War in Ukraine

#55,977
#55,977
NorthDallas40 said:
First off the Bradley’s and Strykers weren’t in the mix till recently. These are already established for existing Russian equipment and prior given Western equipment

And second based on the complete 💩 show of Russian logistics in can understand his w you think it’s impossible however competent Western armies do this all the time.

What we proved is what we proved egrtume time. You’re talking out your ass

Hey @MG1968 did you notice when you challenged him to post up DD214’s he deflected to his buddy’s service? 😂
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Lol. I'm not posting personal information like that on Volnation you imbecile. I wouldn't ask anyone else to either.
 
#55,981
#55,981
NorthDallas40 said:
You completely deflected away from the notion of YOUR specific service smooth brain
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And so did MG. Plus it's common sense for anyone who has served in the military knows it will take more than "just a few weeks" to train on any new equipment like Strykers and Bradleys especially when they are not familiar with it. And I bet it took more than just a few weeks to train our own U.S. Army Soldiers on them when they first rolled out. Why does anyone think it will be any different for anyone in the Ukrainian military?
 
#55,982
#55,982
NorthDallas40 said:
Better buckle up then because the flow of equipment to Ukraine is only going to increase come spring when new offensives start.
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Let's just throw down then. NATO vs Russia..All bets off.

Face it..with nukes..Russia doesn't invade.. Another failed American FP and now the calling.
Now we are committed to this stupidity of ever escalation and between the egos of the West and Putin..this will go sideways in such a bad way very quickly.

What does the USA gain from this? Action of commitment? We committed trillions to the WOT and now give the Afghans money. That is a laugh.
 
#55,983
#55,983
DonjoVol said:
And so did MG. Plus it's common sense for anyone who has served in the military knows it will take more than "just a few weeks" to train on any new equipment like Strykers and Bradleys especially when they are not familiar with it. And I bet it took more than just a few weeks to train our own U.S. Army Soldiers on them when they first rolled out. Why does anyone think it will be any different for anyone in the Ukrainian military?
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No he didn’t. And they’re already training on operational use. Based on existing maintenance arrangements it would appear Trey would fall under the repair plan of other western equipment. But keep bargaining with yourself and telling yourself they won’t be able to utilize the equipment. LMAO
 
#55,984
#55,984
Orangeburst said:
Let's just throw down then. NATO vs Russia..All bets off.

Face it..with nukes..Russia doesn't invade.. Another failed American FP and now the calling.
Now we are committed to this stupidity of ever escalation and between the egos of the West and Putin..this will go sideways in such a bad way very quickly.

What does the USA gain from this? Action of commitment? We committed trillions to the WOT and now give the Afghans money. That is a laugh.
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That escalated quickly. You go from you’re worried about conflict to let’s be a combatant? Well I hope not.

And we’ve covered it before. We’re obligated to assist. I realize you don’t like or agree with that. We disagree.
 
#55,985
#55,985
NorthDallas40 said:
That escalated quickly. You go from you’re worried about conflict to let’s be a combatant? Well I hope not.

And we’ve covered it before. We’re obligated to assist. I realize you don’t like or agree Ruth that. We disagree.
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Lets cover a hypothetical..

Say Ukraine wins and Putin is toppled. American dollars would flow to Russia and Ukraine.
Everyone gets a piece of Uncle Sam's pie. Always. And we are barely holding on as a nation ourselves. Seems like Rome to me.
 
#55,986
#55,986
NorthDallas40 said:
No he didn’t. And they’re already training on operational use. Based on existing maintenance arrangements it would appear Trey would fall under the repair plan of other western equipment. But keep bargaining with yourself and telling yourself they won’t be able to utilize the equipment. LMAO
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The Ukrainian military picked up the HIMARS pretty quickly, much to the chagrin of the Wagnerites.
 
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#55,987
#55,987
Orangeburst said:
Lets cover a hypothetical..

