Why is Trump destroying NATO ?

[newarkvol]

It’s that simple on the surface, they need to honor their commitments...also we should limit our roll, and let the slackers step up...rather than having the US taxpayers foot the bill.

Also...

NATO Is Obsolete | The National Interest

Trump Derides NATO as ‘Obsolete.’ Baltic Nations See It Much Differently.

The United States ambassador to Estonia, James D. Melville Jr., became so exasperated with the constant statements from Mr. Trump disparaging the alliance and the European Union that late last month he quit in disgust.

Trump Derides NATO as ‘Obsolete.’ Baltic Nations See It Much Differently. - The New York Times

 

[tennvols77]

Trump Derides NATO as ‘Obsolete.’ Baltic Nations See It Much Differently.

The United States ambassador to Estonia, James D. Melville Jr., became so exasperated with the constant statements from Mr. Trump disparaging the alliance and the European Union that late last month he quit in disgust.

Trump Derides NATO as ‘Obsolete.’ Baltic Nations See It Much Differently. - The New York Times

No problem then you little pissants, we can be done and you and yours' can go ahead and defend yourselves, don't call when you need us. If and when we decide to do anything that needs to be done, prepayment will be needed.

 

[SLICKYINC]

You guys...and libs...read the comments section? EVERY single one of them..British folks btw...agreed with what Trump says, and the first 2 or 3 openly wish they had him, or a leader just like him. How about that? One post even calls out the English people for not showimg enough respect for "the elected leader of the free world".

But all the foreigners hate Trump, right? He gets zero respect worldwide, right? These English folk state that so far he has done nothing but help the US, and though some dont like his mannerisms...they are quick to separate that from his effectiveness as a leader, and support his policy.

Crazy that a leader who is on an amazing win streak, both at home and worldwide, can't get any respect by the media and half the population here...yet educated western citizens in Europe can see that despite the slanted journalism, Trump is kicking tail. He flat called Germany out, and they have already agreed to remove tariffs on our autos sold there, and talks trash about Russia and holding them at bay...when he is heading into a meeting with Putin on Monday. Why?? Because he isn't scared. Finally, we have a POTUS with a set of balls.

The comments are gold.

 

[Vol_Doc]

How about this? If NATO members aren't contributing a "fair share" to defense, let's cut our defense contribution back and reduce our overall defense budget. Will help reduce government spending and chip away away the debt. We already spend a ridiculous amount on defense compared to the rest of the world. We don't need to be the world's police force.

 

[landscapingvol]

German only gets 9% of its gas from Russia.

Per your source and his source says the usage is going up, so which is it? I would venture to guess that if Germany only used a small fraction like 9% then other NATO members wouldn’t object to their pipeline from Russia. Russia wouldn’t build a pipeline to Germany for an investment that small, that is a bit naive

 

[SLICKYINC]

Putin and Russia now have a willing ally in their effort to undermine NATO and other forms of western alliance

They meddles in the election to help him win. They held countless meetings with his campaign to exert influence. They effectively bribed a number of them, who now face charges. And as it has emerged, Trump himself has tried to cover it up with a phony press release about the meeting with his entire top staff and firing the man in charge of the investigation.

It's obvious. Trump is compromised. Has been for a while.

Anyway, Trump is obviously trying to sabotage the German/Russian pipeline because US oil and gas companies want to supply Germany instead.

A fact directly at odds with the claim that Putin controls Trump.

Obviously this will be ignored because Russian conspiracy theory is religion.

 

[newarkvol]

You guys...and libs...read the comments section? EVERY single one of them..British folks btw...agreed with what Trump says, and the first 2 or 3 openly wish they had him, or a leader just like him. How about that? One post even calls out the English people for not showimg enough respect for "the elected leader of the free world"...

Yes there are conservatives in England who have an affinity for trump..and..?

George Osborne, the Evening Standard and the Conservative media establishment


http://www.mediareform.org.uk/press-ethics-and-regulation/george-osborne-evening-standard-conservative-media-establishment

 

[carlos86]

You guys...and libs...read the comments section? EVERY single one of them..British folks btw...agreed with what Trump says, and the first 2 or 3 openly wish they had him, or a leader just like him. How about that? One post even calls out the English people for not showimg enough respect for "the elected leader of the free world".

