Turkey: Our NATO Ally

[LouderVol]

Perhaps, but that's an awful long time for a man to be absent from his public leadership role, especially for a "paternity leave is for Western gays" kind of guy, as I imagine Putin probably is.

In somewhat related news, according to Sputnik, Russia is currently petitioning Turkey for access to Incirlik Air Base.

My what a difference a few months makes! We go from wondering if Turkey and Russia are going to war with one another to wondering if they're going to form a new alliance and kick the US out of its joint nuclear air base in Turkey.

Just goes to show that you never know what these dictators are up to.

link for Incirlik?

again it seems like Turkey is trying to get itself kicked out of NATO. I have idea if thats even possible.

 

[davethevol]

link for Incirlik?

again it seems like Turkey is trying to get itself kicked out of NATO. I have idea if thats even possible.

Or they are trying to start the final world war. I seriously wouldn't put that past them at this point.

 

[Pacer92]

Or they are trying to start the final world war. I seriously wouldn't put that past them at this point.

Certainly a dangerous game. Aligning Turkey with Russia, China and Iran looks to be a real possibility...

The first mistake is us trying to unseat Assad. The second is using dirty regimes like Turkey and Saudi Arabia to help do it. I'd trust Iran with nukes before either of these two countries...

 

[volprof]

link for Incirlik?

again it seems like Turkey is trying to get itself kicked out of NATO. I have idea if thats even possible.

Kremlin Presses Turkey for Access to NATO's Incirlik Air Base, Home to US Nukes

And then there's this:

https://www.rt.com/news/356626-russia-turkey-incirlik-airbase/

The autocratic world seems to be aligning once again. Meanwhile, self-loathing Westerners wonder whether or not their societies are worth it anymore. The last time this happened, it ended well.

 

[Grand Vol]

Kremlin Presses Turkey for Access to NATO's Incirlik Air Base, Home to US Nukes

And then there's this:

https://www.rt.com/news/356626-russia-turkey-incirlik-airbase/

The autocratic world seems to be aligning once again. Meanwhile, self-loathing Westerners wonder whether or not their societies are worth it anymore. The last time this happened, it ended well.

As well as this:

Incirlik Airbase is a Bargaining Chip and Blackmail Tool Between Turkey, US

Which is probably closer to the truth than we care to admit.

 

[volprof]

As well as this:

Incirlik Airbase is a Bargaining Chip and Blackmail Tool Between Turkey, US

Which is probably closer to the truth than we care to admit.

Yes, it's a blackmail tool. There's no doubt about that. Unlike Dr. Sputnik, however, you and I both know it was an Erdogan false flag and not an American-led coup. Erdogan is pushing the Americans, because he knows that capitalizing on historic levels of anti-American sentiment (that already existed there; Turkey is one of the most anti-American countries on Earth, only Allah knows why) is the best route for him throwing a slick one over his gullible, impassioned populace. Erdogan knows good and damn well what happened. He's just going to try to play upon his people's hate of all things America to completely impose his power, unabated.

The only question for me is how far this guy is willing to play the game just to have his own little slice of Heaven in Turkey. He knows we aren't going to give over Gulen, because Gulen had absolutely nothing to do with this, so how far is Erdogan willing to take this game?

I honestly don't know. I don't think he's that stupid, but, then again, he doesn't strike me as a very intelligent man (unlike Putin, who is extremely savvy, albeit strategically inept). He gets overly emotional about tweets and has people imprisoned as such. He strikes me as a novice on the world stage, who, while he may be able to pull slick ones on his people, doesn't quite grasp the gravity of the world beyond (once again, unlike Putin).

Once Obama is out, whether it's Trump or Clinton, I expect this clown to be put in his place if he keeps pursuing this route. That, or he will have to be willing to go to war for his sins and die horribly as another Saddam Hussein figure.

 

[davethevol]

Yes, it's a blackmail tool. There's no doubt about that. Unlike Dr. Sputnik, however, you and I both know it was an Erdogan false flag and not an American-led coup. Erdogan is pushing the Americans, because he knows that capitalizing on historic levels of anti-American sentiment (that already existed there; Turkey is one of the most anti-American countries on Earth, only Allah knows why) is the best route for him throwing a slick one over his gullible, impassioned populace. Erdogan knows good and damn well what happened. He's just going to try to play upon his people's hate of all things America to completely impose his power, unabated.

The only question for me is how far this guy is willing to play the game just to have his own little slice of Heaven in Turkey. He knows we aren't going to give over Gulen, because Gulen had absolutely nothing to do with this, so how far is Erdogan willing to take this game?

