Welcome to College Football 2024!

[Devo182]

NIL IS going to ruin college football BUT it's better to ruin football than trample the rights of these students. It's just that simple.

NIL never should've been something the NCAA or schools could limit. I like college sports but I love how my country works. It's no contest when you compare "what's good for college football vs what's good for the rights of the students."

Not sure about "ruining" it. A few kids are making millions...as Nico is...yet a Saturday in the Fall looks and feels just the same to me.

But I 100% agree it's not even a discussion. We're talking basic ethics (oh and federal law) vs entitled fandom.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Scholarship is a salary and an endorsement. Pretty easy comparison. (Look it up, if you don’t understand) the kids sign a LOI and receive a years tuition for education,all extra benefits from the University. And they are endorsing the University with free gear and public services.

Scholarships aren't considered a taxable salary legally in most cases (unless that's changed, as tax laws do, but I don't think so.)

 

[Devo182]

That is about the dumbest take out there. You think Mahomes’ house was given to him, his car or any other luxuries he has? He paid for them. So if a player is getting paid NIL. Then he or she can pay for their education.

He paid for them with the money (many millions) he was paid by the Chiefs and ad deals

Please tell me you're trolling. Otherwise scholarship students that get cash stipends, which many do, should suddenly have to...instead...pay for their tuition. Wut?

 

[Clad in Big Orange]

That's right. Kids don't see current players as heroes... The sport was more enjoyable when we could know for sure most kids lived on scraps.

As a conservative member of SCOTUS noted, what a "perverse" thought process. And also a bit of myth ensured by NCAA trash bylaws...players COULDN'T transfer without the program's agreement. They were literally forced to stay, either literally or in their own minds given the strict rules.

Guess everyone goes to work every day happy in knowing they're never doing it for the money, but 100% out of loyalty, no matter how crappy the deal is.


Fwiw they were your "heroes" because you were a kid. And btw far more fans have professional heroes. Those DIRTY folks being paid their market value in cash for their services AND getting NIL deals. For shame!

Jmo but athletes have never been heroes (for solely what they do on the field/court). They're celebrities some choose to look up to, for better or worse. Take it with a grain of salt if you're over 18...

Dale Jones was one of my heroes. If you don’t know who he is and how much the University of TN meant to him and still does, then I’m truly sorry for you.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Never said they were, but there is mass confusion about the legalities involved here, to the point where we can't have a decent conversation. It is a basic fact that everyone needs to understand that the issue here are these laws that were passed by Congress (the Antitrust laws), and only Congress can change them to bring any semblance of order to the sport.

I understand that quite well. There are some people here that don't get it, and that want to restrict it and punish young athletes for simply getting fair market value for their NIL endorsements.

Apparently they feel entitled to continue the corrupt system that the courts are shutting down. It's appalling that anyone would defend that. It's equally appalling that anyone would support an antitrust exemption for that horrible system.

I'm very pleased that the University of Tennessee and the State of Tennessee are leading the charge into the future. It boxes well for the University's sports programs.

It's easy to point out that Florida, Miami, and FSU all buckled to the NCAA on the NIL issue shortly before Tennessee cleaned the CAA's click in federal court. Great recruiting tool!

 

[volfever007]

I guess one way to regulate all this is to start enforcing the academics part of student/athlete.

 

[Devo182]

Dale Jones was one of my heroes. If you don’t know who he is and how much the University of TN meant to him and still does, then I’m truly sorry for you.

Love Dale.

Not sure what that has to do with anything, but cool.

Nico is going to be a hero to thousands of kids...JJJ and Santi have been VFLs for 5 years...what does NiL have anything to do with it?

It's absurd to only enjoy someone if they aren't getting paid money for what they do. Downright sociopathic. Guess that rules out Barnes, Hype, and every pro all-time. And every business person...most scientists...even Jesus made money as a carpenter How ridiculous.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

I guess one way to regulate all this is to start enforcing the academics part of student/athlete.

Like South Carolina did by creating a major for a single WBB recruit that was going to go elsewhere because USCjr didn't have her desired major?

Like UNC did by not requiring athletes to go to class and telling the NCAA to pound sand?

Like Alabama, FSU, and a jist of others that have always looked the other way or even paid other students to attend classes for the athletes?

Yeah, that "enforcing academics" has SUCH a great track record...

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

I guess one way to regulate all this is to start enforcing the academics part of student/athlete.

The intense tutoring that's part of every major athletics program has pretty much made the "student" portion of student-athlete doable by anyone.

The schools nor the NCAA want nothing to do with making academics more challenging at elite schools because it would hurt the bottom line.

 

[volfever007]

Luke South Carolina did by creating a major for a single WBB recruit that was going to go elsewhere because USCjr didn't have her desired major?

Like UNC did by not requiring athletes to go to class and telling the NCAA to pound sand?

