The Official “Regular Posters of the Basketball Forum” Thread

#13,353
#13,353
Here's the postgame

We sucked ass. We lost to a team that got beat by Gramblin State lmao

Let's all let that sink in for a second
 
#13,354
#13,354
TheMookieMonster said:
This loss is definitely not a “panic mode” loss although it is a bad loss. To me, it is not the loss on our record that matters, it is mostly the red flags and how we played that is most concerning. I am hopeful that we can resolve our inefficiencies from inside the perimeter by March. This team has to have more of an identity than spread the floor and shoot the 3, otherwise if a game like yesterday and Michigan happen once again in March we are toast. Plenty of time to fix that though.
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cncchris33 said:
The issue is still where those shots are coming from, though. We got a lot of open looks from 25’, but we still, like last year, aren’t getting looks at the rim or in the paint. We just seem to settle for those outside looks, and when we are on, that’s fine, but yesterday was a carbon copy of the Texas Tech game, last year, just with more FTs.

-We launched 39 3s vs TTU and 37 3s vs Colorado, making 6 and 10, respectively.
-Santi and ZZ were a combined 3-17 from 3 against TTU and a combined 4-17 from 3 against Colorado.
-Over 55% of our total shots came from 3 in both games.
-We got outrebounded by 7 against TTU and 9 against Colorado.
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Agree 100% it's not that we lost...it's precisely how we lost. There was really nothing you can take as a positive from the CU game on the offensive or defensive end. The fact that we had scoring droughts of 1-14 (maybe more, stopped counting) in the first half and 0-10 or more in the 2nd half is absolutely unacceptable. The fact they absolutely scored points at-will in the paint the WHOLE game is ridiculous - JJJ even seemed to struggle at times containing his man. The fact that this team seemed to sleep walk thru the whole game is alarming....hopefully this serves as a wake-up call to the team.
 
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#13,355
#13,355
TheMagnificantOne said:
👀
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Overall I don't disagree with Turner...but I'm confused by the timing and why now is the time he's on social media stirring the pot with this sort of stuff?

Had he listened to Barnes he probably has a better final season at UT, does that mean he's playing pro...who knows. But he would have at least gotten a chance to finish his last season on the court.
 
#13,356
#13,356
MoCo_Vol said:
Overall I don't disagree with Turner...but I'm confused by the timing and why now is the time he's on social media stirring the pot with this sort of stuff?

Had he listened to Barnes he probably has a better final season at UT, does that mean he's playing pro...who knows. But he would have at least gotten a chance to finish his last season on the court.
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Lamonte had a bum shoulder and probably never should have been playing to begin with but gutted it to a couple nice wins before the season fell apart after he had to have surgery. Not sure what you mean by he should have listened to Barnes. If he didn't play the non conference, that would have been a losing season.

It was a little odd to just immediately say ZZ lost his starting spot right after the game.
 
#13,357
#13,357
zjcvols said:
Lamonte had a bum shoulder and probably never should have been playing to begin with but gutted it to a couple nice wins before the season fell apart after he had to have surgery. Not sure what you mean by he should have listened to Barnes. If he didn't play the non conference, that would have been a losing season.

It was a little odd to just immediately say ZZ lost his starting spot right after the game.
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Lamonte didn't get surgery in the off-season, didn't let the staff and trainers know the severity of his issues and basically decide to "gut it out" so he could play because he didn't want to pursue a medical redshirt. (but that's based on my memory of what was circulated at the time, could be wrong information. I know at the time it seemed like Barnes wasn't aware of how bad his shoulder was until after he decided to stop playing). I understood then and understand now that he had already been here 5 years and wanted to move on, but had he went into that season focused on getting healthy he would have most likely played later in the season or medical RS.

That's not what Barnes said though. I watched the post game. Barnes said ZZ and Santi played out of control the whole game. Then he said the guards have to play better. Then he was asked directly about ZZ again and gave the brutally honest answer. Barnes didn't bring it up or immediately say ZZ lost his starting spot. What I gathered from it was that JJJ would be back in the starting lineup (based on how he's playing and how bad ZZ has played) and ZZ would be the starter that sits to give JJJ a spot.
 
