War in Ukraine

[LouderVol]

So we would not give missiles to a nato country on Russian borders?

Not sure the "we're protecting you from yourself" is a great argument. I don't believe that's our role and I don't believe pushing nato toward that goal is useful either unless we're prepared for war

NATO isnt protecting Russia from Russia, that's not what I said. NATO'S protecting Russia from the nations that make up NATO.

If you look at the history, Russia would have been attacked twice by NATO nations over the 70+ years of NATO. That hasnt happened. Even after their collapse at all time lows, NATO stayed out of Russia.

All those proxy wars, and nuclear threats would have historically evolved into actual conflict in the past. What's changed? The existence of NATO.

The flip side is also that NATO has protected itself from Russia too without fighting a war. I think the typical russian clock is somewhere around 50 to 60 years for them to attack someone else.

 

[Velo Vol]

Of course.

 

[volgr]

What does Ukraine gain by trying to take back Kherson right now? Why the urgency? Does it have to do with US mid-terms coming up? Does it have to do with the people in the EU slowly losing faith in Ukraine's chances to win this war?

 

[LouderVol]

the US is absolutely complicit in the Yemen genocide. You think that happens if we're opposed to it?

Yes....we arent as all powerful as people seem to think. As I pointed out we cant even control Saudi Arabias trade deals with us. Why would you expect us to control their foreign policy?

 

[NorthDallas40]

@Rasputin_Vol heard sobbing in the corner.

This is where I drop this meme right @Rasputin_Vol ?

 

[utvolpj]

Yes....we arent as all powerful as people seem to think. As I pointed out we cant even control Saudi Arabias trade deals with us. Why would you expect us to control their foreign policy?

Because we supply their weapons even after their crimes and have provided assistance to their military

 

[volgr]

What does Ukraine gain by trying to take back Kherson right now? Why the urgency? Does it have to do with US mid-terms coming up? Does it have to do with the people in the EU slowly losing faith in Ukraine's chances to win this war?

Some say these are probing attacks, if so, they are losing a lot of men and machine to do so.

 

[LouderVol]

Large enough that Nazi related symbols are seen quite frequently in pictures of Ukrainian troops. The neo-nazi supporting portion of Ukraine is higher than 1% but it isn't as large as Russia makes it out to be.

Those symbols including skulls or death hands symbols? Why would people sent in to fight and potentially die include skulls on their uniforms? Complete mystery. Must be the nazis.

Yeah. That's been covered. Its typical military insignia/regalia in use throughout the entire world, made famous/infamous before the Nazis came to power.

Also if Russia was trying to Nazi-fi Ukraine why were they willing to do a prisoner exchange of them and their leaders?

 

[NorthDallas40]

Expansion. If Russia was putting missiles on the Mexican border we would do the same. It's a purposeful provocation

So you think we would actually invade and occupy Mexico and annex Mexican territory if Russia put weapons on the border? Laughable.

 

[utvolpj]

So you think we would actually invade and occupy Mexico and annex Mexican territory if Russia put weapons on the border? Laughable.

I believe we would conduct military operations to remove them

 

[volgr]

This is where I drop this meme right @Rasputin_Vol ?

1 year ago, 71 Rubles per US dollar....today, 61 Rubles per US dollar. Inflation continues to fall, CBR continues to fall. This while fighting a Western proxy war. Not bad, considering.

 

[LouderVol]

What does Ukraine gain by trying to take back Kherson right now? Why the urgency? Does it have to do with US mid-terms coming up? Does it have to do with the people in the EU slowly losing faith in Ukraine's chances to win this war?

When should they try to take back Kherson? The previously had a large offensive up around Kharkiv. So resources were going there. Before that they were on the defensive. Russia is calling up 300k new troops, should Ukraine wait for those Russian reinforcements? The Ukrainians feel like they have an advantage and will lose it, so they are taking it.

Why is everything a conspiracy for you when there are far simpler options?

 

[hog88]

Because we supply their weapons even after their crimes and have provided assistance to their military

SA has the cash to buy weapons on the open market.

 

[volgr]

When should they try to take back Kherson? The previously had a large offensive up around Kharkiv. So resources were going there. Before that they were on the defensive. Russia is calling up 300k new troops, should Ukraine wait for those Russian reinforcements? The Ukrainians feel like they have an advantage and will lose it, so they are taking it.

Why is everything a conspiracy for you when there are far simpler options?

Because trying to retake Kherson is going to come at a HUGE price. So, whether they retake it or not, they will deplete themselves right as 300k Russians hit the battlefield. What do you think happens next?

