The Liberal Argument for a Higher Minimum Wage

#729
#729
utvolpj said:
That could be on the user or the system. No way to really know for sure
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On fruit by weight you select how many you want. So if you want five bananas you choose 5. Usually we get five. Sometimes they feel cute and give you five individual bananas. Sometimes they give you the five largest bananas they could find. Sometimes they give you eight for no real reason.
 
#730
#730
DancingOutlaw said:
On fruit by weight you select how many you want. So if you want five bananas you choose 5. Usually we get five. Sometimes they feel cute and give you five individual bananas. Sometimes they give you the five largest bananas they could find. Sometimes they give you eight for no real reason.
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Still, you could have a brand new user on a system that isn't entirely clear. I've seen it happen in our operations and had to make the system changes
 
#734
#734
utvolpj said:
It's an interesting thread to read

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This model can work, depends on the company and the services they provide. Much like government large corps do an awful job of spreading the money around.
 
#735
#735
BP4Prez said:
That’s great. But it doesn’t work at the local Piggly Wiggly in a town with a population of 2-3000
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RUSH ARCHIVE: This is pure, unadulterated socialism, which has never worked. That’s why I hope this company is a case study in MBA programs on how socialism does not work, because it’s gonna fail. … He’s chosen $70,000 as an arbitrary salary because he read that’s where people are happy. And he’s gonna find out… (laughing). It isn’t gonna take long because once everybody figures out they’re all making the same, no matter what they do, the slackers are gonna surface. It’s human nature! ….
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Not going to work until it does
 
#736
#736
utvolpj said:
It's an interesting thread to read

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That's really cool. Unfortunately, I don't see that it is really relevant when talking about federally mandated minimum wages. He voluntarily took pay cuts to give employees higher salaries. And likely the employees who were beneficiaries of this already had the training required to be successful at their own job. It isn't like this guy is taking kids straight out of high school and giving them $70 k. To me, the minimum wage debate always comes back to economic mobility. Sh*t jobs don't pay the bills, but they develop skills, facilitate training, and nurture work ethic. In short, they are the foundation for a career. If the barrier to getting a job is above the foundation level, then people with undeveloped skills will not be economically mobile.
 
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#737
#737
KB5252 said:
This model can work, depends on the company and the services they provide. Much like government large corps do an awful job of spreading the money around.
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On the radio this morning they were talking about Frontier communications and their cuts to employee benefits. This after they went thru bankruptcy in the past year and paid our tens of millions in bonuses to execs. Businesses need to start thinking differently and so do consumers
 
#738
#738
SamRebel35 said:
That's really cool. Unfortunately, I don't see that it is really relevant when talking about federally mandated minimum wages. He voluntarily took pay cuts to give employees higher salaries. And likely the employees who were beneficiaries of this already had the training required to be successful at their own job. It isn't like this guy is taking kids straight out of high school and giving them $70 k. To me, the minimum wage debate always comes back to economic mobility. Sh*t jobs don't pay the bills, but they develop skills, facilitate training, and nurture work ethic. In short, they are the foundation for a career. If the barrier to getting a job is above the foundation level, then people with undeveloped skills will not be economically mobile.
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It's absolutely relevant as an alternative. If businesses do these things and are rewarded by consumers then the need to create artificial govt floors goes away
 
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#740
#740
utvolpj said:
Not going to work until it does
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It’s not sustainable for small business in rural areas. Take any rural town in west or east TN. These business owners are not bringing in millions. You are serving a limited population base. You can’t double your payroll without bringing in more. So you have three options.

1. Lay off employees
2. Pass on the cost to customers (if this happens then everyone who didn’t get the wage boost is screwed)
3. Shut it down
 
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#741
#741
BP4Prez said:
It’s not sustainable for small business in rural areas. Take any rural town in west or east TN. These business owners are not bringing in millions. You are serving a limited population base. You can’t double your payroll without bringing in more. So you have three options.