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#13,358
#13,358
MoCo_Vol said:
Lamonte didn't get surgery in the off-season, didn't let the staff and trainers know the severity of his issues and basically decide to "gut it out" so he could play because he didn't want to pursue a medical redshirt. (but that's based on my memory of what was circulated at the time, could be wrong information. I know at the time it seemed like Barnes wasn't aware of how bad his shoulder was until after he decided to stop playing). I understood then and understand now that he had already been here 5 years and wanted to move on, but had he went into that season focused on getting healthy he would have most likely played later in the season or medical RS.

That's not what Barnes said though. I watched the post game. Barnes said ZZ and Santi played out of control the whole game. Then he said the guards have to play better. Then he was asked directly about ZZ again and gave the brutally honest answer. Barnes didn't bring it up or immediately say ZZ lost his starting spot. What I gathered from it was that JJJ would be back in the starting lineup (based on how he's playing and how bad ZZ has played) and ZZ would be the starter that sits to give JJJ a spot.
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I have personally never heard that version of events regarding Lamonte. I was under the impression he hurt in training camp, wanted to avoid surgery and tried to gut through it and then could not in late December and decided to get surgery.

This is immediately from the postgame presser:

On Santiago Vescovi’s offensive struggles:

“I think he tries to do too much. I think he needs to play the role we need him to play. When he’s not making shots and he’s still open he has to shoot the ball because I think guys are expecting him to shoot it and when he starts driving, he and Z(akai) both are out of control. We don’t know what’s going on. Guys don’t know. It goes back, there’s going to be games where if they take shots within our offense they’re going to make shots. It’s when shots are rushed but when we come off screens knowing the shots that we have worked on for years but when he loses his confidence now he thinks that every time I get it I have to go create things for my teammates. He gets himself in trouble. That’s where the turnovers come from as opposed to letting the guys around him create some more for him. He’s had two games where he hasn’t made shots early and he’s let it affect him, definitely defensively, and Zakai was wild. Tonight, he was out of control. He was totally out of control to the point where I’ve already told him ‘you’re not starting’ because him starting the game hasn’t worked very well in terms of the way we want to get started."

So yes, he immediately said Zakai isn't starting. Now, I'm not saying that Barnes is right or wrong. Barnes has always been a hardass to his players in a good way and his players usually respond. He just usually doesn't make brash decisions or statements like that.
 
#13,359
#13,359
zjcvols said:
I have personally never heard that version of events regarding Lamonte. I was under the impression he hurt in training camp, wanted to avoid surgery and tried to gut through it and then could not in late December and decided to get surgery.

This is immediately from the postgame presser:

On Santiago Vescovi’s offensive struggles:

“I think he tries to do too much. I think he needs to play the role we need him to play. When he’s not making shots and he’s still open he has to shoot the ball because I think guys are expecting him to shoot it and when he starts driving, he and Z(akai) both are out of control. We don’t know what’s going on. Guys don’t know. It goes back, there’s going to be games where if they take shots within our offense they’re going to make shots. It’s when shots are rushed but when we come off screens knowing the shots that we have worked on for years but when he loses his confidence now he thinks that every time I get it I have to go create things for my teammates. He gets himself in trouble. That’s where the turnovers come from as opposed to letting the guys around him create some more for him. He’s had two games where he hasn’t made shots early and he’s let it affect him, definitely defensively, and Zakai was wild. Tonight, he was out of control. He was totally out of control to the point where I’ve already told him ‘you’re not starting’ because him starting the game hasn’t worked very well in terms of the way we want to get started."

So yes, he immediately said Zakai isn't starting. Now, I'm not saying that Barnes is right or wrong. Barnes has always been a hardass to his players in a good way and his players usually respond. He just usually doesn't make brash decisions or statements like that.
Click to expand...

How is your version of Lamonte different than mine? I guess the only grey area is if Lamonte kept it from Barnes/staff or not. But we agree that he wanted to avoid surgery in the off-season and wanted to gut through it to play.