But all the foreigners hate Trump, right? He gets zero respect worldwide, right? These English folk state that so far he has done nothing but help the US, and though some dont like his mannerisms...they are quick to separate that from his effectiveness as a leader, and support his policy.

Crazy that a leader who is on an amazing win streak, both at home and worldwide, can't get any respect by the media and half the population here...yet educated western citizens in Europe can see that despite the slanted journalism, Trump is kicking tail. He flat called Germany out, and they have already agreed to remove tariffs on our autos sold there, and talks trash about Russia and holding them at bay...when he is heading into a meeting with Putin on Monday. Why?? Because he isn't scared. Finally, we have a POTUS with a set of balls.

There's only 11 comments lol and BMW said Monday that it would move production for some of its SUVs out of the U.S. to China.

"German Chancellor Angela Merkel and Chinese Prime Minister Li Keqiang stressed their commitment to a multilateral trade system Monday in the wake of Washington's decision to impose widespread tariffs, saying it was to everyone's benefit.

Speaking in Berlin after the two countries signed deals worth 20 billion euros ($23.6 billion)" Trade wars aren't that easy to win and the U.S. has never won one.

 

[PKT_VOL]

Honest question.....why do many think the US needs this alliance? What do we get from NATO and is what we get from NATO worth the price we pay for it. Also, compare the price we pay to what the rest of NATO pays and tell me why it makes sense for the US. Honestly wanting dialogue here and not really looking to argue.

We don't need them at all for their military capabilities (or lack thereof).

NATO's value to the US is strategic in terms of geography, culture, and intelligence.

 

[Squints]

You guys...and libs...read the comments section? EVERY single one of them..British folks btw...agreed with what Trump says, and the first 2 or 3 openly wish they had him, or a leader just like him. How about that? One post even calls out the English people for not showimg enough respect for "the elected leader of the free world".

But all the foreigners hate Trump, right? He gets zero respect worldwide, right? These English folk state that so far he has done nothing but help the US, and though some dont like his mannerisms...they are quick to separate that from his effectiveness as a leader, and support his policy.

Crazy that a leader who is on an amazing win streak, both at home and worldwide, can't get any respect by the media and half the population here...yet educated western citizens in Europe can see that despite the slanted journalism, Trump is kicking tail. He flat called Germany out, and they have already agreed to remove tariffs on our autos sold there, and talks trash about Russia and holding them at bay...when he is heading into a meeting with Putin on Monday. Why?? Because he isn't scared. Finally, we have a POTUS with a set of balls.

 

[carlos86]

How about this? If NATO members aren't contributing a "fair share" to defense, let's cut our defense contribution back and reduce our overall defense budget. Will help reduce government spending and chip away away the debt. We already spend a ridiculous amount on defense compared to the rest of the world. We don't need to be the world's police force.

We spend 3.6% of our GDP on defense and use NATO countries to base our forces out of to use as springboards into Africa, the Middle East, and the Mediterranean Sea.

 

[PKT_VOL]

Classy post.

 

[tennvols77]

This is so much like any situation where you are wealthy. I was fortunate, although through alot of hard work and sacrifice, to be quite wealthy at a relatively young age. Fortunately for me, I have a very close group of friends, but, sh** tons of acquaintances.

My close friends never, never came to me for anything. The other's well, it was less than being forward with their requests. They never got anything. For my close friends, I paid off my their mortgages and car notes, everyone of them. Their gratitude can't be overstated. I will be paying for everyone of their child's college and will also provide living expenses so that they do not have to work like I did in school or grad school.

Now, my democratic friends who have been successful, they won't even pay for their own children's college, rather, allowing them to take scholarships to pay for their school.

Point is, if it's yours, you get to decide what to do with it right, wrong, or indifferent. I choose where my help goes, not the person needing help determining it. These countries have taken advantage of our overly nice and sincere gestures, and it needs to stop.

We, no matter how much anyone likes or dislikes it, we are the biggest, baddest, and most giving country on the planet, and if anyone wants to look the gift horse in the mouth and complain, no problem, go on your own and find ways to do what you want without our help or money.

 

[carlos86]

This is so much like any situation where you are wealthy. I was fortunate, although through alot of hard work and sacrifice, to be quite wealthy at a relatively young age. Fortunately for me, I have a very close group of friends, but, sh** tons of acquaintances.

