UT under potential NCAA investigation for NIL

[CAVPUT]

Texas AM is on their dance card. Their hands are full right now

At least we're #1 on one list.

 

[DaddyChad]

At least we're #1 on one list.

Nobody wants sloppy seconds from the ncaa when we get done with them in court.

 

[Woodlawn VOL]

Texas AM is on their dance card. Their hands are full right now

Ohio State spending a lot too! Where is the ncaa on that? Cause the NCAA cherry picks the perceived easy way out. Only this time they poked Big Orange Bear one time to many and he turned into a Orange Grizzly Bear! GBO

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

NIL isn't school related. We've established that lots of people get NIL that don't play sports. The NCAA and schools have NO RIGHT to restrict private contracts an individual signs NOR when they sign them. It's an instant lawsuit.

Please tell me WHY the NCAA or school should be able to restrict anything about NIL? They tried the "it's good for competition" argument with the educational benefits in Alston and the SCOTUS went 9-0 saying individual rights are more important than your business interests.

Exactly WHY does the NCAA have any right to regulate NIL at any level. PLEASE read the Alston decision. The NCAA CANNOT restrict individual rights in order to keep their business model working.

This is EXACTLY the Antitrust Law issue they're about to get drilled on again.

The decision smacked the NCAA for trying to deny players the first dollar of NIL. Those days are gone. They cannot restrict the amount any individual can get from any legal source for their own value. They will welcome them to join ANY team that will allocate a counter or PWO slot and NIL cap space.

What part of the courts decision denied the NCAA the ability to maintain competitive balance by regulating professional income by players regardless of source? Why would they deny them the right to require reporting income in support of that effort?

Every team starts with 85 schollies, 20 PWO’s and X dollars of NIL cap space to build a roster. Adding NIL since it has been forced on them.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

The decision smacked the NCAA for trying to deny players the first dollar of NIL. Those days are gone. They cannot restrict the amount any individual can get from any legal source for their own value. They will welcome them to join ANY team that will allocate a counter or PWO slot and NIL cap space.

What part of the courts decision denied the NCAA the ability to maintain competitive balance by regulating professional income by players regardless of source? Why would they deny them the right to require reporting income in support of that effort?

Every team starts with 85 schollies, 20 PWO’s and X dollars of NIL cap space to build a roster. Adding NIL since it has been forced on them.

The NCAA and schools can't legally regulate NIL. I'm unsure why you're pursuing this idea.

The SCOTUS will quickly deal with any attempt to restrict NIL amounts. And make no mistake, limiting schools to a certain NIL will be met by lawsuits from the schools first, as it limits them in pursuing the best players. It literally stymies competition for the best players.

Further, why is it the NCAA's or the school's business what a player earns. This is America. If the players or ANYONE can market their NIL, any attempt to limit it in any way will be sued out of existence.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

The decision smacked the NCAA for trying to deny players the first dollar of NIL. Those days are gone. They cannot restrict the amount any individual can get from any legal source for their own value. They will welcome them to join ANY team that will allocate a counter or PWO slot and NIL cap space.

What part of the courts decision denied the NCAA the ability to maintain competitive balance by regulating professional income by players regardless of source? Why would they deny them the right to require reporting income in support of that effort?

Every team starts with 85 schollies, 20 PWO’s and X dollars of NIL cap space to build a roster. Adding NIL since it has been forced on them.

This is a direct quote from Justice Kavanaugh:

"All of the restaurants in a region cannot come together to cut cooks’ wages on the theory that 'customers prefer' to eat food from low-paid cooks. Law firms cannot conspire to cabin lawyers’ salaries in the name of providing legal services out of a 'love of the law.' Hospitals cannot agree to cap nurses’ income in order to create a 'purer' form of helping the sick. News organizations cannot join forces to curtail pay to reporters to preserve a 'tradition' of public-minded journalism. Movie studios cannot collude to slash benefits to camera crews to kindle a 'spirit of amateurism” in Hollywood."

