The murder of Ahmaud Arbery

#2,352
#2,352
Rickyvol77 said:
I'm saying the comparison to your description of the incident is the exact same as that description, both have little meaning in the context of the specific incident
Click to expand...

It's not remotely the same.

You can tell by the way Arbery didn't chase anyone down, then threatened them with a gun with his dad and most importantly how he didn't shoot anyone three times in the chest.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Purple Tiger
#2,356
#2,356
bamawriter said:
To argue that they will only be charged with manslaughter would require arguing that chasing and attempting to detain a man while brandishing a weapon is not aggravated assault.
Click to expand...

I'm not saying what should or shouldn't happen, because there are a lot of facts I do not know. I just think this is the charge you will see occur.
 
#2,357
#2,357
Let me preface this that I'm not trying to defend anyone. Just looking at what I think happened...

The son messed up by grabbing a shotgun. I've said before I don't think their goal from the start was to shoot Arbery. I don't think they would have called the cops and if that was the intent there should have been better opportunities with far less risk to themselves than waiting for him to get into a physical altercation to take control of the shotgun. So this is where I think they screwed themselves by grabbing a shotgun instead of a pistol.......

If he had a concealed pistol on his hip or even in his pocket, not in his hand and visible, I think it might change the narrative some. You can have a pistol on you, it's readily available if needed, but it's not in your hands. You're not presenting possible aggression. Nobody may even know you have it. But a shotgun? You can keep it in the truck, but it's not readily available. You can't holster or it or conceal it. So if you want that available the only option is to hold it. So whether or not you're wanting to shoot or you're just keeping it available like a pistol, it looks the same.

If he had a concealed pistol on him and Arbery charged and attacked him without that pistol being visible, and then was shot, I think it might be a better argument for the defense that he was trying to defend himself from Arbery. And Arbery may not have charged him either and all of this may have been avoided.

As it is, I think it looks bad for them.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Rickyvol77
#2,358
#2,358
TheDeeble said:
Let me preface this that I'm not trying to defend anyone. Just looking at what I think happened...

The son messed up by grabbing a shotgun. I've said before I don't think their goal from the start was to shoot Arbery. I don't think they would have called the cops and if that was the intent there should have been better opportunities with far less risk to themselves than waiting for him to get into a physical altercation to take control of the shotgun. So this is where I think they screwed themselves by grabbing a shotgun instead of a pistol.......

If he had a concealed pistol on his hip or even in his pocket, not in his hand and visible, I think it might change the narrative some. You can have a pistol on you, it's readily available if needed, but it's not in your hands. You're not presenting possible aggression. Nobody may even know you have it. But a shotgun? You can keep it in the truck, but it's not readily available. You can't holster or it or conceal it. So if you want that available the only option is to hold it. So whether or not you're wanting to shoot or you're just keeping it available like a pistol, it looks the same.

If he had a concealed pistol on him and Arbery charged and attacked him without that pistol being visible, and then was shot, I think it might be a better argument for the defense that he was trying to defend himself from Arbery.

As it is, I think it looks bad for them.
Click to expand...

No they messed up by following him. Assuming following him was just to keep an eye on him for the proper authorities was their motive, their mess up was leaving their vehicle.
 
  • Like
Reactions: tennvols77
#2,360
#2,360
TheDeeble said:
The son messed up by grabbing a shotgun. I've said before I don't think their goal from the start was to shoot Arbery. I don't think they would have called the cops and if that was the intent there should have been better opportunities with far less risk to themselves than waiting for him to get into a physical altercation to take control of the shotgun. So this is where I think they screwed themselves by grabbing a shotgun instead of a pistol.......

If he had a concealed pistol on his hip or even in his pocket, not in his hand and visible, I think it might change the narrative some. You can have a pistol on you, it's readily available if needed, but it's not in your hands. You're not presenting possible aggression. Nobody may even know you have it. But a shotgun? You can keep it in the truck, but it's not readily available. You can't holster or it or conceal it. So if you want that available the only option is to hold it. So whether or not you're wanting to shoot or you're just keeping it available like a pistol, it looks the same.

If he had a concealed pistol on him and Arbery charged and attacked him without that pistol being visible, and then was shot, I think it might be a better argument for the defense that he was trying to defend himself from Arbery. And Arbery may not have charged him either and all of this may have been avoided.

