.
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I’m honestly not sure what the best way to handle this is. You definitely don’t want to give legitimacy to the idea that Trump was acting appropriately by trying to investigate Biden. On the other hand, you don’t want to feed Republican propaganda.

What is the best way to handle Alex Jones? Give him air time to let everyone hear his delusions and hope they come to the conclusion that he’s insane, or ignore him altogether. I’m honestly not sure.
 
#17,055
#17,055
My opinion is that EVERYONE has their hand in the same cookie jar. The real problem is when someone gets caught, then there’s all sorts of hand wringing and finger pointing until some anti-climatic conclusion is reached. All along, news channels and websites are making money, candidate campaign funds are enlarging, and “we the people” continue to bicker amongst ourselves about which side is less corrupt.
 
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#17,057
#17,057
MontyPython said:
True. And I recognize the Republican "look over here!" distractions are core to their Trump defense.

BUT...

I probably fall into the camp of ALLOWING the Republicans to call ANYONE they want.

As evidenced even here, a huge percentage of Trump backers are cynical, conspiracy-theory-driven, HS educated, middle class, disinfranchised white men. They look to Trump as their anti-hero who will look out for them... even though this couldn't be any further from the truth (see: tax cut for billionaires), but it beat the alternative (HRC... the establishment). They will point to the impeachment proceedings and cry foul. Claim rigged. So, I support giving them what they want: Let's hear from the WB, Hunter Biden, the tooth fairy... whoever they want to call on the witness stand.

The target audience really is the independent voter and a very small percentage of people who are otherwise disinterested or undecided on Trump.

If the needle moves to, say, 55-60% support for impeachment? Game over. The moderate GOP Senators will flip en mass.

What will this circus prove for the Republicans? That they're desperate. That they are conspiracy theorists. That they have nothing to pull straws from but process, not form.

Go for it! Let them show their asses in public.
Click to expand...

Not a single member of the GOP have even mentioned having the mastermind testify. That should tell everyone they are trying to hide the truth. The truth doesn't look good for the GOP.


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#17,061
#17,061
0nelilreb said:
I will repeat , the president sets foreign policy , it’s his and not one single person should take it upon themselves to tell another country to ignore the president ... ever .
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This is not actually true.

Diplomats and other officials who interface with foreign governments have to build rapport to be able to do their jobs.

Investigating Joe Biden puts both Ukraine and U.S. foreign policy in a bad spot. It risks offending a caucus of congressional voters who are required to keep that money flowing, putting continued monetary support for Ukraine in jeopardy. The Ukrainians obviously understood this or they wouldn’t have been scrambling and asking our diplomats and NSC staff for advice.

Vindman’s role at NSC was obviously one that involved maintaining rapport with Ukrainian officials. That’s clear from his testimony. When asked a question about what to do in a situation that risked interrupting aid, if Vindman told them to do something that was potentially bad for Ukraine, he would lose rapport and be unable to do parts of his job.

The problem isn’t Vindman, the problem is Trump trying to negotiate for his own benefit, without consulting anybody other than Rudy and Sondland to find out what other ramifications or outcomes his attempt to solicit election interference might have and get everybody on the same page.
 
#17,062
#17,062
Mick said:
Not a single member of the GOP have even mentioned having the mastermind testify. That should tell everyone they are trying to hide the truth. The truth doesn't look good for the GOP.


CompetentFaithfulHarvestmouse-size_restricted.gif
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They haven’t asked for a single fact witness who can refute the testimony of Taylor, Sondland, or Vindman.
 
#17,064
#17,064
tvolsfan said:
I’m honestly not sure what the best way to handle this is. You definitely don’t want to give legitimacy to the idea that Trump was acting appropriately by trying to investigate Biden. On the other hand, you don’t want to feed Republican propaganda.

What is the best way to handle Alex Jones? Give him air time to let everyone hear his delusions and hope they come to the conclusion that he’s insane, or ignore him altogether. I’m honestly not sure.
Click to expand...

Great point. Alex Jones is, obviously, insane and a societal problem. But, the gullible buy into him.

As long as we don't ever elect a conspiracy-theory driven President, we're good...

Oh... wait...
 
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#17,071
#17,071
BigOrangeD said:
Truth is Truth. Something your side cannot detect. Your side are all fools unfortunately.
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Side?

Dammit. There you go jabbing about Civil War again. How many times have I told you not to go seceding again, Johnny Reb. Bad boy! Bad!

And, oh, about truth and which "side" can detect truth... yeah...

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#17,074
#17,074
InVOLuntary said:
So I guess that means she differs from her party on gun control. You know, it being in the constitution and all? Where it plainly states the freedom to bear arms should not be infringed?
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That's a non-starter. Even the most conservative of judges recognize limitations on the 2nd amendment. There's no "unless" clause there, but no one argues guns should be available to violent felons, kids, mentally unstable people, etc.
 
#17,075
#17,075
evillawyer said:
That's a non-starter. Even the most conservative of judges recognize limitations on the 2nd amendment. There's no "unless" clause there, but no one argues guns should be available to violent felons, kids, mentally unstable people, etc.
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So you're saying the constitution is malleable? Make it work for your communist manifesto?
 
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