The NCAA cannot, like a group of restaurants, law firms, hospitals, etc cap wages. Period. Any attempt to establish a "pool" that says "this is enough NIL for ALL the schools" is a cap.

It's a losing idea. Capping the group earnings is capping each individual's potential earnings.

 

[wrangler]

Sure, but you have to meet certain criteria to obtain an injunction. I'm unsure how you can prove the things required until something further occurs regarding this inquiry/investigation/whatever it's formally being called right now.

Apparently the NCAA made its intentions clear enough, and its indication of planned future actions was enough to make UT think that it could make a case for a TRO. Those of us on the outside don't know all that went on behind the curtain.

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

This is a direct quote from Justice Kavanaugh:

"All of the restaurants in a region cannot come together to cut cooks’ wages on the theory that 'customers prefer' to eat food from low-paid cooks. Law firms cannot conspire to cabin lawyers’ salaries in the name of providing legal services out of a 'love of the law.' Hospitals cannot agree to cap nurses’ income in order to create a 'purer' form of helping the sick. News organizations cannot join forces to curtail pay to reporters to preserve a 'tradition' of public-minded journalism. Movie studios cannot collude to slash benefits to camera crews to kindle a 'spirit of amateurism” in Hollywood."

The NCAA cannot, like a group of restaurants, law firms, hospitals, etc cap wages. Period. Any attempt to establish a "pool" that says "this is enough NIL for ALL the schools" is a cap.

It's a losing idea. Capping the group earnings is capping each individual's potential earnings.

Once again, there will be no attempt to regulate any amount of money to any individual, but forcing a competitive distribution of the market driven NIL deals across the hundreds of MEMBER schools by capping the amount of NIL dollars they can add to their roster, JUST LIKE THEY DO WITH SCHOLLIES. The NCAA will get more latitude than the NFL since the distribution of NIL can impact the distribution of talent, a problem that does not exist in the NFL where primary regulation is requirement for players to enter through the draft regardless of NIL type deals. In fact it could probably be proven that the draft is more impactive on the individual since it tends to force control of the top talent to the least powerful small market teams. Competitive balance is the driving logic in both organizations.

True market value is pretty much unquestioned in the professional ranks and primarily negotiated not only after the draft, but after a year or two. In the NCAA they are backing the flow of money back into the HS ranks.

 

[jcvols24]

Once again, there will be no attempt to regulate any amount of money to any individual, but forcing a competitive distribution of the market driven NIL deals across the hundreds of MEMBER schools by capping the amount of NIL dollars they can add to their roster, JUST LIKE THEY DO WITH SCHOLLIES. The NCAA will get more latitude than the NFL since the distribution of NIL can impact the distribution of talent, a problem that does not exist in the NFL where primary regulation is requirement for players to enter through the draft regardless of NIL type deals. In fact it could probably be proven that the draft is more impactive on the individual since it tends to force control of the top talent to the least powerful small market teams. Competitive balance is the driving logic in both organizations.

True market value is pretty much unquestioned in the professional ranks and primarily negotiated not only after the draft, but after a year or two. In the NCAA they are backing the flow of money back into the HS ranks.

The problem with this is you are tasking the colleges with capping something that they can't control. They don't pay for NIL.

Let's say you had a max NIL roster. Nike comes in and wants to sign your QB to an NIL deal and he agrees. This was a business decision between 2 people/company in which the college had zero say. Limiting that opportunity to a person will never fly in court.

 

[CAVPUT]

Once again, there will be no attempt to regulate any amount of money to any individual, but forcing a competitive distribution of the market driven NIL deals across the hundreds of MEMBER schools by capping the amount of NIL dollars they can add to their roster, JUST LIKE THEY DO WITH SCHOLLIES. The NCAA will get more latitude than the NFL since the distribution of NIL can impact the distribution of talent, a problem that does not exist in the NFL where primary regulation is requirement for players to enter through the draft regardless of NIL type deals. In fact it could probably be proven that the draft is more impactive on the individual since it tends to force control of the top talent to the least powerful small market teams. Competitive balance is the driving logic in both organizations.