Like Alabama, FSU, and a jist of others that have always looked the other way or even paid other students to attend classes for the athletes?

Yeah, that "enforcing academics" has SUCH a great track record...

Yeah, that's why I said "start enforcing" read my post clearly. I know they don't care aboutbthat

 

[volfever007]

The intense tutoring that's part of every major athletics program has pretty much made the "student" portion of student-athlete doable by anyone.

The schools nor the NCAA want nothing to do with making academics more challenging at elite schools because it would hurt the bottom line.

You're exactly right.

 

[kell7517]

He paid for them with the money (many millions) he was paid by the Chiefs and ad deals

Please tell me you're trolling. Otherwise scholarship students that get cash stipends, which many do, should suddenly have to...instead...pay for their tuition. Wut?

Read the entire discussion before chiming in. I said players are getting paid, it’s a scholly. When others were saying that they are “finally”
Getting paid”. Then I said if a kid is making hundreds to millions of dollars by NIL, then why can’t they pay for their education. Point being is these kids have always been getting paid. You know education, tuition, nutrition, health care and so on. Which is what comes with a sports scholly. I have no idea where you got your idea
Or point in the second part of your second paragraph.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

You're exactly right.

That's why I find it so hypocritical of people to fault the players for being interested in their personal bottom line.

The NCAA and schools have been nothing but mercenary about revenue for football and basketball for at least 50 years but when the players think about the money they might make....... "I'm shocked you'd want to ruin the sanctity of college athletics with money."

Gander, meet the goose.

 

[volfever007]

That's why I find it so hypocritical of people to fault the players for being interested in their personal bottom line.

The NCAA and schools have been nothing but mercenary about revenue for football and basketball for at least 50 years but when the players think about the money they might make....... "I'm shocked you'd want to ruin the sanctity of college athletics with money."

Gander, meet the goose.

Well, I personally don't think they should get paid, that's just my opinion, but good for those that get paid. I hear folks say the University is making money off these kids but those folks have no clue how much it takes to keep all the training facilities, expansions up so these kids can compete at their highest level to maybe go pro one day. I say if you sign an NIL deal, you forego all scholarship related benefits that come with it. Pay your own rent, personal trainers, medical bills, food etc.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Read the entire discussion before chiming in. I said players are getting paid, it’s a scholly. When others were saying that they are “finally”
Getting paid”. Then I said if a kid is making hundreds to millions of dollars by NIL, then why can’t they pay for their education. Point being is these kids have always been getting paid. You know education, tuition, nutrition, health care and so on. Which is what comes with a sports scholly. I have no idea where you got your idea
Or point in the second part of your second paragraph.

You are still bogusly conflating salaries with NIL endorsements. They are not the same, as has been pointed out to you repeatedly.

You have no credibility on this issue.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

Yeah, that's why I said "start enforcing" read my post clearly. I know they don't care aboutbthat

No chance of that. It's much more likely that - at least in P4 - the football players and maybe MBB and WBB athletes will be one employees with no "student" requirement.

 

[volfever007]

No chance of that. It's much more likely that - at least in P4 - the football players and maybe MBB and WBB athletes will be one employees with no "student" requirement.

So basically like a minor league?

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Well, I personally don't think they should get paid, that's just my opinion, but good for those that get paid. I hear folks say the University is making money off these kids but those folks have no clue how much it takes to keep all the training facilities, expansions up so these kids can compete at their highest level to maybe go pro one day. I say if you sign an NIL deal, you forego all scholarship related benefits that come with it. Pay your own rent, personal trainers, medical bills, food etc.

Nothing makes the schools offer a scholarship to a guy with a big NIL deal except good old American market economics.

They continue to offer the scholarship because the player's value is more than the NIL alone or the scholarship alone. That's been true for many years, as players were paid under the table.

You can't REALLY fault market economics for a product, in this case an athlete, having value on the open market. It's bedrock in America.

Plenty of Olympic athletes in America are subsidized because they have little value but the Olympic Committee lets them train extensively because they want the US to be competitive in various sports.

Schools do this also with non-revenue sports. Small schools offer themselves as "sacrifices" to an SEC or B1G school for an athletic department funding payday. Money fuels the whole machine.

It's difficult for me to say "Poor UT has to fund all this infrastructure" when I think the school had over $200M in revenue this year.

It's about money. It's been about money. It will continue to be about money. Being upset that it's about money for the players now is VERY VERY questionable.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

You are still bigusmy conflating salaries with NIL endorsements. They are not the same, as has been pointed out to you repeatedly.

You have no credibility on this issue.

Your are epically hypocritical on this issue.

In kind support from the schools is so ehow magically "pay" to you but you discount the athletes' labor????

That's laughably out of touch with the facts.

Reggie Bush says that you should start lobbying to get his Heisman Trophy back.

 

[S.C. OrangeMan]

So basically like a minor league?

It always has been.