I guess your definition of "immediately" is different than mine. Since he basically didn't mention Zakai not starting until the last sentence of that statement you just quoted.
 
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#13,360
#13,360
MoCo_Vol said:
How is your version of Lamonte different than mine? I guess the only grey area is if Lamonte kept it from Barnes/staff or not. But we agree that he wanted to avoid surgery in the off-season and wanted to gut through it to play.

I guess your definition of "immediately" is different than mine. Since he basically didn't mention Zakai not starting until the last sentence of that statement you just quoted.
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I meant immediately as day of, not "the first sentence in the press conference." Usually Barnes hasn't been so stern about changes in the lineup right after the game. I can't really recall it.
 
#13,363
#13,363
zjcvols said:
I have personally never heard that version of events regarding Lamonte. I was under the impression he hurt in training camp, wanted to avoid surgery and tried to gut through it and then could not in late December and decided to get surgery.

This is immediately from the postgame presser:

On Santiago Vescovi’s offensive struggles:

“I think he tries to do too much. I think he needs to play the role we need him to play. When he’s not making shots and he’s still open he has to shoot the ball because I think guys are expecting him to shoot it and when he starts driving, he and Z(akai) both are out of control. We don’t know what’s going on. Guys don’t know. It goes back, there’s going to be games where if they take shots within our offense they’re going to make shots. It’s when shots are rushed but when we come off screens knowing the shots that we have worked on for years but when he loses his confidence now he thinks that every time I get it I have to go create things for my teammates. He gets himself in trouble. That’s where the turnovers come from as opposed to letting the guys around him create some more for him. He’s had two games where he hasn’t made shots early and he’s let it affect him, definitely defensively, and Zakai was wild. Tonight, he was out of control. He was totally out of control to the point where I’ve already told him ‘you’re not starting’ because him starting the game hasn’t worked very well in terms of the way we want to get started."

So yes, he immediately said Zakai isn't starting. Now, I'm not saying that Barnes is right or wrong. Barnes has always been a hardass to his players in a good way and his players usually respond. He just usually doesn't make brash decisions or statements like that.
Click to expand...

I'd like to see Barnes take responsibility rather than throw his players under the proverbial bus even if when his players are making mistakes. That's one of the reasons I like Tony V. so much but I suspect that I will get flamed for daring to criticize Barnes.
 
#13,364
#13,364
zjcvols said:
I have personally never heard that version of events regarding Lamonte. I was under the impression he hurt in training camp, wanted to avoid surgery and tried to gut through it and then could not in late December and decided to get surgery.

This is immediately from the postgame presser:

On Santiago Vescovi’s offensive struggles:

“I think he tries to do too much. I think he needs to play the role we need him to play. When he’s not making shots and he’s still open he has to shoot the ball because I think guys are expecting him to shoot it and when he starts driving, he and Z(akai) both are out of control. We don’t know what’s going on. Guys don’t know. It goes back, there’s going to be games where if they take shots within our offense they’re going to make shots. It’s when shots are rushed but when we come off screens knowing the shots that we have worked on for years but when he loses his confidence now he thinks that every time I get it I have to go create things for my teammates. He gets himself in trouble. That’s where the turnovers come from as opposed to letting the guys around him create some more for him. He’s had two games where he hasn’t made shots early and he’s let it affect him, definitely defensively, and Zakai was wild. Tonight, he was out of control. He was totally out of control to the point where I’ve already told him ‘you’re not starting’ because him starting the game hasn’t worked very well in terms of the way we want to get started."

So yes, he immediately said Zakai isn't starting. Now, I'm not saying that Barnes is right or wrong. Barnes has always been a hardass to his players in a good way and his players usually respond. He just usually doesn't make brash decisions or statements like that.
Click to expand...

I’m actually thrilled with the comments about Vescovi from a strategic perspective. I’m reading it as “he can’t let misses affect his confidence, he needs to just keep shooting and do less dribbling. We know he can shoot. We trust his ability. He needs to just keep letting them rip even in a slump”

I’m in full agreement with that. If we are gonna be a shooting team, then by god, shoot.
 