True market value is pretty much unquestioned in the professional ranks and primarily negotiated not only after the draft, but after a year or two. In the NCAA they are backing the flow of money back into the HS ranks.

But we're not talking about a "player salary". We're talking about name, image and likeness. That has more local value. It's not like a shoe company is going to jump on to the Nico wagon at this point in his career. Nico will be looking for local opportunities moreso than national which means he has to evaluate what's available to him at each particular school BEFORE he's signed. To attempt to force him to sign then seek out opportunities will limit those opportunities AND limit his negotiating power. Nico and other recruits would be damaged financially.

And let's just stop with the "competitive balance" argument. The NCAA doesn't give a squirt about "balance". Anyone who has watched college football for more than the last year or 2 knows it's been the same programs over and over and over again. Just look at the recruiting rankings. Same names year in and year out at the top. Yeah, I guess you could argue that the best players want to play with on the best rosters, but no one can deny that the portal and NIL have, indeed, leveled the playing field in roster management a bit. And we all know that the "elites" like bama and OSU routinely do things that are the equal or worse than what every other program in the country does yet, it's never those teams under scrutiny or getting "leaks" to ESPN and SI. The NCAA is capricious, biased and selective in rules and their enforcement.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Once again, there will be no attempt to regulate any amount of money to any individual, but forcing a competitive distribution of the market driven NIL deals across the hundreds of MEMBER schools by capping the amount of NIL dollars they can add to their roster, JUST LIKE THEY DO WITH SCHOLLIES. The NCAA will get more latitude than the NFL since the distribution of NIL can impact the distribution of talent, a problem that does not exist in the NFL where primary regulation is requirement for players to enter through the draft regardless of NIL type deals. In fact it could probably be proven that the draft is more impactive on the individual since it tends to force control of the top talent to the least powerful small market teams. Competitive balance is the driving logic in both organizations.

True market value is pretty much unquestioned in the professional ranks and primarily negotiated not only after the draft, but after a year or two. In the NCAA they are backing the flow of money back into the HS ranks.

Once again, schools control how many scholarships they offer and can.

Schools can't control NIL. They'll have no way to keep guys from simply signing more deals. It's illegal for them to prevent it OR when they sign the deals.

You might as well try to ask the schools to regulate the sunshine. They simply can't. Players just sign more deals and if the school dismisses for it, they get sued.

 

[K87vol]

Once again, schools control how many scholarships they offer and can.

Schools can't control NIL. They'll have no way to keep guys from simply signing more deals. It's illegal for them to prevent it OR when they sign the deals.

You might as well try to ask the schools to regulate the sunshine. They simply can't. Players just sign more deals and if the school dismisses for it, they get sued.

I don't even really see it's any of the schools business, and I'd question if they could even inquire or could require the athlete to report NIL funds.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

I don't even really see it's any of the schools business, and I'd question if they could even inquire or could require the athlete to report NIL funds.

The NCAA monitors NIL supposedly only to make sure the deals aren't made by the school (which they are, of course, but they aren't) or pay to play at a school or something like that.

The NCAA KNEW better than to try the "we'll cap the schools, not the players" trick because it's probably illegal via Antitrust to put a school cap or "total NIL value for D1" limit anyway AND it's definitely illegal to dismiss students who signed NIL putting the school over any cap.

 

[Woodlawn VOL]

Once again, there will be no attempt to regulate any amount of money to any individual, but forcing a competitive distribution of the market driven NIL deals across the hundreds of MEMBER schools by capping the amount of NIL dollars they can add to their roster, JUST LIKE THEY DO WITH SCHOLLIES. The NCAA will get more latitude than the NFL since the distribution of NIL can impact the distribution of talent, a problem that does not exist in the NFL where primary regulation is requirement for players to enter through the draft regardless of NIL type deals. In fact it could probably be proven that the draft is more impactive on the individual since it tends to force control of the top talent to the least powerful small market teams. Competitive balance is the driving logic in both organizations.

True market value is pretty much unquestioned in the professional ranks and primarily negotiated not only after the draft, but after a year or two. In the NCAA they are backing the flow of money back into the HS ranks.

