UT under potential NCAA investigation for NIL

[aRmo]

NCAA doesnt need to govern football. The recruiting landscape and coaching rules need to change, and i dont think the NCAA has the brains nor the means to do it. Trying to pull power moves isnt working anymore. NIL ERA is a very slippery slope. What rules would someone implement that could be followed?

 

[SmokinBob]

None of your straw man arguments are insurmountable. YES Just like individuals wanting to compete in sports have to accept or comply with scholly limits, portal windows, completion requirements, redshirt rules, etc., they will have to negotiate and report their professional earnings to attain a waiver to compete in sports where across all of D1 and D2 the vast majority will not have any deals to report.

POSSIBLY, only require reporting when total deals exceed some thresholds so chicken, car lot, mattress low dollar stuff does not create admin nightmares. 10k?? 20k?? Once again let the smart guys establish all limits.

Even NFL players aren’t restricted/capped re: endorsement deals...

 

[VolatileVol]

More states will join the lawsuit. Bama, Texas, Florida, Georgia, Miss, And the Carolina’s most likely will

I've seen a couple of these names floated. Does anybody know where these rumored names are being generated from? Are these schools actually in discussions to join or does somebody simply think it would be savvy for those schools to intervene in the Complaint? I guess what I'm asking is if there is any validity to the rumored names or is that pure speculation?

 

[onevol74]

***** Can some please explain to me why the NCAA did not go after Texas A&M *****
Let's look at the Reality of this as advertised. Texas A&M committed these type of violations before and after the NIL.

On the outbound, Players even admitted it to various agencies.

The Money was there and was not delivered at times or to a small few.

This could have been the story behind the firing of Jimbo but only a side bar.

Other schools advertised that they had a fund especially set up for Lineman based on NIL. If that is not a come play for me and we will pay you, then I don't know what is.

This is a targeted, Witch Hunt. (popular word)

I am beginning to think that the NCAA put their toes in the water with Tennessee to see if they could pull it off. (failed due to push back) As, Tennessee did not respond in the way the NCAA anticipated and it is blowing up in the NCAA's face.

1. Texas Oil Money would have been a threat to the cause.
2. The NCAA thought that after fining UT $8mil that they would be very hesitant for fight again.
3. Tennessee was all too gracious 3 years ago and they thought they could just bully them again.
4. The NCAA thought that Tennessee's rear end was still well greased and they liked it the first time.

 

[vols 30]

I've seen a couple of these names floated. Does anybody know where these rumored names are being generated from? Are these schools actually in discussions to join or does somebody simply think it would be savvy for those schools to intervene in the Complaint? I guess what I'm asking is if there is any validity to the rumored names or is that pure speculation?

Only place I've seen it is here. Meaning pure speculation.

 

[BearCat204]

Everyone all of a sudden is a lawyer specializing in Anti-Trust laws lol

 

[Volfan39]

Only place I've seen it is here. Meaning pure speculation.

Talk shows, lawyers, attorneys, other schools insiders

 

[VolArmy74]

There's unlikely to be any reason for anyone else to join unless the NCAA announces more investigations, which after getting this broadside, will probably not happen. There's no point in bringing additional costs to those states to pursue this when it's likely a slam dunk win for Tennessee and Virginia based on the 9-0 rulings the NCAA has faced so far. Lower courts use those rulings for guidance.

In this case the NCAA is trying to tell someone they have to accept a job in a city before they can negotiate pay. Effectively hamstringing the bargaining power of any athlete looking to sign an NIL deal.

 

[LouderVol]

My issue is trying to pin this on the players, like they make the rules for the team, the school, the SEC or the NCAA.

Somehow the players are bad because opportunity is legally there and they're using that opportunity.

The NCAA screwed this up decades and decades ago by not coming up with a compensation plan when it became very clear that some athletes were more valuable than the (lest turbo go off again) extremely valuable scholarship. Significant stipends, trust accounts, something..... would be better than the NIL Wild West the NCAA was forced to allow.

Most of the blame falls on the schools and NCAA for being incredibly shortsighted and greedy.

I remember when NCAA Football got cancelled people had several ideas I at least liked.

set up trusts, anything the player earns goes there for 3 years, before the player can do anything with it. ties it to NFL eligibility, would reasonably tie a player to a single spot, they are getting paid, but no money in hand for the pearl clutchers. then when they are "old enough" they get their money. maybe its a school/conference run/managed fund, so all the money could be monitored, for both parties sakes.

of course now with the transfer market and NIL in place that type of deal is DOA, and maybe not be any legally stronger. but there would have been less push back from the players that has completely overturned EVERYTHING now.

some of the other ideas were to have the university control a donation fund/revenue sharing (lol) that then got divided up to all the players, maybe some type of weighted system. again wouldn't pass muster today because elite players wouldn't have gotten true fair value, but again there would be much less push back.

or the player collective that established their own guide lines for how the money was divided and distributed.

all those options would have been more fair, but again not sure on the total legality, but would at least have been a step towards trying to be fair, and may have lasted longer and maintained the amateur model a little longer, allowing for more changes as time went on.