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#13,365
#13,365
Yeah I do agree there...one thing about Tony V and Josh Heupel both they have no issue shouldering blame for mistakes they've made. Barnes could have opened that post game with "The team didn't play hard and I have to take responsibility for that as their coach. I shouldn't have let them get complacent about our opponent or let them take them lightly"

It's honestly my only complaint about Barnes. I don't think I have ever heard him take full blame and not put it on the players, I have heard Heupel and Tony V do that before though. If you have the culture built right the players themselves will own their mistakes and you as the coach shouldn't need to call anyone out by name.
 
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#13,367
#13,367
MoCo_Vol said:
Yeah I do agree there...one thing about Tony V and Josh Heupel both they have no issue shouldering blame for mistakes they've made. Barnes could have opened that post game with "The team didn't play hard and I have to take responsibility for that as their coach. I shouldn't have let them get complacent about our opponent or let them take them lightly"

It's honestly my only complaint about Barnes. I don't think I have ever heard him take full blame and not put it on the players, I have heard Heupel and Tony V do that before though. If you have the culture built right the players themselves will own their mistakes and you as the coach shouldn't need to call anyone out by name.
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I am of the opinion is that everyone in that locker room knows where they all stand behind closed doors. Barnes says a lot of things publicly, but he is overwhelmingly adored by many of his players. The culture is strong enough to where they know he cares about them but will rip into them when they don't perform or give effort. You saw the jubilation last year after the SECT win, and the things said by all of the players about their coach and teammates. If you listen closely to some of his press conferences, he uses "we" a lot. He was very complimentary of his team and our fans after the Michigan loss last year.
 
#13,368
#13,368
VolGee4 said:
I am of the opinion is that everyone in that locker room knows where they all stand behind closed doors. Barnes says a lot of things publicly, but he is overwhelmingly adored by many of his players. The culture is strong enough to where they know he cares about them but will rip into them when they don't perform or give effort. You saw the jubilation last year after the SECT win, and the things said by all of the players about their coach and teammates. If you listen closely to some of his press conferences, he uses "we" a lot. He was very complimentary of his team and our fans after the Michigan loss last year.
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The difference is he's more emotional than the other coaches mentioned. But Heupel will have players transfer out, and he'll have some players that don't speak about him fondly. Everyone has their own personality, knowing where ZZ comes from and what he's been through. Zero doubt he took anything Barnes said badly, he'll keep grinding and get better. I don't think many of the guys on that team are going to fold under tough love.
 
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#13,369
#13,369
patrick said:
I'd like to see Barnes take responsibility rather than throw his players under the proverbial bus even if when his players are making mistakes. That's one of the reasons I like Tony V. so much but I suspect that I will get flamed for daring to criticize Barnes.
Click to expand...
You didn’t listen if you didn’t hear Barnes say he was at fault, too.
 
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#13,371
#13,371
Key, Santi, JJJ, Phillips and ORN

Solid lineup. I think Florida Gulf has only 3 players that are taller than 6'8" on roster, and only one of them gets significant minutes (Andre Weir 6'10")
 
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#13,372
#13,372
MoCo_Vol said:
Key, Santi, JJJ, Phillips and ORN

Solid lineup. I think Florida Gulf has only 3 players that are taller than 6'8" on roster, and only one of them gets significant minutes (Andre Weir 6'10")
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If we could get Phillips to add a few pounds and become a force on the glass, take out ORN and add ZZ and you have a hell of a closing lineup that can run anyone off the floor.
 
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#13,373
#13,373
berryvol said:
If we could get Phillips to add a few pounds and become a force on the glass, take out ORN and add ZZ and you have a hell of a closing lineup that can run anyone off the floor.
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I’d honestly rather see Aidoo emerge at the 5 and keep the length. ZZ off the bench to give Key or Santi a rest works well.
 
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#13,374
#13,374
MoCo_Vol said:
I’d honestly rather see Aidoo emerge at the 5 and keep the length. ZZ off the bench to give Key or Santi a rest works well.
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Fair, I was mainly meaning in late game scenarios where we want as many ball handlers on the floor as possible. Aidoo adding some weight and aggression would be massive tho.
 
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