This is why I respect Boise State and Chris Petersen

#51
#51
tvolsfan said:
Who is the best team they have beaten? Serious question, I haven't looked it up. I do know they're record against the top teams in the country has been unbelievably terrible, and I think their only win came against a team starting Brock Berlin at quarterback and coached by Larry Coker.
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You can't say anything beyond this year shouldn't count for BSU, and then criticize this year's Virginia Tech team for not beating highly ranked opponents much in previous years. THIS YEAR Virginia Tech was seen as a top 15 type team, are winning their conference, and are creeping up to that ranking again. THIS YEAR. And Boise State traveled across the entire country and beat them in their own backyard.

That is not equal to beating Utah in a conference game, when TCU was already favored.
 
#52
#52
rjd970 said:
See, this is what I don't understand about all this "BSU sucks until they play anybody" argument. Who says this is completely their decision? Name one conference that has come up and said "We want Boise in our family". It is absurd to think Boise can just say that they want to play in the PAC 10 and then it is so.

Again, name one thing Boise has complete control over that they haven't done yet.
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Boise refused to play Nebraska, because Nebraska would not pay them $1 million dollars... They can't complain that nobody will play them when they claim to be a legit power and still want to be paid to play the big boys.
 
#53
#53
IPorange said:
You can't say anything beyond this year shouldn't count for BSU, and then criticize this year's Virginia Tech team for not beating highly ranked opponents much in previous years. THIS YEAR Virginia Tech was seen as a top 15 type team, are winning their conference, and are creeping up to that ranking again. THIS YEAR. And Boise State traveled across the entire country and beat them in their own backyard.

That is not equal to beating Utah in a conference game, when TCU was already favored.
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What does that have to do with it? And why doesn't it compare. I see no reason to think VT is better than Utah.
 
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#55
#55
timmy said:
Of course not. It doesn't fit in your obvious hatred of all things Boise.
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Yeah, that must be it. I hate Idaho. There's no other argument for criticizing a team that couldn't defend their home field against James Madison.
 
#56
#56
rjd970 said:
I honestly don't care either way when it comes to TCU and Boise. I just think one of them deserves a shot at the big dance. If they get destroyed, so be it.

As far as TCU victory over Utah, ehh whatever. TCU hasn't done anything Boise hasn't done.
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When has Boise beaten a team ranked in the Top 10 on the road by 40 points?
 
#59
#59
rjd970 said:
57-4 is ridiculous. At that rate, Peterson will reach 100 wins before he reaches 10 losses.
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Peterson is having basically the same level of success at Boise that Dan Hawkins did after Hawkins built the program. Hawkins went undefeated in the WAC every year just like Peterson, but he's been an abysmal failure at a major conference school. What would make anybody think that Peterson would do any better in a real conference?
 
#61
#61
Vercingetorix said:
Peterson is having basically the same level of success at Boise that Dan Hawkins did after Hawkins built the program. Hawkins went undefeated in the WAC every year just like Peterson, but he's been an abysmal failure at a major conference school. What would make anybody think that Peterson would do any better in a real conference?
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I don't know. The fact that BSU is playing at a higher level than have at any time during their history?
 
#62
#62
^ That is the same line I heard ad nauseum from SEC honks when Florida picked Urban up out of Utah.
 
#63
#63
milohimself said:
Not even close. Petersen has Boise playing at a much, much higher level than Hawkins ever did.
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Boise under Dan Hawkins:

2001 Boise State 8–4 6–2 2nd
2002 Boise State 12–1 8–0 1st
2003 Boise State 13–1 8–0 1st
2004 Boise State 11–1 8–0 1st
2005 Boise State 9–4 7–1 1st

After his first year, Hawkins lost one conference game in four seasons. The four losses in 2005 include at Georgia, a nailbiter to Oregon State, and the bowl game. (Cf. Boise's 2007 season under Petersen, which included losses to 4-9 Washington, Hawaii, and 8-5 East Carolina.) Petersen's doing better at Boise, but not "much, much" better.

