Year Two: win a bowl game or go sit in the hot seat

#126
#126
Eddie Vol Halen said:
With the opinion circulating that Butch is overpaid, I think it is time to put down the metric for which Year Two will be judged.

Getting to a bowl game is an absolute minimum. Butch is making big boy dinero and he left wins on the field last year. We can forgive (because look who coached them the year before) but there are six no-brainer wins on our schedule and this team is already more than half his.

With the talent he has brought in, an extra month of practice, and we should absolutely handle any low tier bowl opponent. A 6 - 7 year and I think the heat should be on (and rightly so).

I like Butch, and I like almost everything he has done to date in Orange. At the end of the day though, Ws are the only coin of the realm. I think winning a bowl game is a successful Year Two. *

* (anything above 7-wins and the season is a big success as well, bowl game not included)
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:no: Some people just do not get it. Butch has to clean up what Dooley left, we lost our O-line and most of the D-line. We play Oklahoma, Alabama, Georgia, S Carolina and you say he is on the hot seat. Get real dude. :bash:
 
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#127
#127
Eddie Vol Halen said:
With the opinion circulating that Butch is overpaid, I think it is time to put down the metric for which Year Two will be judged.

Getting to a bowl game is an absolute minimum. Butch is making big boy dinero and he left wins on the field last year. We can forgive (because look who coached them the year before) but there are six no-brainer wins on our schedule and this team is already more than half his.

With the talent he has brought in, an extra month of practice, and we should absolutely handle any low tier bowl opponent. A 6 - 7 year and I think the heat should be on (and rightly so).

I like Butch, and I like almost everything he has done to date in Orange. At the end of the day though, Ws are the only coin of the realm. I think winning a bowl game is a successful Year Two. *

* (anything above 7-wins and the season is a big success as well, bowl game not included)
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Sad that you do not understand that it will be another year. After that He will start to feel the heat.
 
#128
#128
daj2576 said:
I certainly understand the difference with objectivity and subjectivity, which is why I am so perplexed with your argument. You appear to objectively arrive at the same conclusion as those who you subjectively define as emotional simply for their hyperbolic verbiage.

That aside, if you discuss anything with a woman like you do everything on here, I have no doubt you find women difficult to talk to. :)
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I'm not using Dooley's failure as an excuse for Jones. There are some here who have vested all of their angst in Dooley. Everything even now that is negative or that goes bad... is related back to Dooley.

Take RF for instance. Every recruit is a risk. Sometimes it doesn't work out for a whole myriad of reasons. But for some... that just isn't good enough. He can't be a JONES signee that didn't cut it... he has to be a DOOLEY recruit. It's Dooley's fault because he's da debil you know...?
 
#129
#129
BeattieFeathers said:
How do we define great? Do we fire butch if he is not great? How many great coaches are there? What ate the chances a great coach would come here? By the way, relative to about a half dozen or so jobs in the sec, the Tennessee job lags behind......
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What ate the chances a great coach would come here? :eek:lol: Freudian slip?

Do you fire a coach that cannot win championships? Depends on the standard for your program. Bama? Yes. UF? Yes. LSU? Yes. USC? Yes. OSU? Yes. Texas? Yes. ND? Yes. OU? Yes. FSU? Yes. Clemson? Yes. UT according to you? Apparently not.

Low expectations and the acceptance of mediocrity are the primary causes that the Tennessee job lags behind... to the extent that statement is true.
 
#130
#130
rickyyrs said:
:no: Some people just do not get it. Butch has to clean up what Dooley left, we lost our O-line and most of the D-line. We play Oklahoma, Alabama, Georgia, S Carolina and you say he is on the hot seat. Get real dude. :bash:
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So did you call or write Butch last year and tell him his expecatations were too high when HE said the season's goal was to get to a bowl game? When that didn't happen here are his comments after the UK game.

Jones: We’ll enjoy this one (win over Kentucky), but Monday we’re back in the weight room getting ready for next season. I want to continue to stay positive and move forward, but it’s expected that we go to bowl games from here on out. That’s our goal.
 
#131
#131
We have how many seniors on this team and we r demanding a bowl game... Come on man

I do think a bowl game is attainable if we don't have too much bad luck... But IMO we need a little luck...
 
#132
#132
daj2576 said:
That aside, if you discuss anything with a woman like you do everything on here, I have no doubt you find women difficult to talk to. :)
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Hmm. That's interesting. I never really thought that the men here were that "woman-like".


Honestly, an in person conversation with me would be pretty different from something here. I imagine most of us are like that. You can't express folded arms or open palms on a chat board. I don't mind arguing. It takes good reason and a good opponent to change my mind. But not many find me very difficult to get along with.
 
#133
#133
Honestly the seat doesn't get hot unless we don't win at least 7-8 games in year 3. It takes more than 3 years to rebuild a program - basically from the ground up.
 