 

[DaddyChad]

***** Can some please explain to me why the NCAA did not go after Texas A&M *****
Let's look at the Reality of this as advertised. Texas A&M committed these type of violations before and after the NIL.

On the outbound, Players even admitted it to various agencies.

The Money was there and was not delivered at times or to a small few.

This could have been the story behind the firing of Jimbo but only a side bar.

Other schools advertised that they had a fund especially set up for Lineman based on NIL. If that is not a come play for me and we will pay you, then I don't know what is.

This is a targeted, Witch Hunt. (popular word)

I am beginning to think that the NCAA put their toes in the water with Tennessee to see if they could pull it off. (failed due to push back) As, Tennessee did not respond in the way the NCAA anticipated and it is blowing up in the NCAA's face.

Texas AM is on their dance card. Their hands are full right now

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

I remember when NCAA Football got cancelled people had several ideas I at least liked.

set up trusts, anything the player earns goes there for 3 years, before the player can do anything with it. ties it to NFL eligibility, would reasonably tie a player to a single spot, they are getting paid, but no money in hand for the pearl clutchers. then when they are "old enough" they get their money. maybe its a school/conference run/managed fund, so all the money could be monitored, for both parties sakes.

of course now with the transfer market and NIL in place that type of deal is DOA, and maybe not be any legally stronger. but there would have been less push back from the players that has completely overturned EVERYTHING now.

some of the other ideas were to have the university control a donation fund/revenue sharing (lol) that then got divided up to all the players, maybe some type of weighted system. again wouldn't pass muster today because elite players wouldn't have gotten true fair value, but again there would be much less push back.

or the player collective that established their own guide lines for how the money was divided and distributed.

all those options would have been more fair, but again not sure on the total legality, but would at least have been a step towards trying to be fair, and may have lasted longer and maintained the amateur model a little longer, allowing for more changes as time went on.

There were options, decent options as you mention.

The NCAA stuck hard to the "we're strictly amateur and the scholarship is enough of a benefit for the players" line when they knew dang well players were being paid under the table because the scholarship didn't cover the market value of players.

They dug in until they got buried by the SCOTUS.

I've no sympathy for the NCAA and I wish they'd just sit in the corner and be quiet. I DON'T think the next organization will be able to form as an amateur business nor will it be able to keep the "student" aspect of "college" football.

It will be difficult to demand an employee you hired to play sports has to attend classes that have ZERO to do with playing the sport you hired them for. I could see getting them to attend classes in athletics, but it's really hard to justify making a pro athlete take geology or math as a condition of employment.

If the NCAA would just sit in the corner, we could enjoy the demise of college sports until the "players are employees" lawsuits end it.

Sadly, the NCAA can't seem to do that.

 

[aRmo]

There's unlikely to be any reason for anyone else to join unless the NCAA announces more investigations, which after getting this broadside, will probably not happen. There's no point in bringing additional costs to those states to pursue this when it's likely a slam dunk win for Tennessee and Virginia based on the 9-0 rulings the NCAA has faced so far. Lower courts use those rulings for guidance.

In this case the NCAA is trying to tell someone they have to accept a job in a city before they can negotiate pay. Effectively hamstringing the bargaining power of any athlete looking to sign an NIL deal.

So Nico should have been working at a local food city first?

 

[wrangler]

People are much more confident than I am here. I'm not even sure how one can receive injunctive relief for something that has not yet occurred. Any luck on adding more schools to the NCAA lawsuit?

That's what this type of injunction is for -- to stop something from occurring.

 

[Franklin_Vol09]

Even NFL players aren’t restricted/capped re: endorsement deals...

Because that isn’t a logical restriction on a pro organization. All this stuff is collectively bargained. We will get a collegiate players union. Zero doubt about this. There are age restrictions on the NFL, salary caps, roster spaces, revocable contracts, etc.

Also, pro sports has also operated under immunity from certain monopoly laws and other laws that most businesses operate under.

At some point, a different collegiate league will be set up. These college athletes will have an option to join based on the rules proposes and bargained over, or they can take their services someplace else. Maybe a direct from highschool developmental league. The NIL deals at this level will not have the “free market” power that is artificially there under these collectives right now.

