The Official Libertarian/Anarcho-Capitalist Thread

#976
#976
n_huffhines said:
Wow, you got me. I made a comment in jest in conjunction with a link to an old article and now everything I've ever done is discredited.
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It's called doing your research. Nothing about your post indicated that you were being facetious or attempting humor.
 
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#977
#977
MG1968 said:
It's called doing your research. Nothing about your post indicated that you were being facetious or attempting humor.
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Except this clearly facetious statement. There are obviously better reasons than beer tax to abolish government...like genocide.

n_huffhines said:
There has never been a better reason for the abolition of government
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Regardless, the 44% government adds to the cost of beer is still an interesting fact. The fact that this legislation was proposed is also interesting, whether or not it passed. Thank you for correcting me. No thank you for taking it so seriously.
 
#983
#983
It's not completely inaccurate. All you showed is that it needs more context for better interpretation.
 
#984
#984
I'm not sure how much misinterpretation of the context I made by finding the fact that the Metro PD was still in charge of the area and the company only replaced another company that was doing additional presence patrols above and beyond the local PD.

Keep on ignoring facts when it's convenient.
 
#985
#985
Grand Vol said:
I'm not sure how much misinterpretation of the context I made by finding the fact that the Metro PD was still in charge of the area and the company only replaced another company that was doing additional presence patrols above and beyond the local PD.

Keep on ignoring facts when it's convenient.
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I guess I missed that one. Link?
 
#986
#986
I've got that they fired Harris County's Constable Office. Is that not a law enforcement outfit?
 
#987
#987
n_huffhines said:
I guess I missed that one. Link?
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The link is contained in the first paragraph of the Rare story you enjoy linking to.

No, Sharpstown, Texas, Did Not Fire its Police Force and Bring About a Huge Drop in Crime | Texas Monthly

So, cheaper cops bringing down the crime rate while being nice and respectful about it, and doing so without taking a dime of tax money. Cop Block, Alex Jones, and Joe Rogan are lovin’ it! Libertarian paradise!

Only very little of it is true.

First, there is no such place as Sharpstown, Texas. Sharpstown is a master-planned community in southwest Houston, Texas. Sharpstown has never had its own schools, fire department, mayor, post offices, city council, or police force. It is under the jurisdiction of the Houston Police Department, just like downtown Houston, River Oaks, and Fifth Ward.

Second, they didn’t fire anybody, technically speaking. They just refused to renew a yearly contract with the Harris County Constables’ Office for extra security patrols. (Sharpstown residents can still be ticketed and/or arrested by Harris County constables, just as they could by an HPD cop. I am sure some resident will try to pull the “You can’t bust me, we fired you,” card soon.) In addition to patrol, process-serving, and court security, Harris County constables will contract with neighborhoods for supplemental patrols, but their services do not come cheap. The Braeswood Place neighborhood, in near southwest Houston, pays $360,000 yearly for five deputy constables to patrol its confines.

And then there’s that alleged 61 percent reduction in crime. That number apparently originates from an “independent study” conducted by the Sharpstown Civic Association, a group with a vested interest in combating its image as a haven for crime. According to a more objective source—Houston’s NBC affiliate—Sharpstown had the most total crimes of any Houston neighborhood in 2013, the first full year of the S.E.A.L. patrols.
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#988
#988
n_huffhines said:
I've got that they fired Harris County's Constable Office. Is that not a law enforcement outfit?
Click to expand...

No, Sharpstown, Texas, Did Not Fire its Police Force and Bring About a Huge Drop in Crime | Texas Monthly

Second, they didn’t fire anybody, technically speaking. They just refused to renew a yearly contract with the Harris County Constables’ Office for extra security patrols.
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Big difference in "firing" and not renewing a contract with an outfit that didn't have primary jurisdiction to begin with.
 
#989
#989
Grand Vol said:
Big difference in "firing" and not renewing a contract with an outfit that didn't have primary jurisdiction to begin with.
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So your objection is in the semantic use of "firing"? Seriously?

Would Metro PD relinquish jurisdiction? I highly doubt it. It's a fact that I agree gives the story important context, but it's not like Sharpstown can get rid of them if they want to.
 
#990
#990
Grand Vol said:
I'm not sure how much misinterpretation of the context I made by finding the fact that the Metro PD was still in charge of the area and the company only replaced another company that was doing additional presence patrols above and beyond the local PD.