1. Lay off employees
2. Pass on the cost to customers (if this happens then everyone who didn’t get the wage boost is screwed)
3. Shut it down
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It's working for this company in Idaho and it didn't have to necessarily be $70k. You're just continuing the same argument made by people like Rush when this was originally rolled out
 
#742
#742
utvolpj said:
It's working for this company in Idaho and it didn't have to necessarily be $70k. You're just continuing the same argument made by people like Rush when this was originally rolled out
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It’s working for one company so it would work for everyone. Right. I don’t know what that company is but they probably serve more than just there local community.

Take a grocery store. You are going to serve no more than your local town/area. You don’t have an online business and you’re not in the shipping business. You just simply sell groceries to your local town of 3000 people. There’s not a lot of room for growth in some businesses. Great for the ones that can. I hope they keep it up in Idaho, but it’s not a one size fits all.
 
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#743
#743
utvolpj said:
On the radio this morning they were talking about Frontier communications and their cuts to employee benefits. This after they went thru bankruptcy in the past year and paid our tens of millions in bonuses to execs. Businesses need to start thinking differently and so do consumers
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why should consumers think differently? They can do and buy what they want
 
#744
#744
utvolpj said:
It's absolutely relevant as an alternative. If businesses do these things and are rewarded by consumers then the need to create artificial govt floors goes away
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Yes, it would be nice if all CEOs would cut their salaries to give raises to their workforce. But I still don't think that would fix the problem of low wage foundation work being necessary for economic mobility. How many of the people in his company wouldn't be there if they had not gotten the foundation for work and career development at a sh*t paying job? Most everybody I know who is successful worked for peanuts to get training and develop skills. And it doesn't have to be a corporates job either. I had friends who mowed lawns in middle school. They made well below the minimum wage until they had developed the skills required to make their business profitable. If there was a law that they couldn't mow a lawn for below minimum wage, then they wouldn't have mowed any lawns to start with.
 
#745
#745
Rickyvol77 said:
why should consumers think differently? They can do and buy what they want
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Sure and they should be more aware and put their money towards businesses that value employees. Or at least businesses that match their values. I don't know many people whose values match what frontier has done in the past year. Plus their cust service sucks
 
#746
#746
BP4Prez said:
It’s working for one company so it would work for everyone. Right. I don’t know what that company is but they probably serve more than just there local community.

Take a grocery store. You are going to serve no more than your local town/area. You don’t have an online business and you’re not in the shipping business. You just simply sell groceries to your local town of 3000 people. There’s not a lot of room for growth in some businesses. Great for the ones that can. I hope they keep it up in Idaho, but it’s not a one size fits all.
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Pretty sure I posted that it's not a one size fits all solution. You're looking to reply with your anecdote without understanding the post.

This simply proves an idea works even when the great right wing prognosticators claimed it would most assuredly fail
 
#747
#747
orangepridenation said:
Personally, I don't believe in the concept of a minimum wage, period. In an ideal world, we would have an intelligent enough workforce to understand where they fall on the totem pole in terms of skill and market value. In addition to not crippling small businesses that can't afford to pay >$10/hour, it would also give larger businesses more incentive to actually compete for good workers, even the low skilled ones. (And yes, there are some excellent low-skilled workers who would stand out and be able to build themselves up over time).

This is one area that I wish the government would stay out of, particularly the federal government. $15/hour is a hell of a lot different in Northern Mississippi than it is in New York City.
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Meh, I used to be of the mindset that we don't need a minimum wage, but I'm beginning to move away from that. The reason why is that we have foreigners and illegals that would undercut local/domestic labor.
 
#750
#750
Rasputin_Vol said:
Meh, I used to be of the mindset that we don't need a minimum wage, but I'm beginning to move away from that. The reason why is that we have foreigners and illegals that would undercut local/domestic labor.
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Not intending to be argumentative, but cannot see any economic reason for the swing in thought. Seems the last sentence actually undercuts the argument for a minimum wage being beneficial. Perhaps something was left out?
 
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