 

[VolatileVol]

That's what this type of injunction is for -- to stop something from occurring.

Sure, but you have to meet certain criteria to obtain an injunction. I'm unsure how you can prove the things required until something further occurs regarding this inquiry/investigation/whatever it's formally being called right now.

 

[turbovol]

The SEC and the Big10 announced today that they're forming an advisory committee to look at all this madness. I laugh at all
the people who heap scorn on the NCAA--which is a member organization, as Sankey noted today--as if there were others entities
eager to tackle and manage all this BS.

The problem with college football is that while for a long time it was about college, now, at the major-college level, it's just become about money and greed. That's why we've seen all this nonsensical realignment and the disappearance of the prestigious Pac12. Greed. Money. And now the players have become greedy--under the delusion that lots of people are getting rich off their efforts, which except or the coaches, isn't true. It's easy for some coach making $6 million annually to say that the players should be getting money--which is nonsense. The players are already getting a lot of money in the form of a free college education.

If the SEC and the Big12 were wise, one of the things they should propose to each other is to get NIL out of recruiting. It's not how NIL was conceived. But some school, or schools, decided to extend it to recruiting, and once a couple of schools started that, well, all the other majors were going to jump in like clowns crowding into a VW Bug. NIL in recruiting---bidding contests for high-schoolers--is a terrible idea and the schools should stop doing it. That would be the first common-sense move to make. There are some who want to argue that high-schoolers have a market value and are entitled to see what it is. They only have a market value because crazy majors can't abide the idea of their rivals getting a leg up on them by offering NIL to prospects, and so they have to do it. Plus, while it's an irrational hassle for coaches and the programs, they also know that their crazy fans will jump in because, god-forbid, that florida or auburn or texas get a QB or TE that Tennessee might want.

CFB is like the cuckoo clock that's kept getting wound tighter and tighter by money and TV rights contracts and greed and crazy fans, and now a gear has snapped and the bird has shot out and is hanging down by its spring--a broken mess.

Some propose splitting CFB off from the rest of a college's sports. Yea? And where exactly will it go? You going keep it with the colleges, everything the same, just have a bunch of paid pros masquerading as college students?

At the end of the day somebody will have to govern the sport, and institute common-sense rules and give the universities the power--not self-indulgent high-schoolers (since the universities are offering them scholarships), and if the athletes don't like being constrained then they can try and go the pro route in some way. It's college--and it should remain college.

 

[UTodd01]

Everyone all of a sudden is a lawyer specializing in Anti-Trust laws lol

It's not difficult to understand the laws. The NCAA doesn't have a leg to stand on.

 

[volbound1700]

The SEC and the Big10 announced today that they're forming an advisory committee to look at all this madness. I laugh at all
the people who heap scorn on the NCAA--which is a member organization, as Sankey noted today--as if there were others entities
eager to tackle and manage all this BS.

The problem with college football is that while for a long time it was about college, now, at the major-college level, it's just become about money and greed. That's why we've seen all this nonsensical realignment and the disappearance of the prestigious Pac12. Greed. Money. And now the players have become greedy--under the delusion that lots of people are getting rich off their efforts, which except or the coaches, isn't true. It's easy for some coach making $6 million annually to say that the players should be getting money--which is nonsense. The players are already getting a lot of money in the form of a free college education.

If the SEC and the Big12 were wise, one of the things they should propose to each other is to get NIL out of recruiting. It's not how NIL was conceived. But some school, or schools, decided to extend it to recruiting, and once a couple of schools started that, well, all the other majors were going to jump in like clowns crowding into a VW Bug. NIL in recruiting---bidding contests for high-schoolers--is a terrible idea and the schools should stop doing it. That would be the first common-sense move to make. There are some who want to argue that high-schoolers have a market value and are entitled to see what it is. They only have a market value because crazy majors can't abide the idea of their rivals getting a leg up on them by offering NIL to prospects, and so they have to do it. Plus, while it's an irrational hassle for coaches and the programs, they also know that their crazy fans will jump in because, god-forbid, that florida or auburn or texas get a QB or TE that Tennessee might want.

CFB is like the cuckoo clock that's kept getting wound tighter and tighter by money and TV rights contracts and greed and crazy fans, and now a gear has snapped and the bird has shot out and is hanging down by its spring--a broken mess.

Some propose splitting CFB off from the rest of a college's sports. Yea? And where exactly will it go? You going keep it with the colleges, everything the same, just have a bunch of paid pros masquerading as college students?

At the end of the day somebody will have to govern the sport, and institute common-sense rules and give the universities the power--not self-indulgent high-schoolers (since the universities are offering them scholarships), and if the athletes don't like being constrained then they can try and go the pro route in some way. It's college--and it should remain college.