My close friends never, never came to me for anything. The other's well, it was less than being forward with their requests. They never got anything. For my close friends, I paid off my their mortgages and car notes, everyone of them. Their gratitude can't be overstated. I will be paying for everyone of their child's college and will also provide living expenses so that they do not have to work like I did in school or grad school.

Now, my democratic friends who have been successful, they won't even pay for their own children's college, rather, allowing them to take scholarships to pay for their school.

Point is, if it's yours, you get to decide what to do with it right, wrong, or indifferent. I choose where my help goes, not the person needing help determining it. These countries have taken advantage of our overly nice and sincere gestures, and it needs to stop.

We, no matter how much anyone likes or dislikes it, we are the biggest, baddest, and most giving country on the planet, and if anyone wants to look the gift horse in the mouth and complain, no problem, go on your own and find ways to do what you want without our help or money.

Now apply this reasoning and imagine that NATO had said this after 9/11.

 

[TheDeeble]

I don't get the fascination of pushing away allies in Europe.

Do Trump fans see this as more "winning"?"

Personally, I think there's better ways to handle disagreements between NATO members.

 

[Vol_Doc]

We spend 3.6% of our GDP on defense and use NATO countries to base our forces out of to use as springboards into Africa, the Middle East, and the Mediterranean Sea.

And?

 

[landscapingvol]

We spend 3.6% of our GDP on defense and use NATO countries to base our forces out of to use as springboards into Africa, the Middle East, and the Mediterranean Sea.

US GDP is about 20 trillion US dollars so that is roughly 1 trillion dollars on defense. The highest grossing European GDP is Germany at about 4 trillion US dollars at 1.6% which is roughly 80 billion dollars. The US contributes more than the entire continent of Europe combined. So, the Left wants to fund NATO, the UN, every social program under the sun, illegal immigrants, etc. just as long as it isn’t a tax cut for the very people that actually provide the funding. Makes sense

 

[tennvols77]

We spend 3.6% of our GDP on defense and use NATO countries to base our forces out of to use as springboards into Africa, the Middle East, and the Mediterranean Sea.

Fair deals for a give and take relationship that has balance. Quid pro quo. Base location, here's your rent.

Now apply this reasoning and imagine that NATO had said this after 9/11.

We would have been just fine without the help of NATO, they (countries we have deals with) continue to pick up our rent checks and we use their FOB's for convenience. Whether they provided any type of coalition force or ground forces wouldn't hinder our ability to fight on our own.

I'd rather have a coalition of trusted allies, who wouldn't. I would prefer to not carry the load in an unbalanced manner though.

 

[landscapingvol]

Now apply this reasoning and imagine that NATO had said this after 9/11.

You mean like Turkey barely allowing us to use their airspace? France? Countless other European nations in NATO

 

[PKT_VOL]

I don't get the fascination of pushing away allies in Europe.

Do Trump fans see this as more "winning"?"

Personally, I think there's better ways to handle disagreements between NATO members.

That's what seems to be lost in this discussion.

There is nothing wrong with addressing problems within NATO, but that doesn't necessitate one take this approach with a lack of tact.

 

[carlos86]

You mean like Turkey barely allowing us to use their airspace? France? Countless other European nations in NATO

That refers to Iraq and every NATO country allowed the U.S. to base forces and use its airspace after 9/11.

 

[Mick]

 

[lawgator1]

No one is saying you should not press NATO countries to pay more for its support. No one is saying you can't ask the Germans to consider importing more of their energy from your US campaign benefactor oil companies.


But you do it through normal channels. There are structures in place to accomplish that. You don't come in whining about it and threatening people. It is unsophisticated and dangerous, and causes blowback, as we have increasingly seen.

 

[SLICKYINC]

No one is saying you should not press NATO countries to pay more for its support. No one is saying you can't ask the Germans to consider importing more of their energy from your US campaign benefactor oil companies.


But you do it through normal channels. There are structures in place to accomplish that. You don't come in whining about it and threatening people. It is unsophisticated and dangerous, and causes blowback, as we have increasingly seen.

Do you know that those channels haven't been tried?

I mean all you know about is Russia and that's all your news tells you...

 

[SLICKYINC]

Watching the helicopters go by at opening ceremonies..

Nice try though..