 

[volfever007]

Nothing makes the schools offer a scholarship to a guy with a big NIL deal except good old American market economics.

They continue to offer the scholarship because the player's value is more than the NIL alone or the scholarship alone. That's been true for many years, as players were paid under the table.

You can't REALLY fault market economics for a product, in this case an athlete, having value on the open market. It's bedrock in America.

Plenty of Olympic athletes in America are subsidized because they have little value but the Olympic Committee lets them train extensively because they want the US to be competitive in various sports.

Schools do this also with non-revenue sports. Small schools offer themselves as "sacrifices" to an SEC or B1G school for an athletic department funding payday. Money fuels the whole machine.

It's difficult for me to say "Poor UT has to fund all this infrastructure" when I think the school had over $200M in revenue this year.

It's about money. It's been about money. It will continue to be about money. Being upset that it's about money for the players now is VERY VERY questionable.

Wonder how much of that $200M revenue went back into the program? I'm guessing most of it, those nice facilities, a weight room nicer than most NFL weight rooms, etc, all that stuff has to be paid for. If you own a successful business, you know you gotta put money back in it to remain successful.

 

[DrTNT]

Performance has zero to do with it. Nico reeling in millions of dollars before he even puts on a college jersey. I’m saying the kids are already getting paid by receiving a scholarship and extra benefits the UNIVERSITY is providing. If the NIL thing is the way they want the money. Then They should pay for their education.

Again though, how many people agree to go to a place to perform their particular skill set (for most of us tho is called a job, for students it is a particular school) without knowing what type of compensation they are offering and what type of befits package they are offering as well? Most people I the full time working world receive both a salary (or hourly pay grade) couple with a benefit package consistent of insurance (medical, dental, eye, pharmacy, etc…) as well as vacation time and often (though I get not always) retirement how is a player benefitting outside of school from NIL (salary aspect) and receiving a scholarship, etc from school they are signing with (benefits aspect) any different?

I would dare say no one would be willing to accept any such opportunity (job/school {even which major to choose once at school}) without knowing those things. That would be the irony of moronic to accept an offer for an opportunity sight unseen.

However, honestly though a more accurate representation of NIL vs. scholarship & school benefits is the school benefits are equivocal to salary at a profession & NIL is equivocal to endorsements. The Michael Jordan’s, Peyton Manning’s & others of the world make more in endorsements than anything else due to their NIL developed while performing within their profession. As a student coming to college their NIL has nothing to do with their performance on a collegiate field… it has to do with the name, image & likeness they have already developed with their playing high school, 7-on-7, camps etc.

 

[SayUWantAreVOLution]

Wonder how much of that $200M revenue went back into the program? I'm guessing most of it, those nice facilities, a weight room nicer than most NFL weight rooms, etc, all that stuff has to be paid for. If you own a successful business, you know you gotta put money back in it to remain successful.

I think the AD runs reasonably efficiently. When you think of not just the salaries, facilities, and general overhead of a business but also extensive recruiting costs for the AD using the school's private jet, hotels, commercial flights when needed, lots of rental cars, etc, etc to just GET the players recruited, then more expenses to get them to and from games, things get really expensive very quickly.

It's a very large business. That the players are taking note of how crucial they are to the business and the quality of the product and have decided they want a piece of the revenue generated is very American, IMO.

That the courts have agreed that "no other industry could get away with not paying its labor market value" makes perfect sense.

It's awful for college football in the long run but the fans, the schools, the NCAA, the media companies..... ALL of us wanted MORE college football and basketball accessibility and we got it.

This is the fruit of turning college athletics into big business.

 

[kell7517]

You are still bogusly conflating salaries with NIL endorsements. They are not the same, as has been pointed out to you repeatedly.

You have no credibility on this issue.

And what credibility do you have? You’re own!! You are making up your own crap and throwing it to see if it sticks. I didn’t say anything about salary and NIL endorsements being the same. You are just flailing for something that isn’t there. Go try and see if someone else is gonna buy your crap.

 

[volfever007]

I think the AD runs reasonably efficiently. When you think of not just the salaries, facilities, and general overhead of a business but also extensive recruiting costs for the AD using the school's private jet, hotels, commercial flights when needed, lots of rental cars, etc, etc to just GET the players recruited, then more expenses to get them to and from games, things get really expensive very quickly.

It's a very large business. That the players are taking note of how crucial they are to the business and the quality of the product and have decided they want a piece of the revenue generated is very American, IMO.

That the courts have agreed that "no other industry could get away with not paying its labor market value" makes perfect sense.

It's awful for college football in the long run but the fans, the schools, the NCAA, the media companies..... ALL of us wanted MORE college football and basketball accessibility and we got it.

This is the fruit of turning college athletics into big business.

So, I get that the players want a piece of the pie but, do you not think part of that pie are the scholarships? If it weren't for the schools, how would any of these kids get noticed, seems like the athletes need to be paying the schools for advertising.