Workers in Democrat-run North Carolina tourist city bemoan downtown decline: 'Really disturbing'

#101
#101
LouderVol said:
defund: to remove funding from.
reduce: to remove at set amount of funding from.

stop playing word games. this is exactly what those cities did when they realized that defunding was bad, they just changed the rhetoric slightly to meet what they had already done.
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So are police departments the only government sector you do not support defunding?
 
#102
#102
lawgator1 said:
Defund and reduce funding are different things.
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This google search: "does defunding the police mean getting rid of them" produced millions of results.
One result:
What Would Efforts to Defund or Disband Police Departments Really Mean? (Published 2020), had this in the article:
What does defunding the police mean?
Calls to defund police departments are generally seeking spending cuts to police forces that have consumed ever larger shares of city budgets in many cities and towns. Minneapolis, for instance, is looking to cut $200 million from its $1.3 billion overall annual budget, said Lisa Bender, the City Council president. The police budget in 2020 was $189 million. She hopes to shift money to other areas of need in the city.
 
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#103
#103
When this concept first came up it was framed in terms of eliminating police departments, I think there were calls for it in San Fran and Minneapolis. And you guys attacked it on that level.

I cannot say how much I oppose cuts in any meaningful way. Like Biden and Democrats actually in control I would like to see more funding for police and let's have better officers with better pay and even better training. That's what actual Dem officials of any actual authority are calling for.

Your bend-over-backwards effort to make it look like the Dem party is unified in simply punishing the police over these incidents by cutting their funding is just painful and failing.
 
#105
#105
luthervol said:
So are police departments the only government sector you do not support defunding?
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my issue is mostly with the federal level stuff. then some with my state, and then some with my local city. so the cops being defunded in some other state doesn't concern me.

As to me I would call my defunding as a reprioritizing. If something doesn't directly contribute to the specified job of that agency/police department, then it should be removed/defunded. I would take 90% of that defunding and have it disappear as money we no longer spend. I would take the remaining 10% and put it back into the agency/department for whatever shortfall they had. assuming that department/city/government is underfunded or in debt. If they can afford what they are spending I would take the 90% and divide it up into other "leaner" programs that still needed funding.
 
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#106
#106
lawgator1 said:
Your bend-over-backwards effort to make it look like the Dem party is unified in simply punishing the police over these incidents by cutting their funding is just painful and failing.
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They were not unified. 41% of Democrats agreed with Defunding the Police.

As reported by Pew, and referenced already, multiple times, in this thread, just above actually.
 
#107
#107
The pleas of “Oh, I was talking about the War on Drugs” when I said that.

People have been saying the WoD was a failure and should be killed for decades. This was something different.
 
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#108
#108
LouderVol said:
my issue is mostly with the federal level stuff. then some with my state, and then some with my local city. so the cops being defunded in some other state doesn't concern me.

As to me I would call my defunding as a reprioritizing. If something doesn't directly contribute to the specified job of that agency/police department, then it should be removed/defunded. I would take 90% of that defunding and have it disappear as money we no longer spend. I would take the remaining 10% and put it back into the agency/department for whatever shortfall Td take the 90% and divide it up into other "leaner" programs that still needed funding.
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That sounds more than reasonable.
 
#111
#111
luthervol said:
That sounds more than reasonable.
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granted that would be my start. I used to be in the flat 50% reduction and grow if there is leftover.

but now I think there is so much bloat, I would want to start with my "reprioritizing" and see how things look. that way we shouldn't be hurting the service, while still saving money, and avoiding a too big government. I would imagine you would still need to see some further cuts, but I would now want at least a year or two of the reprioritizing to see how things turned out first. In that prioritization I would also take a hard look at the middle and upper managers. they people whose sole job is to check a box saying they looked at something.

I am sure it exists at local levels but I would also look at whole agencies at the federal level too. Anything that is a duplication of a bigger agency should be removed. NSA and DHS being folded in to the CIA or FBI.
 
#113
#113
85SugarVol said:
They were not unified. 41% of Democrats agreed with Defunding the Police.

As reported by Pew, and referenced already, multiple times, in this thread, just above actually.
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As explained above, there were a variety of definitions to describe defunding police. Republicans have latched on to the most extreme.
 
#114
#114
ClearwaterVol said:
As explained above, there were a variety of definitions to describe defunding police. Republicans have latched on to the most extreme.
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I remember back to when words mattered. Sometime back in 2016-2020, glad to see that doesn't apply anymore.
 
#115
#115
ClearwaterVol said:
As explained above, there were a variety of definitions to describe defunding police. Republicans have latched on to the most extreme.
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The Pew results referenced above defined it as “% saying spending on policing should be net decreased”.

41% of Democrats in 2020 held that position.

Obviously, that number was going down fast as soon as 2021, and is probably even lower today.
 
#117
#117
Remember when the NYCPD turned their backs on DeBlassio? These radical local pols have thrown the police under the bus and morale is so poor now that any new candidates are probably even less qualified.
 
#119
#119
Go aeiou said:
Ha, ha, my sister's family lives in Weaverville which is just north of Asheville. They warn us to avoid getting there at rush hour, but It seems like we always do. Rush hour means the interstates slow down to about 55 mph. If only we had that problem in Nashville.
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240 isn't too bad, but 26 is an absolute nightmare through there.
 
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#120
#120
The old Canton paper mill in Canton, near Asheville is closing soon. I guess the bright side is the Pigeon river will be a lot cleaner, the bad news about 1100 people will lose their jobs in a poor area of NC.
 
#122
#122
luthervol said:
So are police departments the only government sector you do not support defunding?
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Won't answer for him but it depends on the sector for me. We have a crime problem, increase police and programs to help reduce crime.
 
#123
#123
lawgator1 said:
When this concept first came up it was framed in terms of eliminating police departments, I think there were calls for it in San Fran and Minneapolis. And you guys attacked it on that level.

I cannot say how much I oppose cuts in any meaningful way. Like Biden and Democrats actually in control I would like to see more funding for police and let's have better officers with better pay and even better training. That's what actual Dem officials of any actual authority are calling for.

Your bend-over-backwards effort to make it look like the Dem party is unified in simply punishing the police over these incidents by cutting their funding is just painful and failing.
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While I agree to an extent let's not forget these are politicians and they know making a statement like "Defunding Police" excites support from the vocal fringe. They use those terms on purpose.
 
#124
#124
ClearwaterVol said:
As explained above, there were a variety of definitions to describe defunding police. Republicans have latched on to the most extreme.
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And they were also employed to illicit support from the BLM movement and the fringe who supported abolishment of police. They are politicians. You can't bemoan one side for latching onto it when the other used it to the same end as well.
 
#125
#125
KB5252 said:
While I agree to an extent let's not forget these are politicians and they know making a statement like "Defunding Police" excites support from the vocal fringe. They use those terms on purpose.
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Sure, but in practical terms a) it will not happen to any significant degree; and b) it is not a very popular rallying cry past a very small portion of the party, certainly less than 15 %.
 
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