I honestly don't know. I don't think he's that stupid, but, then again, he doesn't strike me as a very intelligent man (unlike Putin, who is extremely savvy, albeit strategically inept). He gets overly emotional about tweets and has people imprisoned as such. He strikes me as a novice on the world stage, who, while he may be able to pull slick ones on his people, doesn't quite grasp the gravity of the world beyond (once again, unlike Putin).

Once Obama is out, whether it's Trump or Clinton, I expect this clown to be put in his place if he keeps pursuing this route. That, or he will have to be willing to go to war for his sins and die horribly as another Saddam Hussein figure.

I think Erdogan is a radical Islamist that just hasn't shown his true colors yet. You watch, he is going to try and play the West against Russia. I still think that when Turkey shot down the Russian planes he was trying to start a war then and get NATO involved, and when that didn't work he started dividing a new plan which is unfolding now.

 

[Pacer92]

I think Erdogan is a radical Islamist that just hasn't shown his true colors yet. You watch, he is going to try and play the West against Russia. I still think that when Turkey shot down the Russian planes he was trying to start a war then and get NATO involved, and when that didn't work he started dividing a new plan which is unfolding now.

Our government knew this guy was a POS going way back. We made a deal with the him in effort to weaken Russia via Syria..

And you're right about shooting the plane down...and it backfired. Putin kept his cool, as usual, and has exploited once again that WE do business with the bad guys..

 

[LouderVol]

Our government knew this guy was a POS going way back. We made a deal with the him in effort to weaken Russia via Syria..

And you're right about shooting the plane down...and it backfired. Putin kept his cool, as usual, and has exploited once again that WE do business with the bad guys..

ok how is Russia dealing with Erdogan any different than the US dealing with Erdogan

 

[Pacer92]

ok how is Russia dealing with Erdogan any different than the US dealing with Erdogan

It's pretty obvious that we want him removed now, regardless of the msm(staged his own coup malarkey)...

He's like Saddam and Gadaffi...he's our ally until he can't help us anymore..

That's the difference..

 

[LouderVol]

It's pretty obvious that we want him removed now, regardless of the msm(staged his own coup malarkey)...

He's like Saddam and Gadaffi...he's our ally until he can't help us anymore..

That's the difference..

ok let me get this straight. you think there was an actual coup against Erdogan that had all of 100 military members involved and the highest ranked person was a major or colonel? and that while all of this strife was going on the heroic Erdogan was able to just somehow round 6000+ people who don't agree with him (or us but you know msm blah blah blah) all high ranking officials. all the while he changed their constitution so he has more power. and the coup happened in the capital while he wasn't even there? he was up on the Black Sea coast.


and again he goes from an evil terrorist supporter while buddy buddy to the US; to a generally good guy with some minor character flaws once he starts talking to Russia?

"The US shouldn't be involved with this guy at all"
"Kudos to Russia and Putin for making friends with this guy"

 

[volprof]

It's pretty obvious that we want him removed now, regardless of the msm(staged his own coup malarkey)...

He's like Saddam and Gadaffi...he's our ally until he can't help us anymore..

That's the difference..

Your anti-MSM rage blinds you. No one in the MSM, whatever that is to you, has said it was his own false flag. That's only learned intelligence community observers and analysts, as well as myself. We say this because this is what actually happened, according to all available evidence.

And you better start learning to sing Erdogan's praises, or else Orthodox Jesus is going to pull your paycheck.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

and again he goes from an evil terrorist supporter while buddy buddy to the US; to a generally good guy with some minor character flaws once he starts talking to Russia?

"The US shouldn't be involved with this guy at all"
"Kudos to Russia and Putin for making friends with this guy"

I've answered this already. Why do you continue to deal in misinformation and distortion?

I bet they forget all about Erdogan's sins now.

What would be the problem with that? What is the matter with having a peaceful resolution to a conflict? Putin on two occasions in the past year could have turned over the chessboard and kicked off WWIII, but did not. The downing of a Russian airliner and the shooting down of a Russian fighter that was allegedly in Turkish airspace could have easily been the spark that lit the fuse.

Now, instead of talking about war, they are talking about commerce and trade. This is how our Founders would have envisioned and dreamed of having conflicts end.

 

[Grand Vol]

it's pretty obvious that we want him removed now, regardless of the msm(staged his own coup malarkey)...

He's like saddam and gadaffi...he's our ally until he can't help us anymore..

That's the difference..

wtf?

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

wtf?

Pretty clear what he said. Can it even be denied?

 

[volprof]

I've answered this already. Why do you continue to deal in misinformation and distortion?

So you think two autocratic butt buddies potentially threatening and blackmailing us over a nuclear base we built is a stabilizing move that will bring peace to the region?

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

So you think two autocratic butt buddies potentially threatening and blackmailing us over a nuclear base we built is a stabilizing move that will bring peace to the region?

