The Thread Where We Debate About Healthcare in America

#351
#351
82_VOL_83 said:
If healthcare is a major issue for you and the US system sucks so bad, leave. This isnt malicious, it just seems that many of you are extremely unhappy. You should just go. Rest assured, you won't be missed and no one will worry about you.
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Does everything about the US make you happy? If not, you should leave, too.
 
#353
#353
SpaceCoastVol said:
LMAO
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No leg to stand on huh? I get it, it’s by far the biggest losing issue for Republicans today. Defending our system with millions who don’t have access to care while being twice as expensive as any other country on planet earth is hard to defend... but you chuckleheads sure try to make it sound good...
 
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#354
#354
evillawyer said:
This all started when someone claimed, in jest, that Kim could not possibly have been killed because NK has socialized medicine. My point was that it happens all the time in the US system and our system has more malpractice than many other nationalized systems. Prove me wrong.
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In order to do this you'd have to show us accurate numbers of malpractice in North Korea. How can you possibly do that?

You really come across as an America hater here. If you want to bash our health care system fine. There's plenty of room for improvement but when you go so far as to spin a tale that it's better to go to the hospital in NK or Cuba then you lose all credibility and you expose yourself as one who just hates America and is not living in the real world.

Kim "should" have gotten top notch care there. Much better than its average citizen. If he did indeed die due to poor care then that's a black eye for the country that cannot be overstated.
 
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#356
#356
OHvol40 said:
No leg to stand on huh? I get it, it’s by far the biggest losing issue for Republicans today. Defending our system with millions who don’t have access to care while being twice as expensive as any other country on planet earth is hard to defend... but you chucklehead sure try to make it sound good...
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B7C8A686-D183-498B-AA30-F1FC0F389CA0.jpeg
 
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#357
#357
0nelilreb said:
Can you give me an example of just one program that the federal government took over or is in charge of , where the the quality went up , or didn’t get worse and the cost went down or didn’t go up ? Just one in our entire history .
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You’re saying that something that basically the entire developed world does we are incapable of. Why, specifically, would it be so much harder for the US to do?
 
#358
#358
82_VOL_83 said:
If healthcare is a major issue for you and the US system sucks so bad, leave. This isnt malicious, it just seems that many of you are extremely unhappy. You should just go. Rest assured, you won't be missed and no one will worry about you.
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Really? Leave?

No one has said the healthcare system "sucks", so stop inventing points to arguments that aren't being had. I've simply pointed out the data that shows where the US falls on access, efficacy, equity and outcomes - which is near the bottom on average from our peers - and we pay double the cost per person. This isn't opinion and it's not anecdotal - facts don't vanish because it decimates this warped sense of American exceptionalism that we believe is exuded by every nook and cranny of our country.
 
#359
#359
OHvol40 said:
It’s all about ethics and priorities. If the priority is profit then it can never be the patient. That’s why you, as a patient, pay at least twice as much as the next highest developed nation in healthcare per capita. Do you enjoy that?
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Americans by and far cost more to take care of as well due to their lifestyle choices. It’s apple and oranges to compare. If we were a 3rd world African muslim dictatorship with 50 doctors and didnt have regulations, we probably would be just as cheap on the costs. If we were a small population country with 98% oil-rich white people like Norway, we probably wouldn’t have the number a diabetes or obesity or meth related BS to have to cover too so our deaths would be lower
 
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#360
#360
OHvol40 said:
No leg to stand on huh? I get it, it’s by far the biggest losing issue for Republicans today. Defending our system with millions who don’t have access to care while being twice as expensive as any other country on planet earth is hard to defend... but you chucklehead sure try to make it sound good...
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Everyone has access to care. That’s a lie
 
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#362
#362
Rickyvol77 said:
Everyone has access to care. That’s a lie
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Except the ACL that BO spoke about would bankrupt some families here, whereas higher quality care in other parts of the planet would not.

See the difference?

Didn't you say you were an RN? I've never met an RN that believed that our private insurance based system wasn't a complete shtshow, this may be a first.
 