As it is, I think it looks bad for them.
Click to expand...
I didn't think so at first, but now I'm not so sure. And the father was an ex cop, he knew what he was doing and knew he had better call the cops or it would definitely look like what it was. That was smart.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Purple Tiger
#2,361
#2,361
Behr said:
I didn't think so at first, but now I'm not so sure. And the father was an ex cop, he knew what he was doing and knew he had better call the cops or it would definitely look like what it was. That was smart.
Click to expand...
I can't imagine that they'd have video rolling if they had a premeditated plan.
 
  • Like
Reactions: TrumpedUpVol and jp1
#2,362
#2,362
Behr said:
I didn't think so at first, but now I'm not so sure. And the father was an ex cop, he knew what he was doing and knew he had better call the cops or it would definitely look like what it was. That was smart.
Click to expand...

I'm not ready to completely agree with this. But I'm really bothered by the fact that McMichael didn't call 911 until they were already armed up and rolling in hot pursuit.
 
#2,363
#2,363
Behr said:
I didn't think so at first, but now I'm not so sure. And the father was an ex cop, he knew what he was doing and knew he had better call the cops or it would definitely look like what it was. That was smart.
Click to expand...

So you think he called them just so he would have a cover to his story to kill him?
 
#2,364
#2,364
GAVol said:
I can't imagine that they'd have video rolling if they had a premeditated plan.
Click to expand...

I said I'm not so sure.

I can't imagine Arbery running away from them then all of a sudden turning back towards the guy with a shotgun. Someone explain that.

Ive already said something ain't right. Maybe it didn't go exactly as planned and they didn't think the video would be seen? Idk.

I don't even know who shot him. The guy with the shotgun or the guy with the handgun?
 
#2,366
#2,366
Behr said:
I
I don't even know who shot him. The guy with the shotgun or the guy with the handgun?
Click to expand...

Grey Wolf posted info from the autopsy this morning. Looks like three 3 shots, all from the shotgun. The first shot came before Arbery actually made contact with Travis McMichael and it grazed his wrist. Shots two and three came during the tussle and hit his chest.
 
  • Like
Reactions: jp1
#2,367
#2,367
bamawriter said:
I'm not ready to completely agree with this. But I'm really bothered by the fact that McMichael didn't call 911 until they were already armed up and rolling in hot pursuit.
Click to expand...

I might can help with that one...

Pilots: Aviate, Navigate, Communicate. Fly the aircraft; figure out where you need to go; then talk (radio).
Boats: Operate, Navigate, Communicate. Keep the boat afloat; find good water; then talk (radio).
Cops: Operate, Navigate, Communicate. Spot the trouble; find a good spot to work from; then talk (radio, but in this case 911).

Greg's instincts likely kicked in here, and it might have worked to his extreme disadvantage.

JMO, same as everyone else here.
 
#2,368
#2,368
bamawriter said:
Grey Wolf posted info from the autopsy this morning. Looks like three 3 shots, all from the shotgun. The first shot came before Arbery actually made contact with Travis McMichael and it grazed his wrist. Shots two and three came during the tussle and hit his chest.
Click to expand...

I quoted a local media source. They erroneously claimed the Glynn County Coroner did the autopsy. I have not seen, nor do I care to, the report itself.
 
  • Like
Reactions: bamawriter
#2,369
#2,369
Septic said:
It's not remotely the same.

You can tell by the way Arbery didn't chase anyone down, then threatened them with a gun with his dad and most importantly how he didn't shoot anyone three times in the chest.
Click to expand...
no one shot anyone three times in the chest
 
#2,373
#2,373
To me, it breaks down like this. They overstepped their authority when they attempted to stop him in the middle of a public road while armed. IF that is a felonious act(and I'm not saying with certainty it is), then this is felony murder under GA state law as I understand it. If not, then it's still manslaughter IMO. There is not enough evidence to say the killing itself was premeditated, but their actions up to that point were clearly premeditated. The shooting was a result of AA unexpectedly charging the son, but self defense is not viable IMO because the situation was created by the McMichaels. IF they had not acted in the way they did, their lives would have never been in danger. The McMichaels did not have the necessary basis for citizen arrest.

There is NO reasonable argument that allows them to get off scot free.
 
  • Like
Reactions: barrylee and Vol737
#2,374
#2,374
And something that's been bothering me from the beginning, when they say he "matched the description" of someone previously seen prowling on video surveillance, what was the description? Black male? That's a very vague description. Would they have been suspicious of any black male? Would they have acted the same over any black male? I'm not saying this was an act of racism, but to say race had no role whatsoever isn't true either.
 
  • Like
Reactions: barrylee, NashVol11, Vol737 and 1 other person
New posts
You must log in or register to reply here.

VN Store



Back
Top