Say Ukraine wins and Putin is toppled. American dollars would flow to Russia and Ukraine.
Everyone gets a piece of Uncle Sam's pie. Always. And we are barely holding on as a nation ourselves. Seems like Rome to me.
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Then we shouldn’t enter entangling agreements we have no intention of honoring. Look I’ve stated I wish we hadn’t meddled in this in 1994. But it’s way too late for that now
 
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#55,989
#55,989
NorthDallas40 said:
Then we shouldn’t enter entangling agreements we have no intention of honoring. Look I’ve stated I wish we hadn’t meddled in this in 1994. But it’s way too late for that now
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That is my point...the DC FP savants blow it..now we are witnessing the effects and having to double down.

I will ask again..why is Ukraine so important to US interest other than maintaining the empire of Pax Americana?
We are $31T in debt, our cities are in in disrepair, we are practically in political chaos,,yet we want to honor our FP commitments, that FAIL every time when a hot war breaks.

I see the cheerleading by some libs on this board just like Neo cons. Libs that hate Bolton, yet are in agreement with him now. Because Russia Russia Russia and Trump.
We see the comments about why Putin didnt invade under Trump..The most laughable comments I ever read on here.

And I get your support I really do. But there has to be a point of preventing too much escalation..And I see the US is concerned as well by what offensive Kit is provided.

Joe said the purpose was to overthrow Putin..before walking back.

I would ask our liberal posters and everyone ..is that a goal and dream?

What is the game plan?

At least think ahead like a game of chess.
 
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#55,990
#55,990
NorthDallas40 said:
No he didn’t. And they’re already training on operational use. Based on existing maintenance arrangements it would appear Trey would fall under the repair plan of other western equipment. But keep bargaining with yourself and telling yourself they won’t be able to utilize the equipment. LMAO
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I didn't say they would not be able to utilize the equipment. I said they needed the proper training in order to so. Which will take more than a few weeks. You guys really aren't the brightest bunch.
 
#55,991
#55,991
Orangeburst said:
That is my point...the DC FP savants blow it..now we are witnessing the effects and having to double down.

I will ask again..why is Ukraine so important to US interest other than maintaining the empire of Pax Americana?
We are $31T in debt, our cities are in in disrepair, we are practically in political chaos,,yet we want to honor our FP commitments, that FAIL every time when a hot war breaks.

I see the cheerleading by some libs on this board just like Neo cons. Libs that hate Bolton, yet are in agreement with him now. Because Russia Russia Russia and Trump.
We see the comments about why Putin didnt invade under Trump..The most laughable comments I ever read on here.

And I get your support I really do. But there has to be a point of preventing too much escalation..And I see the US is concerned as well by what offensive Kit is provided.

Joe said the purpose was to overthrow Putin..before walking back.

I would ask our liberal posters and everyone ..is that a goal and dream?

What is the game plan?

At least think ahead like a game of chess.
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Sounds to me like you’re trying to talk yourself into walking away from the commitment we made in 1994. I’m not interested in playing that game. I wish we had kept our noses out of it. But we didn’t.

There were actually three separate “Budapest Memorandums”. One each separate for Ukraine, Belarus, and Kazakhstan. Russia is simply trying to close out the hat trick here.
 
#55,992
#55,992
DonjoVol said:
I didn't say they would not be able to utilize the equipment. I said they needed the proper training in order to so. Which will take more than a few weeks. You guys really aren't the brightest bunch.
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To may toe To mah toe. It was clear what you were implying stooge boy.
 
#55,993
#55,993
DonjoVol said:
I didn't say they would not be able to utilize the equipment. I said they needed the proper training in order to so. Which will take more than a few weeks. You guys really aren't the brightest bunch.
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In the grand scheme of things, 17 weeks is a “few” weeks. That’s also training on an 8 hour class schedule, PT, meals, etc.
 