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#365
#365
Rickyvol77 said:
Americans by and far cost more to take care of as well due to their lifestyle choices. It’s apple and oranges to compare. If we were a 3rd world African muslim dictatorship with 50 doctors and didnt have regulations, we probably would be just as cheap on the costs. If we were a small population country with 98% oil-rich white people like Norway, we probably wouldn’t have the number a diabetes or obesity or meth related BS to have to cover too so our deaths would be lower
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Demographics, geography, governmental system, religion, race, or lifestyle have nothing to do with providing access the entirety of your population. It also has nothing to do with charging 20x more for a medication that is available worldwide at much more affordable rates.
 
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#366
#366
Septic said:
That's exactly what he said. That's literally why he's trying to walk it back as sarcasm.
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No, it wasn't. He was spitballing, and he wasn't talking about Clorox in a syringe. C'mon man. Yeah walking it back was dumb, but the original words were not.
 
#367
#367
0nelilreb said:
Can you give me an example of just one program that the federal government took over or is in charge of , where the the quality went up , or didn’t get worse and the cost went down or didn’t go up ? Just one in our entire history .
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The TVA. They did a pretty good job diminishing flood damage, promoting agriculture and electrifying the South. It's still a government agency and does a good job today.
 
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#371
#371
Septic said:
Perfect, seize on an outlier to shore up a defeated argument.

You suggested the care and outcomes would be "nonexistent", the data says otherwise. In fact it shows how COMPLETELY wrong you are. Perhaps you could trot out another anecdotal fringe issue that will demonstrate on how the data is wrong?



“Most troubling, the U.S. fails to achieve better health outcomes than the other countries, and as shown in the earlier editions, the U.S. is last or near last on dimensions of access, efficiency, and equity.”

You can read the full report here: Commonwealth Fund Report (Update. According to 2017, the USA still ranks 11th)

Health Care System Performance Rankings
2017-international-health-rankings-800x231.png

Source: Commonwealth Fund analysis
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Question becomes a two part question....if we intend to keep our system what are the big changes to be made? Wrt our current private medical insurance, the tail wags the dog in many cases with insurance dictating terms of treatment (x before y and y before z) creating an inefficient process and inserting themselves between doctor and patient unnecessarily (one example among a long list of other issues). And if we choose to switch to one of the models above, what are we willing to give up in terms of other social programs at $24T in debt? IMO, we go down to 2-3 basic services if we go down that road. Healthcare, Social Security and XXX (?). Maybe the remaining few programs go down to the state level with smaller block grants. We have friends that were over here from Australia working for a period of time and have since gone back. The conversations with them were very interesting regarding the Australian system.
 
#372
#372
SpaceCoastVol said:
No, it wasn't. He was spitballing, and he wasn't talking about Clorox in a syringe. C'mon man. Yeah walking it back was dumb, but the original words were not.
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LOL, c'mon man. There's video, he said that sht and now he's walking it back, like a little btch.

When is his base going to stop shoveling nickles in his supermarket clown car ride and figure out they're supporting an imbecile?
 
#373
#373
OHvol40 said:
No leg to stand on huh? I get it, it’s by far the biggest losing issue for Republicans today. Defending our system with millions who don’t have access to care while being twice as expensive as any other country on planet earth is hard to defend... but you chucklehead sure try to make it sound good...
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Everyone has access to health care. Everyone has access to health insurance. Those who "dont have access" choose so willingly.
 
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#374
#374
Septic said:
LOL, c'mon man. There's video, he said that sht and now he's walking it back, like a little btch.

When is his base going to stop shoveling nickles in his supermarket clown car ride and figure out they're supporting a imbecile?
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Yeah. 72 was correct.
 
#375
#375
OHvol40 said:
Exactly. This is the response from people trying to prop up a position that is illogical and, oddly, against their own interests. Defending a system where you pay double and aren’t guaranteed coverage sounds really dumb... because it is.
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You just doubled down on your straw man. Based on your posting history I’m not shocked one bit.
 
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