War in Ukraine

#65,401
#65,401
NorthDallas40 said:
Your second sentence directly contradicts with your first sentence. Perhaps you should do some introspection and figure out what you really believe?
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No I'm not contradicting myself. I'd rather not waste the money over there, however if we committed an amount then we should follow through. I don't think we should have an open-ended commitment with unlimited funds.
 
#65,402
#65,402
Much as Ukraine gets to decide when they've had enough, we too get to decide when we've given enough.

I think Russia is in a vulnerable position, recent moves they've made back this up. Ukraine is holding firm for now, I think we'll know more about the direction of this conflict if and when the expected Ukraine counteroffensive begins.
 
#65,404
#65,404
I see European countries getting involved even more instead of just providing weapons if Russia starts winning this decisively. All this weaponry being delivered should be a sign what lies ahead. Unless western countries are willing to chalk it up as an investment loss, that's where we're at unfortunately. Western air power and stand-off weapons would be enough to end this conflict. IMO
 
#65,405
#65,405
scooty_vol said:
what do you want them to do? Ukraine keep fighting and losing more men? If we're going to keep giving them money to fight, let's do it right and put boots on the ground. Can you not see where this going?
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I want them to do what they feel is right for them. If that’s sending more military weapons to fight off the invaders then so be it. Russia didn’t stop at Chechnya, didn’t stop at Georgia, didn’t stop at Crimea. All of Europe has been watching them.

How come no one called foul when Russia was sending Chechnyaians to Afghanistan to kill American soldiers?
 
#65,408
#65,408
scooty_vol said:
No I'm not contradicting myself. I'd rather not waste the money over there, however if we committed an amount then we should follow through. I don't think we should have an open-ended commitment with unlimited funds.
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Sadly the 1994 agreement due to its poorly constructed terms puts no limits on any aid. But that’s ok the US version only says assurances which many such as yourself crawfish as not including lethal aid. Even though the negotiators from all teams clearly state that is the intent the US just didn’t want to be obligated to send troops. Unfortunately the Russian and Ukrainian language versions use the word for guarantee. Slick Willy signed all three so…
 
#65,410
#65,410
Volsdeep4 said:
I want them to do what they feel is right for them. If that’s sending more military weapons to fight off the invaders then so be it. Russia didn’t stop at Chechnya, didn’t stop at Georgia, didn’t stop at Crimea. All of Europe has been watching them.

How come no one called foul when Russia was sending Chechnyaians to Afghanistan to kill American soldiers?
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I agree with your point. Putin wants to get the ussr band back together. I think we could have more troops on the ground in certain roles that would no be in direct conflict but in roles that could slow Russia down. I think we have troops there already to advise but we could play a more active role.
 
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#65,412
#65,412
scooty_vol said:
I agree with your point. Putin wants to get the ussr band back together. I think we could have more troops on the ground in certain roles that would no be in direct conflict but in roles that could slow Russia down. I think we have troops there already to advise but we could play a more active role.
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We don’t need to send a single US military service member actively participating under the US flag. That is a Rubicon we should not cross.
 
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#65,413
#65,413
NorthDallas40 said:
We don’t need to send a single US military service member actively participating under the US flag. That is a Rubicon we should not cross.
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We already have people over there. I'd be for sending more people there as long as they were not in direct conflict and they could be removed easily if needed. I think Ukraine needs way more than weapons if they're going to defend themselves successfully
 
#65,414
#65,414
scooty_vol said:
We already have people over there. I'd be for sending more people there as long as they were not in direct conflict and they could be removed easily if needed. I think Ukraine needs way more than weapons if they're going to defend themselves successfully
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Why send troops into an active war zone if you don’t want them to wind up in direct action?

I’ve no doubt we have people there. CIA and special forces. We can’t help ourselves. I really don’t care if the CIA is there or not it gives them something to do so they leave the citizens alone. But I don’t want to see any US combat troops there. US maintainers in Poland and other depot locations I’m sure is happening also. Just keep them out of Ukraine
 
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#65,416
#65,416
scooty_vol said:
I agree with your point. Putin wants to get the ussr band back together. I think we could have more troops on the ground in certain roles that would no be in direct conflict but in roles that could slow Russia down. I think we have troops there already to advise but we could play a more active role.
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I believe the same. I think it’s been said they have small advisor units in certain places and bring in some of Ukrainians to train off battleground.
 
#65,417
#65,417
NorthDallas40 said:
Why send troops into an active war zone if you don’t want them to wind up in direct action?

I’ve no doubt we have people there. CIA and special forces. We can’t help ourselves. I really don’t care if the CIA is there or not it gives them something to do so they leave the citizens alone. But I don’t want to see any US combat troops there. US maintainers in Poland and other depot locations I’m sure is happening also. Just keep them out of Ukraine
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I agree we shouldn't have them fighting or in a direct role but I'd like too see play a more aggressive indirect role of fighting the russians. The cia will always have time to harass Americans
 
#65,418
#65,418
Hunerwadel said:
My war strategy aptitude is evidently near zero. I have no idea what these people are trying to do.
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they may just end up dead, or retreating to Ukraine, I wouldn't imagine Ukraine turns them away. But it seems like they are trying to give themselves the most defensible position they can. it sounds like they picked some natural borders to keep the Russian's at bay.

Doesn't sound like they plan on expanding, because that border works both ways.

I will be interested to see how both Ukraine and Russia handle this. Does Russia try to crush it quick? I would think that would be the typical thing to do. They MAY try some diplomacy at first while they bring up forces to the area. Revolution has a tendency to spread if not quashed quickly. Other dissidents may decide to test things out too if they see this BMR stick around for a while.

then does Ukraine try to push in and take it, or do they think its a trap/not worth it? Having some defensible grounds inside Russia would be a pretty big win, at least as telling as Bahkmut was. or do they let them be martyrs to Russian tyranny putting the truth to the lie about this whole operation being out to protect ethnic Russians.
 
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#65,420
#65,420
LouderVol said:
they may just end up dead, or retreating to Ukraine, I wouldn't imagine Ukraine turns them away. But it seems like they are trying to give themselves the most defensible position they can. it sounds like they picked some natural borders to keep the Russian's at bay.

Doesn't sound like they plan on expanding, because that border works both ways.

I will be interested to see how both Ukraine and Russia handle this. Does Russia try to crush it quick? I would think that would be the typical thing to do. They MAY try some diplomacy at first while they bring up forces to the area. Revolution has a tendency to spread if not quashed quickly. Other dissidents may decide to test things out too if they see this BMR stick around for a while.

then does Ukraine try to push in and take it, or do they think its a trap/not worth it? Having some defensible grounds inside Russia would be a pretty big win, at least as telling as Bahkmut was. or do they let them be martyrs to Russian tyranny putting the truth to the lie about this whole operation being out to protect ethnic Russians.
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I thought at first they may have brought along some AA and try to take down a chopper or two trying to quell the action. 🤷🏽
 
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