#55,994
#55,994
NorthDallas40 said:
Sounds to me like you’re trying to talk yourself into walking away from the commitment we made in 1994. I’m not interested in playing that game. I wish we had kept our noses out of it. But we didn’t.

There were actually three separate “Budapest Memorandums”. One each separate for Ukraine, Belarus, and Kazakhstan. Russia is simply trying to close out the hat trick here.
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Would Russia have invaded without the agreement is my point.
Putin didnt invade under Trump.
Georgia was invaded under Obama and now Ukraine under Biden.

I cannot help but look at the reasons and why from a geopolitical and larger perspective. And Russia and Ukraine and Hunter and Trump and Impeachment.

Just trying to put the pieces together from a geopolitical perspective and it doesn't seem a coincidence, regardless of Putin's actual aggression.
 
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#55,995
#55,995
Orangeburst said:
Would Russia have invaded without the agreement is my point.
Putin didnt invade under Trump.
Georgia was invaded under Obama and now Ukraine under Biden.

I cannot help but look at the reasons and why from a geopolitical and larger perspective. And Russia and Ukraine and Hunter and Trump and Impeachment.

Just trying to put the pieces together from a geopolitical perspective and it doesn't seem a coincidence, regardless of Putin's actual aggression.
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It’s a meaningless debate. The agreement states aid will be rendered if their territorial sovereignty is violated. That bill came due in 2014 frankly.
 
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#55,996
#55,996
I see that Macron has upped his defense commitment to 2% of GDP finally. Wasn't Trump eviscerated for requiring an actual commitment by NATO? But alas he wanted to end NATO.

Where you at you liberals?
 
#55,997
#55,997
Orangeburst said:
Georgia was invaded under Obama
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Russia invaded and defeated Georgia during the last year of Bush's presidency and before the general presidential election (in the eighth month of '08, in accordance with Putin's numerological superstition, just as he kicked off the invasion of Ukraine with his declaration on 02/22/2022). John McCain was at that time still very much in contention to succeed Bush.
 
#55,998
#55,998
Orangeburst said:
Would Russia have invaded without the agreement is my point.
Putin didnt invade under Trump.
Georgia was invaded under Obama and now Ukraine under Biden.

I cannot help but look at the reasons and why from a geopolitical and larger perspective. And Russia and Ukraine and Hunter and Trump and Impeachment.

Just trying to put the pieces together from a geopolitical perspective and it doesn't seem a coincidence, regardless of Putin's actual aggression.
Click to expand...
Look I completely understand the desire to not send a single penny into this whole fiasco. It’s a rational take when you look at our present economics and the position of the conflict. This is indeed a European problem. I don’t think anybody is wrong for not wanting to spend a penny on it. I just see that we stupidly entered into obligations should this exact situation arise. And it did so here we are. I also can see a geopolitical rational to help somebody disassemble Russia, especially in a this situation where it’s entirely Russia’s fault. We have been geopolitical foes since the end of WW2 and it didn’t stop with the end of the Cold War. The US and Russia will never have allied relations. The best it will ever be is treaties to not aggress. We simply don’t like each other and that isn’t going to change in our lifetimes.

Yes China is now the bigger threat. But they are far from the only threat.
 
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#55,999
#55,999
NorthDallas40 said:
Look I completely understand the desire to not send a single penny into this whole fiasco. It’s a rational take when you look at our present economics and the position of the conflict. This is indeed a European problem. I don’t think anybody is wrong for not wanting to spend a penny on it. I just see that we stupidly entered into obligations should this exact situation arise. And it did so here we are. I also can see a geopolitical rational to help somebody disassemble Russia, especially in a this situation where it’s entirely Russia’s fault. We have been geopolitical foes since the end of WW2 and it didn’t stop with the end of the Cold War. The US and Russia will never have allied relations. The best it will ever be is treaties to not aggress. We simply don’t like each other and that isn’t going to change in our lifetimes.

Yes China is now the bigger threat. But they are far from the only threat.
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I agree..can we be friends again?
 
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