Hawkins established the method -- Boise takes kids that can't get into Pac-10 schools, whether it's for grades or behavior or whatever. Which is why it's fruitless to talk about how Boise would fare if they played in a so-called real conference -- if they did, they couldn't take most of the guys on their roster, and then they wouldn't be Boise anymore. If they had to adhere to the same standards that major conference schools do, then suddenly all those California kids would forget about going to college up in Idaho, and Boise would be done.
 
#64
#64
milohimself said:
^ That is the same line I heard ad nauseum from SEC honks when Florida picked Urban up out of Utah.
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I was a so-called SEC honk who gnashed my teeth over the Meyer hire, because he'd taken a shiat program to the Fiesta Bowl in two years. I knew he was a great hire for the Alligators. Petersen's just doing the same stuff in Boise that Hawkins did. If the guy that built the Boise program sucked out loud in a major conference, once he suddenly couldn't take all the questionable kids anymore, why should we think his successor would fare any differently?
 
#65
#65
They would, and I absolutely agree with you, but as Boise gets local run since they are relatively near by, I've seen plenty of them, so let me offer some clarifications:

1. Dan Hawkins is not responsible for Boise's formula for midmajor domination, Dirk Koetter started the process of getting BSU where they are when he took over for Houston Nutt in '98.

2. Assuming Boise goes undefeated, Petersen will be 35-1 (I think?) in conference. Hawkins won a high percentage of conference games, but not at the level as Petersen is, and he never had a season where he won every single league game in a blowout (except 2002... and got destroyed 41-14 in Fayetteville). On top of that, again assuming winning out this year, except for losing by a hair, Petersen is a one point TCU loss away in '08 from posting four undefeated seasons in five years. That's with two BCS bowl wins.

Lastly, look at this year: I'm not advocating for Boise here, but getting your team motivated to execute a route ten times in a year is something all but the best two or three teams in cfb aren't capable of. It really does speak to a coach's ability to motivate, and at this point I simply don't respect the opinion of anybody who discredits Petersen's coaching ability. The man can get it done.
 
#66
#66
Vercingetorix said:
I was a so-called SEC honk who gnashed my teeth over the Meyer hire, because he'd taken a shiat program to the Fiesta Bowl in two years. I knew he was a great hire for the Alligators. Petersen's just doing the same stuff in Boise that Hawkins did. If the guy that built the Boise program sucked out loud in a major conference, once he suddenly couldn't take all the questionable kids anymore, why should we think his successor would fare any differently?
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I invite you to watch games from the Hawkins era vs. a Petersen game from this year. They are miles apart.
 
#67
#67
I don't know why Boise is spending so much time crying. All they have to do is be smart and they'll have the stage all to themselves. Instead of crying about being left out of the BCS title game, they should simply start lobbying for a shot in the bigtime. Not a Fiesta Bowl against a multi loss Big 12 team. Not an Orange Bowl tilt with whatever dreck the ACC championship game produces. If Boise is so concerned about being underappreciated, have Peterson come out and say they aren't interested in being on the undercard anymore. Say you want Ohio State or Wisconsin in the Rose Bowl. Say you want the SEC champ in the Sugar Bowl. I'm pretty sure if they get their sycophants in the media to cry loud enough for them, the folks in charge will be glad to oblige.
 
#68
#68
And Petersen is doing just the opposite. He's keeping his head down and saying "We're just worried about winning the games on our schedule."

It will help them stay focused, but at the same time he won't be getting any pub for a big time bowl.

Boise even making a BCS game this year might be questionable; if they and TCU run the table, Boise is getting left behind.
 
#69
#69
milohimself said:
And Petersen is doing just the opposite. He's keeping his head down and saying "We're just worried about winning the games on our schedule."

It will help them stay focused, but at the same time he won't be getting any pub for a big time bowl.

Boise even making a BCS game this year might be questionable; if they and TCU run the table, Boise is getting left behind.
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There are multiple at large spots and Boise will be guaranteed a BCS slot by being in the Top 5. Thus, they can start talking now. No more playing a two loss Oklahoma team with a converted WR at QB or another non AQ party crasher. Call out Ohio State or the SEC every day from now til the selections are made. Pretty sure the powers that be will be more than happy to honor their request.
 