How do you get NIL out of recruiting? Frankly, money was in recruiting long before NIL and you are living under a rock if you don't believe it. Don't tell me Alabama and Saban didn't go from 7-6 to top recruiting classes and best classes in CFB history without money going to players hands.

It has been around for a long time. Money was handed out in Southwest in 1980s, etc. Why try to regulate something that is already unenforceable? All regulation does is create SELECTIVE enforcement and frankly, Tennessee is been on the wrong side of that SELECTIVE enforcement for some time.

 

[MSCE09]

‪Once 2 strangers climbed ole Rocky Top‬
‪Looking into an NIL deal‬
‪Strangers ain’t came down from Rocky Top‬
‪Reckon they never will‬

 

[Volprofch05]

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

Even NFL players aren’t restricted/capped re: endorsement deals...

But they are professionals adding endorsement income and college players are amateurs adding endorsement deals.

Now if the NCAA WANTS TO GO TO THE DRAFT AND 43 MAN ROSTERS AND TRADE CLAUSES FOR COMPETITIVE BALANCE WE CAN INTELLIGENTLY PICK THIS CONVERSATION UP. NOTHING in the RULING mandates they keep current roster size or prohibits incorporating trade clauses in scholly agreements though they do have much more free agent flexibility that supports additional but different competitive balance measures.

It is apples to aardvarks at this time.

 

[GUNTERSVOL]

It's not difficult to understand the laws. The NCAA doesn't have a leg to stand on.

I agree NIL is out of the bag and is not going away. Pros are initially tied to a draft and no amount of outside money can be used to get a guy to a team. So colleges can attempt to mitigate the impact of money changing competitive balance.

 

[Delmar]

The SEC and the Big10 announced today that they're forming an advisory committee to look at all this madness. I laugh at all
the people who heap scorn on the NCAA--which is a member organization, as Sankey noted today--as if there were others entities
eager to tackle and manage all this BS.

The problem with college football is that while for a long time it was about college, now, at the major-college level, it's just become about money and greed. That's why we've seen all this nonsensical realignment and the disappearance of the prestigious Pac12. Greed. Money. And now the players have become greedy--under the delusion that lots of people are getting rich off their efforts, which except or the coaches, isn't true. It's easy for some coach making $6 million annually to say that the players should be getting money--which is nonsense. The players are already getting a lot of money in the form of a free college education.

If the SEC and the Big12 were wise, one of the things they should propose to each other is to get NIL out of recruiting. It's not how NIL was conceived. But some school, or schools, decided to extend it to recruiting, and once a couple of schools started that, well, all the other majors were going to jump in like clowns crowding into a VW Bug. NIL in recruiting---bidding contests for high-schoolers--is a terrible idea and the schools should stop doing it. That would be the first common-sense move to make. There are some who want to argue that high-schoolers have a market value and are entitled to see what it is. They only have a market value because crazy majors can't abide the idea of their rivals getting a leg up on them by offering NIL to prospects, and so they have to do it. Plus, while it's an irrational hassle for coaches and the programs, they also know that their crazy fans will jump in because, god-forbid, that florida or auburn or texas get a QB or TE that Tennessee might want.

CFB is like the cuckoo clock that's kept getting wound tighter and tighter by money and TV rights contracts and greed and crazy fans, and now a gear has snapped and the bird has shot out and is hanging down by its spring--a broken mess.

Some propose splitting CFB off from the rest of a college's sports. Yea? And where exactly will it go? You going keep it with the colleges, everything the same, just have a bunch of paid pros masquerading as college students?

At the end of the day somebody will have to govern the sport, and institute common-sense rules and give the universities the power--not self-indulgent high-schoolers (since the universities are offering them scholarships), and if the athletes don't like being constrained then they can try and go the pro route in some way. It's college--and it should remain college.

Too long. Didn’t read. Mainly because I know it says the same redundant drivel that you post in every thread on this subject. When are you going to realize that the courts have determined that it is illegal to limit what these athletes can earn? We get it. You don’t like the new direction but your feelings are irrelevant.

I’m on record that I don’t like it or the rule less transfer portal. But it’s here and it’s not going back to the plantation that you desire. It is now up to the the schools (not the NCAA) to figure out how to manage it and this SEC/Big 10 cooperation is the first step. Personally I think that will be employee contracts to limit the transfers but nobody really knows what is going to happen there. The money question is no longer controllable.

 

[DaddyChad]

Beginning of the end for the ncaa.

 

[CAVPUT]

The wording of this article is funny. UT is under potential investigation. You can be under investigation, or not under investigation, but you can't be under potential investigation.

Well..yeah, you can.