Keep on ignoring facts when it's convenient.
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Back to this, so we're all on the same page...we now agree that it wasn't a company being replaced by a company, right?
 
#991
#991
n_huffhines said:
So your objection is in the semantic use of "firing"? Seriously?

Would Metro PD relinquish jurisdiction? I highly doubt it. It's a fact that I agree gives the story important context, but it's not like Sharpstown can get rid of them if they want to.
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Did you even bother to read the Texas Monthly rebuttal to the Rare story?
 
#992
#992
Huff, I gotta say I don't see how you are standing by this story. It's not an issue of semantics - the whole dang story doesn't fit how it was originally told.

That's why I wondered at your reposting it.
 
#994
#994
volinbham said:
Huff, I gotta say I don't see how you are standing by this story. It's not an issue of semantics - the whole dang story doesn't fit how it was originally told.

That's why I wondered at your reposting it.
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I didn't repost it. I posted it here first. It came up in another thread and GV offered his fact-checking article, which I read at the time. We talked about it at the time. Somehow I am the only one who didn't come away thinking Sharpstown replaced a company with a company, yet I am the one being accused of not reading it. WTF

Yes the Rare article is grossly missing some facts. Is what happened in Sharpstown interesting with regard to anarcho-capitalism?...yes.
 
#995
#995
n_huffhines said:
I didn't repost it. I posted it here first. It came up in another thread and GV offered his fact-checking article, which I read at the time. We talked about it at the time. Somehow I am the only one who didn't come away thinking Sharpstown replaced a company with a company, yet I am the one being accused of not reading it. WTF

Yes the Rare article is grossly missing some facts. Is what happened in Sharpstown interesting with regard to anarcho-capitalism?...yes.
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To the last point I don't think it tells us much at all. Government is not being replaced by private security. It is being supplemented in a small way and the claim of 50% drop in crime is pretty dubious (11 vs 20 robberies) over "x" time. Clearly insufficient data to draw any conclusions.
 
#996
#996
n_huffhines said:
Is what happened in Sharpstown interesting with regard to anarcho-capitalism?...yes.
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No, because the status quo hasn't changed at all. Government LE forces are still the ones with jurisdiction in the area.

If the police force had been, as the article and the title imply, replaced by private security I might agree with you. However, being that it's completely inaccurate in the depiction of what really happened, not a chance.
 
#997
#997
God, you guys are ridiculous. I understand there isn't full anarchy in Sharpstown. That doesn't mean there isn't some sort of interesting take away in all of this. Does it mean we should switch to Anarcho-Capitalism tomorrow? No. Does it mean we should have some cities experiment with private policing? Why not? This is the closest thing to that, and it looks pretty good, despite the imperfect test.
 
#998
#998
n_huffhines said:
God, you guys are ridiculous. I understand there isn't full anarchy in Sharpstown. That doesn't mean there isn't some sort of interesting take away in all of this. Does it mean we should switch to Anarcho-Capitalism tomorrow? No. Does it mean we should have some cities experiment with private policing? Why not? This is the closest thing to that, and it looks pretty good, despite the imperfect test.
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How on earth is adding your own security to existing security evidence that shows AC works?

Private security is nothing new - I really don't see what the lesson here is.
 
#999
#999
n_huffhines said:
God, you guys are ridiculous. I understand there isn't full anarchy in Sharpstown. That doesn't mean there isn't some sort of interesting take away in all of this. Does it mean we should switch to Anarcho-Capitalism tomorrow? No. Does it mean we should have some cities experiment with private policing? Why not? This is the closest thing to that, and it looks pretty good, despite the imperfect test.
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You also ignored the fact that area of Houston has the highest crime rate...
 
#1,000
#1,000
So, I've been thinking about immigration in response to the Germany sexual assault scandal and much of Europe in general during the immigration crisis.

I generally have agreed that freedom of movement is a fundamental right given but I also think that it's not unreasonable for the individuals within an area to expect those they let in abide by rules and laws that don't violate the NAP, but how do you handle the mass importation of people who bring along a culture that is completely and utterly incompatible with the dominant culture of the area? Combine that with the fact that many many of the migrants are economic migrants and will be initiating the use of force because by and large these people will end up using taxpayer funded assistance and it begs the question, "is it morally reprehensible to see the chaos and degradation happening due to this importation of an incompatible culture and decide to initiate the use of force and restrict that freedom of movement?"
 
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