We never should have had nukes over there anyway once the Cuban Missile Crisis agreement was finalized. The fact that nukes are there is the destabilizing force that stands in the way of peace.

 

[volprof]

We never should have had nukes over there anyway once the Cuban Missile Crisis agreement was finalized. The fact that nukes are there is the destabilizing force that stands in the way of peace.

I disagree that it is a destabilizing move that stands in the way of peace. It's only that when an unstable regime, like Erdogan's, is in power.

I agree that we should have never had them there in the first place. That was a poor move, one that failed to anticipate how Turkey has always tipped back and forth between enlightenment and the dark ages.

 

[Grand Vol]

We never should have had nukes over there anyway once the Cuban Missile Crisis agreement was finalized. The fact that nukes are there is the destabilizing force that stands in the way of peace.

Read up on your history. The deal during the Cuban Missile Crisis was to remove the Jupiter Missiles from Turkey.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Read up on your history. The deal during the Cuban Missile Crisis was to remove the Jupiter Missiles from Turkey.

The point is that we have missiles over there to begin with.

What was you issue about the Saddam/Ghadaffi comment earlier?

 

[Grand Vol]

The point is that we have missiles over there to begin with.

What was you issue about the Saddam/Ghadaffi comment earlier?

Perhaps you should become educated on what weapon systems are in place before you actually start going off the deep end.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B61_nuclear_bomb

Not a missile. Hence "bomb" in the nomenclature.

And my issue wasn't with the Saddam/Qaddafi reference. It's with the "we want him removed now" nonsense. And it doesn't take a fool to recognize the coup very well might have been orchestrated by Erdogan himself. Of the conspiracy theories you tend to believe in, this one should have made the most sense to you. It certainly isn't a great leap of the imagination to think it gave him the perfect opportunity to "clean the slate" of his political rivals.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Perhaps you should become educated on what weapon systems are in place before you actually start going off the deep end.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B61_nuclear_bomb

Not a missile. Hence "bomb" in the nomenclature.

You're obviously wanting to engage in hair splitting instead of addressing the major point. What difference does it make if the nukes allegedly there are on Jupiter Missiles, bottle rockets, bombs, pigeons, whatever? The major issue was that if nukes are still there, they shouldn't be there.

Why not address that?

 

[volprof]

Perhaps you should become educated on what weapon systems are in place before you actually start going off the deep end.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B61_nuclear_bomb

Not a missile. Hence "bomb" in the nomenclature.

And my issue wasn't with the Saddam/Qaddafi reference. It's with the "we want him removed now" nonsense. And it doesn't take a fool to recognize the coup very well might have been orchestrated by Erdogan himself. Of the conspiracy theories you tend to believe in, this one should have made the most sense to you. It certainly isn't a great leap of the imagination to think it gave him the perfect opportunity to "clean the slate" of his political rivals.

All the "rebels" reported that they thought they were going on a military exercise. Meanwhile, Erdogan had some of them and some citizen bystanders shot and killed, a parliament building bombed, etc., a la Yany and Putin in Ukraine, just to make it look like it was real.

The only thing surprising about this false flag is completely unrelated - that Putin hasn't thought of doing this himself. However, when you can have your intelligence buddies just extrajudicially kill off all your enemies, as the world just bats its eyelashes, I guess you don't need to take the risk of a false coup.

 

[Grand Vol]

You're obviously wanting to engage in hair splitting instead of addressing the major point. What difference does it make if the nukes allegedly there are on Jupiter Missiles, bottle rockets, bombs, pigeons, whatever? The major issue was that if nukes are still there, they shouldn't be there.

Why not address that?

Before you, again, get crazy with the Cheese Whiz, perhaps you could enlighten me on when said nukes were placed in the MUN Sites in Europe.

As well as how many the Soviets had in East Europe/Warsaw Pact during the Cold War.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

And my issue wasn't with the Saddam/Qaddafi reference. It's with the "we want him removed now" nonsense. And it doesn't take a fool to recognize the coup very well might have been orchestrated by Erdogan himself. Of the conspiracy theories you tend to believe in, this one should have made the most sense to you. It certainly isn't a great leap of the imagination to think it gave him the perfect opportunity to "clean the slate" of his political rivals.

I don't know if we want him removed or who orchestrated the coup. It very well could have been an inside job/false flag by Erdogan. But in regards to your outrage about "we want him removed", I don't understand the outrage. As far as I'm concerned, I've been very consistent in my belief that we don't need to meddle in other people's business... all we need to do is promote trade and commerce and that is it. On the other hand, some on the right (not necessarily you, but I wouldn't doubt you've done so in the past) have no issue with regime change and Colour Revolutions. Why all of a sudden is there so much unease about removing Erdogan?