War in Ukraine

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#17,282
clarksvol00 said:
Maybe they did, but the Russian "MSM," which you don't believe exists there, but do believe exists here in the US, is telling you otherwise.
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We've got audio proof of the US State Department coordinating the situation and planning the next govt in Ukraine at least 2 weeks before the coup.

No need for RT or Russian propaganda.
 
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clarksvol00 said:
It's a good thing they acted on this 8 year old phone call in a timely manner.
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They were hoping Ukraine would abide by the 2015 Minsk II ceasefire agreements. I think Putin has shown more restraint than many will give him credit for. 8 years and 14k people dead right there on his border.
 
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Rasputin_Vol said:
World condemnation did not stop us from doing that exact thing in Syria and Libya. The Muslim Brotherood moved weapons from Egypt to Libya, overthrew Khaddaffi, then we shipped/smuggled those weapons to Turkey where they were given to the Free Syrian Army and ISIS.


We had tried that about a year before with the Bay of Pigs. Plus, the only reason why the Soviets put missiles in Cuba was in response to the US placing missiles in Turkey.
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We invaded and laid seige to none of the countries you listed. That's a very important important distinction to be made. And Russia was equally involved in Syria. They are every bit the player in the l this sorted game. You've just fallen prey to the antithesis of my countries propoganda must be truth.
 
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Paper_Towel said:


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Vlad must not have been much on history. There are some pretty good lessons about people who tried to carry out attacks in Russia and Ukraine during the winter and spring. There are even books that tell of the problems Soviets themselves faced flying from and fighting in Ukrainian and Russian mud.
 
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KB5252 said:
We invaded and laid seige to none of the countries you listed. That's a very important important distinction to be made. And Russia was equally involved in Syria. They are every bit the player in the l this sorted game. You've just fallen prey to the antithesis of my countries propoganda must be truth.
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We made Libya a failed state and destroyed Syria with our mercenaries.

Nothing Putin has done to date compares to what we have done to either of those countries.

BTW, all of this belly aching about invading a country while the US is illegally occupying NE Syria.
 
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evillawyer said:
Alexa, how many times can one man shoot himself in the foot?

Which western company is gonna do business in Russia when all this is over (at least while Putie Pie is in power)?

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Putin is a piker. He just has planes and minimal other stuff to nationalize. Now China has whole plants and probably planes, too. The question is whether Putin and Xi are the fools or the people who put planes and factories over there for them to seize.
 
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volgr said:
Exactly. Stay out of their regional conflict but the longer this drags on without a ceasefire the greater chance the West will find a way to get involved.
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That propaganda video is claiming they're intentionally sending foreign volunteers to get killed to get other countries more involved. Whichever particular lie ends up being the most true, all these timelines are getting dark.
 
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Gandalf said:
Well, the reality may well be that Ukraine is and has been a puppet of the USA. I mean, Biden himself did go there and tell them either fire the AG of the country in the next few hours or they would not get $1b of US tax payer money - and they did. Then there is the bit that Hunter Biden has gotten millions from Ukraine (to be fair, for all I know he may have been getting it from Russia too though). That makes things kind of suspicious as to our motives, right or wrong.

Candidly, when Trump came in, I was hopeful that there could be a good relationship with Putin and we could draw Russia permanently out of the cold and turn them against China. All the Dems complete bulls**t about pee tapes etc basically made that impossible. They committed crimes to do that. Mind you, the Clinton foundation has gotten MILLIONS AND MILLIONS from Russia but that was in the past. Point is, because of domestic squabbles between Dems and Gop, we missed a critical opportunity to turn Putin into a quazi ally.

Reality is that we have been meddling in Ukraine for some time. Again, not something I have a problem with as long as it benefits us. We used to topple govs right regularly in the past. Then you have rich guys like Soros who are also meddling - not necessarily always on the same page as the USA, though now his people are deeply embedded into our state dept.

Mind you, at the same time, Biden said he would punish a MAJOR incursion into the Ukraine - a gaff most likely when he was off his meds and one of those rare times his wife wasnt directing him by the hand. So between that and Kamala's ineptness, perhaps Putin thought he could get away with it. He clearly misjudged the intelligence - likely because his staff lied to him.

Again, right now, the USA has no reason to go to war with Russia - Ukraine was not exactly a super ally before all this. That said, it does not benefit the USA for Russia to succeed in annexing Ukraine either. We are playing a dangerous game, however, in that we may end up permanently sealing the Sino Russia relationship and totally reinvigorating the Russia India one (when we REALLY REALLY needed India to be a commercial bulwark against China). Oh - and more than that, with that rumbling coming out of the Saudis, there is the possibility that we could lose the petro-dollar and a huge part of the world could turn against the dollar as the reserve currency and that would totally Fk us proper like almost nothing else. Our economy would utterly collapse if we had to borrow in another currency to fund the MASSIVE deficit spending we are doing with the Chinese.

We are being played for fools - perhaps winning a knight but losing the game to China.
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No sure I completely agree with your analysis regarding India. India and China are enemies. India supposedly has cancelled military hardware contracts recently. If Russia and China more fully align, it doesn't seem that India would want to be reliant on Russia. Yeah, politics does make for strange bedfellows, but you'd think India would be better off aligning with parties who are unlikely to align with China in times of war. We probably should be offering India some good deals on military hardware about now.

India cancelled orders of Russian jets, weapons: US official at Senate hearing
 
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