The NCAA doesn’t want competitive balance, they loved the old system of letting certain ones fly under the radar while cherry picking who to go after. The NCAA doesn’t care about competitive balance. They want the easiest way for them to control all things to which best suits them.

 

[Remy]

There is no court in this land that is ever going back to a system which allows coaches to negotiate for millions of dollars in contracts and THEN going out on the open market to negotiate for endorsement deals on top of that in my opinion and then?

Restricting players (which is THE product) to fall under a required agreement where their ability to earn on the open market to pittances so the coaches and institutions can exert controls on them, you know treat them as highly thought of slaves. There is NO putting the players earning on the open market back into the bottle imo. What I think will happen is ultimately people are going to question why is a middle man such as the NCAA taking such a huge cut of the overall pie of the money out there for collegiate athletics. Why does the NCAA get a massive cut of the March Madness tv money for example? Why even have a NCAA AND another layer of financial middlemen like conferences at the same time? Screw the NCAA, they need to be tossed into the dust bin of history IMO.

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

Once again, schools control how many scholarships they offer and can.

Schools can't control NIL. They'll have no way to keep guys from simply signing more deals. It's illegal for them to prevent it OR when they sign the deals.

You might as well try to ask the schools to regulate the sunshine. They simply can't. Players just sign more deals and if the school dismisses for it, they get sued.

The schools would have no input on the amount of each deal, The schools will not have to keep up with the amount of each deal, that info will simply be reported to the NCAA BY THE PLAYERS on a waiver to participate with amateurs while earning NIL. Fill it out and you are good. In fact the NCAA would not have to share that data with each school, that would be up to the student, they would only have to let the school know, upon request, if they have room under their cap to take said player. Likewise the clearing house could let a player know if they fit under a specific teams cap.

It is actually a benefit FOR MY DEAL that the schools have NO ability or reason to suppress the amount of each collective's offer to the players. In fact they might hope for a bigger offer. And the NCAA is only a score keeper. They don't care where he plays just counting NIL like they do schollies. Both home free on the suppression front. Both can say bring it on, and the school's can say if we can fit it in we will inform the NCAA to approve the allocation on the NCAA scorecard.

Nothing to impede the player from getting all he can from the collectives so compliance with the SCOTUS ruling seems pretty easy. Once they had to accept NIL at all, the amounts are just variables. Player X represents 1 counter and $200K this period, got it. Can be adjusted next window and be presented to the school for approval or rejection. If rejected, the deal with collective is still good, and the player enters the portal and he finds a new team. Bet if the collective is willing to pay big bucks some team with room will offer. If not, he still has his bigger NIL deal and a paid redshirt year.

If the NCAA wants to go this route I see no problem with compliance by NCAA or the schools. Free money to both. Just an additional pain to manage the cap numbers.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

The schools would have no input on the amount of each deal, The schools will not have to keep up with the amount of each deal, that info will simply be reported to the NCAA BY THE PLAYERS on a waiver to participate with amateurs while earning NIL. Fill it out and you are good. In fact the NCAA would not have to share that data with each school, that would be up to the student, they would only have to let the school know, upon request, if they have room under their cap to take said player. Likewise the clearing house could let a player know if they fit under a specific teams cap.

It is actually a benefit FOR MY DEAL that the schools have NO ability or reason to suppress the amount of each collective's offer to the players. In fact they might hope for a bigger offer. And the NCAA is only a score keeper. They don't care where he plays just counting NIL like they do schollies. Both home free on the suppression front. Both can say bring it on, and the school's can say if we can fit it in we will inform the NCAA to approve the allocation on the NCAA scorecard.

Nothing to impede the player from getting all he can from the collectives so compliance with the SCOTUS ruling seems pretty easy. Once they had to accept NIL at all, the amounts are just variables. Player X represents 1 counter and $200K this period, got it. Can be adjusted next window and be presented to the school for approval or rejection. If rejected, the deal with collective is still good, and the player enters the portal and he finds a new team. Bet if the collective is willing to pay big bucks some team with room will offer. If not, he still has his bigger NIL deal and a paid redshirt year.