#70
#70
I don't totally discredit Petersen's ability to coach. I just think it's an unknown, as far as major-conference standards go. Unlike Meyer, he took over a team that was already so far ahead of its conference opponents that it had only lost one game in four years. Petersen took over a team that was already boringly stomping its entire conference into the ground every year. I find that less impressive. If an SEC team hired him this offseason, I would worry about him a whole lot less than I did when Meyer was hired. Petersen has no record of winning when he doesn't have better players than almost every one of his opponents.
 
#71
#71
milohimself said:
I invite you to watch games from the Hawkins era vs. a Petersen game from this year. They are miles apart.
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Okay, here's 2002. Other than getting crushed by Arkansas, the scores look like exactly what you'd expect from this year's Boise team. They blew out everybody. How exactly is this "miles apart" from what Boise is doing this year?


8/31 vs. Idaho (2-10) W 38 21
9/7 @ Arkansas (9-5) L 14 41
9/14 @ Wyoming (2-10) W 35 13
9/28 vs. Utah State (4-7) W 63 38
10/5 vs. *Hawaii (10-4) W 58 31
10/12 @ *Tulsa (1-11) W 52 24
10/18 vs. *Fresno State (9-5) W 67 21
10/26 @ *San Jose State (6-7) W 45 8
11/2 @ *Texas-El Paso (2-10) W 58 3
11/9 vs. *Rice (4-7) W 49 7
11/16 vs. *Louisiana Tech (4-8) W 36 10
11/23 @ *Nevada (5-7) W 44 7
12/31 vs. Iowa State (7-7) W 34 16 @ Boise, ID Humanitarian Bowl

12-1-0

593 240
 
#72
#72
Vercingetorix said:
Okay, here's 2002. Other than getting crushed by Arkansas, the scores look like exactly what you'd expect from this year's Boise team. They blew out everybody. How exactly is this "miles apart" from what Boise is doing this year?


8/31 vs. Idaho (2-10) W 38 21
9/7 @ Arkansas (9-5) L 14 41
9/14 @ Wyoming (2-10) W 35 13
9/28 vs. Utah State (4-7) W 63 38
10/5 vs. *Hawaii (10-4) W 58 31
10/12 @ *Tulsa (1-11) W 52 24
10/18 vs. *Fresno State (9-5) W 67 21
10/26 @ *San Jose State (6-7) W 45 8
11/2 @ *Texas-El Paso (2-10) W 58 3
11/9 vs. *Rice (4-7) W 49 7
11/16 vs. *Louisiana Tech (4-8) W 36 10
11/23 @ *Nevada (5-7) W 44 7
12/31 vs. Iowa State (7-7) W 34 16 @ Boise, ID Humanitarian Bowl

12-1-0

593 240
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Let's see two wins over winning teams and a blowout loss to Arkansas.

As of last week (haven't checked this week), Boise St. is #1 in Total defense, and their offense is unstoppable. They have wins over Va. Tech and Oregon St. and just got done shutting down one of the best passing offenses in the NCAA that just torched USC. You really cannot watching Hawkins and Peterson and tell me that is the same team. Guess what, 3 teams in the top 4 return virtually every starter from last year. 2 of those teams Boise St. beat, and they are that much better this year than last.
 
#73
#73
tvols75 said:
Guess what, 3 teams in the top 4 return virtually every starter from last year. 2 of those teams Boise St. beat, and they are that much better this year than last.
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And in 1998 Tennessee beat both Alabama and Florida. So what? Success against a past version of a team counts for nothing. Even if it is recent...
 
#74
#74
I could be wrong -- often am -- but as I watch BSU it still seems to me that they would be thrashed by an Alabama or Auburn, and probably lose to an LSU, Florida, or South Carolina by a wide margin. Certainly, if they played an SEC schedule they'd have more than a few losses every year.
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#75
#75
Boise doesn't want to join a big time conference. If they have to adhere to the same admission requirements that everyone else in a big conference has to, the pipeline to Cali is done.

Boise's done a great job getting their name out and about. They've rode a win over an Oklahoma team as far they can in my eyes. I want them to play an LSU or Alabama or Nebraska or Wisconsin or an Ohio State team. I really do because I truly believe Boise gets demolished by any of those teams.

TCU is a more physical team. I like their chances a whole hell of a lot more than a Boise State.
 
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