 

[LouderVol]

Because we supply their weapons even after their crimes and have provided assistance to their military

We were before and have continued to do so. Like I said, not as all powerful as you think. We didn't jump in and start arming the Sauds after Yemen. Doesnt make us responsible.

Since those crimes have come to light we have provided 4.5 billion in aide to Yemen. Well probably the same percentage has actually made it as the aide going to Ukraine.

 

[Septic]

The battle for Kherson appears underway.

Will Russia stand and fight or retreat across the river?

Can they even retreat? I though Ukraine blew up the bridges out of town.

 

[NorthDallas40]

Some say these are probing attacks, if so, they are losing a lot of men and machine to do so.

Sure they are Larry. Because pro Russian propagandists make posts saying it’s too horrible and we can’t show it to you and literally no one else is confirming it.

I’d expect this fight to have more casualties than the prior flat out retreats of the invading orcs but that tripe you’re posting is laughable. As usual.

 

[NorthDallas40]

I believe we would conduct military operations to remove them

Oh I’ll agree we’d likely strike them. But I inferred you were pushing a whole bunch more than that with what you typed.

 

[volgr]

Also, Ukraine is already depleted from the last 8 months of fighting. What they are sending in Kherson is half trained territorial forces, who are suffering huge casualties (I won't say his 600-1000 number is accurate but I think from pictures and other info, we can agree they are losing a large amount of men in these probing attacks). This from Russian Gen. Surovikin:

The Ukrainian regime is trying to breach our defenses. To do this, the armed forces of Ukraine are pulling all available reserves to the front line. In fact, these are territorial forces that have not received full training.

In fact, the Ukrainian leadership is dooming them to destruction. As a rule, such units have low morale. To prevent an escape from the front line, Ukrainian authorities deploy detachments of nationalists who shoot anyone who tries to leave the battlefield.

Every day enemy losses range from 600 to 1000 killed and wounded.

 

[Septic]

Because trying to retake Kherson is going to come at a HUGE price. So, whether they retake it or not, they will deplete themselves right as 300k Russians hit the battlefield. What do you think happens next?

I think the real question is how and where the Ukrainians are going house and feed the droves of defectors who have no will to fight pootins BS war.

 

[NorthDallas40]

1 year ago, 71 Rubles per US dollar....today, 61 Rubles per US dollar. Inflation continues to fall, CBR continues to fall. This while fighting a Western proxy war. Not bad, considering.

Oh sure things are rosy. They can’t get electronics components and half of the ones they are able to procure are junk, they have no means to resupply their army since they can’t get components, much of their industry has idled as has been shown in posts in their automotive industry.

But a currency no body is trading in outside of Russia is doing great due to high interventionist manipulations. LMFAO Larry

 

[volgr]

@Rasputin_Vol heard sobbing in the corner.

Good thread on this issue...things aren't as rosy as the graph indicates...shocker...

 

[Septic]

Also, Ukraine is already depleted from the last 8 months of fighting. What they are sending in Kherson is half trained territorial forces, who are suffering huge casualties (I won't say his 600-1000 number is accurate but I think from pictures and other info, we can agree they are losing a large amount of men in these probing attacks). This from Russian Gen. Surovikin:

Forgive us if we don't give much credibility to the russian commands hot takes on how things are going to play out poorly for Ukraine.

Give me one motivated, battle tested well-armed soldier with everything to lose against a dozen terrified guys who were flipping burgers, serving coffee and playing X-box a week ago whose only goal in life is to have the most adidas track suits and swill the most rot gut vodka.

 

[LouderVol]

Because trying to retake Kherson is going to come at a HUGE price. So, whether they retake it or not, they will deplete themselves right as 300k Russians hit the battlefield. What do you think happens next?

No idea. I didnt see the large Ukrainian offensive coming. Even throughout it I didnt think it dramatically changes the military aspects of the war. I dont think Kherson does either.

I still see Russia winning the actual fight, still not sure they are willing/able to maintain the fight as long as Ukraine is. I keep saying it, I still think this is the Winter War. Bad losses on both sides, slight Russian victory on field, able to take and hold territory, but not able to continue the war indefinitely after the easy victory is denied. The resistance suffers more than is let on, but is able to maintain a sufficient defense for as long as the Russians are able to attack.

I have pointed out previously how I think your estimates of Ukrainian dead are off, I doubt they are losing enough around Kherson to lose the war.

 

[volgr]

But a currency no body is trading in outside of Russia is doing great due to high interventionist manipulations

Yes, because the EU and US are non-interventionist markets.