If the NCAA wants to go this route I see no problem with compliance by NCAA or the schools. Free money to both. Just an additional pain to manage the cap numbers.

Players can't be told legally, you've signed enough NIL for this year. All the schools have to do is get the players enrolled, THEN sign the NIL for millions.

The school is clear. They were under the cap at the signing.

The player is clear. NO ONE can legally tell them when they can sign an NIL and for how much.

It doesn't work. All it MIGHT do is delay NIL until after enrollment. What's your plan to stop that? Ding the school next year with WHAT and for WHAT?

The schools quickly sue the NCAA for trying to ding them for something the school legally cannot control which happened after the season started and they were in compliance.

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

Players can't be told legally, you've signed enough NIL for this year. All the schools have to do is get the players enrolled, THEN sign the NIL for millions.

The school is clear. They were under the cap at the signing.

The player is clear. NO ONE can legally tell them when they can sign an NIL and for how much.

It doesn't work. All it MIGHT do is delay NIL until after enrollment. What's your plan to stop that? Ding the school next year with WHAT and for WHAT?

The schools quickly sue the NCAA for trying to ding them for something the school legally cannot control which happened after the season started and they were in compliance.

Just like you CAN have portal windows and signing day windows you can have NIL declaration windows. May have to have an appeals process, but it CAN be enforced. You can't tell them they can't get NIL, you can define rational rules that allow unlimited deals and enforce them. Schools vote on all the cap rules and throw the switch. Just like the school and the player cannot force a roster spot for the 86th guy anytime they want, they can't exceed an NIL cap anytime they want.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Just like you CAN have portal windows and signing day windows you can have NIL declaration windows. May have to have an appeals process, but it CAN be enforced. You can't tell them they can't get NIL, you can define rational rules that allow unlimited deals and enforce them. Schools vote on all the cap rules and throw the switch. Just like the school and the player cannot force a roster spot for the 86th guy anytime they want, they can't exceed an NIL cap anytime they want.

No. You cannot. That is the definition of restricting a player's right to sign an employment contract whenever they want.

What is wrong with you? Would you accept someone telling you that you can't take a second job or any job because it's bad for their business model?

ORIGINALLY, you said you'd not restrict an individual's right to sign NIL deals, now you want to restrict ALL the players to a certain time to sign NIL deals.

Forget it. You have no plan that's legal.

 

[76volman]

Barnes blowing it again..........Aidoo has no friggin hands!!!!

 

[DaddyChad]

Apparently the NCAA made its intentions clear enough, and its indication of planned future actions was enough to make UT think that it could make a case for a TRO. Those of us on the outside don't know all that went on behind the curtain.

Idk but I’m thinking just the whole malicious nature of how the ncaa has went about this is why they need one. Ncaa has proven they don’t want to operate a fair and impartial investigation. Leaking details of their case to the press before notice of allegations came proves that. Whole reason White mentioned that is to point to this.

 

[Godfatha]

Barnes blowing it again..........Aidoo has no friggin hands!!!!

Wrong thread and bad take

 

[Volfansince1980]

Barnes blowing it again..........Aidoo has no friggin hands!!!!

Don’t know how to respond to this. Hopefully you have sobered up now.

 

[Vols1891]

I haven’t been much online lately to follow this. Can someone just give me a quick summary (explain it like I’m 5) of what we are accused of and where things currently stand? There is just so much to try to read through.

 

[utvolpj]

Just like you CAN have portal windows and signing day windows you can have NIL declaration windows. May have to have an appeals process, but it CAN be enforced. You can't tell them they can't get NIL, you can define rational rules that allow unlimited deals and enforce them. Schools vote on all the cap rules and throw the switch. Just like the school and the player cannot force a roster spot for the 86th guy anytime they want, they can't exceed an NIL cap anytime they want.

You could possibly put a salary cap on what they earn from the school. You can't limit it past that without going against the USSC ruling. Money earned outside can't be regulated by the NCAA