#134
#134
I expect one thing this season: Moderate to Aggressive Play Calling

I don't know if I can handle another game like Vanderbilt. I know we had Dobbs in, but that strategy just frustrates me. Conservative play calling can secure a win in some games, but in rivalry games we should go for the kill. If we lose, at least we lose fighting.
 
#135
#135
Boca Vol said:
So did you call or write Butch last year and tell him his expecatations were too high when HE said the season's goal was to get to a bowl game? When that didn't happen here are his comments after the UK game.

Jones: We’ll enjoy this one (win over Kentucky), but Monday we’re back in the weight room getting ready for next season. I want to continue to stay positive and move forward, but it’s expected that we go to bowl games from here on out. That’s our goal.
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How dare you agree with the unreasonable standards Jones' has set for Jones!!!:whistling:
 
#136
#136
sjt18 said:
I'm not using Dooley's failure as an excuse for Jones. There are some here who have vested all of their angst in Dooley. Everything even now that is negative or that goes bad... is related back to Dooley.

Take RF for instance. Every recruit is a risk. Sometimes it doesn't work out for a whole myriad of reasons. But for some... that just isn't good enough. He can't be a JONES signee that didn't cut it... he has to be a DOOLEY recruit. It's Dooley's fault because he's da debil you know...?
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I've read your arguments, ad nauseum. I would never accuse you of making excuses for Jones.
 
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#138
#138
I understand your frustration at the Dooley blame. However, I think you will see that the longer CBJ is here the more blame he will take.

Think of it as an Obama/Bush thing. Obama's first couple years he was able to use Bush as his scapegoat. Now that Obama is in his 2nd term the scapegoat isn't effective.
 
#140
#140
jamesthesame said:
I understand your frustration at the Dooley blame. However, I think you will see that the longer CBJ is here the more blame he will take.

Think of it as an Obama/Bush thing. Obama's first couple years he was able to use Bush as his scapegoat. Now that Obama is in his 2nd term the scapegoat isn't effective.
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You could be right about the 1st paragraph. Probably are.

Not so much the second... :) Blame Bush is about the only schtick much of the media has left.
 
#141
#141
sjt18 said:
You could be right about the 1st paragraph. Probably are.

Not so much the second... :) Blame Bush is about the only schtick much of the media has left.
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lol You're probably right. If Obama served ten terms and the economy didn't improve would people still be blaming Bush? Sometimes I wonder. I tend to vote more Democrat too.

Sorry, wrong forum. :)
 
#142
#142
jamesthesame said:
I understand your frustration at the Dooley blame. However, I think you will see that the longer CBJ is here the more blame he will take.

Think of it as an Obama/Bush thing. Obama's first couple years he was able to use Bush as his scapegoat. Now that Obama is in his 2nd term the scapegoat isn't effective.
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It is to about 40% of the population, who will support him to the end of the Earth. I am waiting for the "prisoner" exchange to blow up some time, but it won't bother the 40%.
 
#143
#143
I'm not saying that this is how it should be, but the reality is that if we have another 5-7 (or worse) record this season, Jones will be on the hot seat, especially if one of the losses is to Utah State, Arkansas State, Chattanooga, Vanderbilt (again), or Kentucky.
 
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#146
#146
cd12 said:
He gets at least four years for the simple reason Dooley got three...
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To be honest, since Dooley got three, the next guy probably deserves five. But the world ain't fair and Ws are the coin of the realm.

Son of Vince couldn't coach his way out of a wet paper bag. Opportunity is Nowhere.
 
#147
#147
Yeah why not right? Lets just keep hiring and firing until we find the right combo. We can continue buying out contracts because as we all know UT is just flush with cash.

In todays CF there is absolutely no room for rebuilding right? If you don't produce within 2 years, regardless of the situation, then it is time to look elsewhere. Good Lord the state of CF has sunk to the depths of stupidity.
 
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#149
#149
BigOrangeTrain said:
Yeah why not right? Lets just keep hiring and firing until we find the right combo. We can continue buying out contracts because as we all know UT is just flush with cash.

In todays CF there is absolutely no room for rebuilding right? If you don't produce within 2 years, regardless of the situation, then it is time to look elsewhere. Good Lord the state of CF has sunk to the depths of stupidity.
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Speaking of "depths"... you do understand that being on a "hot seat" after two losing seasons is not the same as being "fired" after two losing seasons, right?

BTW, ALL of you guys are making arguments that would have applied equally well to Dooley after year 3. "We don't have the money to change". "Not enough time to clean up the mess". "Program needs stability more than anything else".

If you want to win, you look for and demand excellence from the HC position. Jones understands that fully... I'm not sure why so many here bristle at it.
 
#150
#150
I think it's a fair assumption that CBJ was on the hot seat the moment he arrived after Kiffin/Dooley.
 
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