You wanna complain fine, but quit acting as if the seasons over

#251
#251
OrangeBalls said:
Yes or No.

Do you think with the talent and experience that Martin has at his disposal that we should be sweating it out in March whether we get into the tourney?
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F*** no, and I have said as much. Why am I still being asked this?

That's not what this thread is saying though.
 
#252
#252
BOP said:
I don't care about that game, I don't care about last nights' game. It doesn't match which mediocre team we beat or which mediocre team we lose to. The big picture is this program, and it is in shambles. We are not in good shape, barely making the tournament is not a positive for this team. 4 senior starters, talent this guy clearly will never replicate again. Who cares if we play good 2 out of 3 games and the 3rd is an abysmal performance?
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See you don't even know who starts and who doesn't, true fan.
 
#254
#254
bleedingTNorange said:
Why do you and others keep doing this? Do you not real my posts, or read them but think they say something different?

I have said countless times, sneaking in as a bubble teams isn't some great success with this team. That would be a disappointment. Ok?

All I am saying, is that as of 1/12/13 this Tennessee team is still projected in the dance by most, and is hardly doomed for the NIT after that loss. Lose a few more like that, and yes they'll be out, but as of now they're still in a position to get an at large bid.
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You say this every year bTNo. We're in year 3. It's a broken record. We continue to have head scratching losses under Martin. Martin is a sub standard coach. Again, say we sneak in as an 8 or 9 (because right now that is the best this team deserves), who is happy that we just made it in? Next year will be more of the same and probably worse with less talent.

Sorry, I'm not convinced this coaching staff will ever win a conference title, a conference tournament title or make a run in the NCAA's.
 
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#255
#255
bleedingTNorange said:
F*** no, and I have said as much. Why am I still being asked this?

That's not what this thread is saying though.
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Sorry, I'm not happy with sweating it out and just making it in. And right now, it would take a committee looking the other way to give this team a bid.

I bet there are a number of coaches watching UT basketball and thinking to themselves that there is a lot of talent being wasted. Everyone has their opinions, but anyone that knows anything about basketball can see that this team is seriously flawed and it starts and ends with this coaching staff. That's why in almost 6 seasons this same staff has never made a NCAA tourney.
 
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#257
#257
OrangeBalls said:
You say this every year bTNo. We're in year 3. It's a broken record. We continue to have head scratching losses under Martin. Martin is a sub standard coach. Again, say we sneak in as an 8 or 9 (because right now that is the best this team deserves), who is happy that we just made it in? Next year will be more of the same and probably worse with less talent.

Sorry, I'm not convinced this coaching staff will ever win a conference title, a conference tournament title or make a run in the NCAA's.
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Nothing you said am I saying the contrary to...

I said preseason I would give him all year to prove me wrong, he deserves that IMO. He has beaten many very good teams, made some HOF coaches look dumb, and has flashed potential to be a pretty good coach IMO. I don't think you finish 2nd in conference when projected to finish 11th by being some homeless guy off the streets.

I said before the season, sneak into the tourney and that's a disappointment, no doubt about it. However there's still games left to be played, and I will still give him the rest of the season before calling for his head.
 
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#259
#259
bleedingTNorange said:
Nothing you said am I saying the contrary to...

I said preseason I would give him all year to prove me wrong, he deserves that IMO. He has beaten many very good teams, made some HOF coaches look dumb, and has flashed potential to be a pretty good coach IMO. I don't think you finish 2nd in conference when projected to finish 11th by being some homeless guy off the streets.

I said before the season, sneak into the tourney and that's a disappointment, no doubt about it. However there's still games left to be played, and I will still give him the rest of the season before calling for his head.
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And the fact of the matter is we're in mid-Jan yet again in the same spot. That loss last night killed any momentum we gained at home against Virginia and at LSU. That's what has made people so damn mad and frustrated. It's not like we lost to A & M on the road or got beat by a better team at home. We choked mightily against a team that we should beat 9 times out of 10. We got the huge win over LSU and should've gone into Rupp 3-0. It's just pathetic and maddening as hell that we're even having to talk about it yet again. But hey, thanks coach Martin for keeping it interesting yet again!
 
#260
#260
bleedingTNorange said:
Consistent enough to be 10-5, what's double that?

Are you suggesting this team is gonna do the opposite of what Martin's teams have done, and lose more as the season goes on? History tells us his teams play better late, no?
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Tennessee doesnt make the AA Tourney with only 20 wins in my opinion......
 
#261
#261
Freak said:
I don't disagree with any of this and your points are fair. However, and some point it has to be about what this team has accomplished, not what they mathematically still might accomplish. Every loss such as this one, like you posted earlier, means they have to make up for it somewhere. The inconsistency is troubling. :hi:
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Troubling is an understatement but that is CCM's teams in a nutshell - the model of inconsistency and trying to scramble as the season draws to a close to try and make the AA Tourney. But what do you expect from a coach who has never made the dance? Mediocre hire gives you mediocre results.
 
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#263
#263
bleedingTNorange said:
Unfortunately if Zo makes the dance you're gonna have to deal with him for a few more years, and watch him sign his contract giving him an extension and a raise.
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Don't I know it. And that's why I would love to root against our team but I just can't do it. We're probably better off missing the tourney and starting new next year than having us barely make it and Zo getting an extension.

Look at Ole Miss. Andy Kennedy was about to be fired and sold his soul to get Marshall Henderson in school. Got him to the tourney last year, after about 8 years, and got him an extension.
 
#265
#265
bleedingTNorange said:
Nothing you said am I saying the contrary to...

I said preseason I would give him all year to prove me wrong, he deserves that IMO. He has beaten many very good teams, made some HOF coaches look dumb, and has flashed potential to be a pretty good coach IMO. I don't think you finish 2nd in conference when projected to finish 11th by being some homeless guy off the streets.

I said before the season, sneak into the tourney and that's a disappointment, no doubt about it. However there's still games left to be played, and I will still give him the rest of the season before calling for his head.
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So here's another couple of questions. Let's take making the tourney or not this year out of it. Take W's and L's out of the equation.

From what you have seen of Zo and his teams, do you think his teams are well coached? Do our teams have a strategic advantage over our opponents most nights?
 
#266
#266
OrangeBalls said:
Haven't been over to HV in years. You should post here more often.
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Thanks. Just started to a few weeks ago. Been a member here for a few years but really never came by for some reason. Showed up a month or so ago and love the activity on the board. Looking forward to finally being able to start my own threads... :)
 
#267
#267
NYC Vol said:
Don't I know it. And that's why I would love to root against our team but I just can't do it. We're probably better off missing the tourney and starting new next year than having us barely make it and Zo getting an extension.

Look at Ole Miss. Andy Kennedy was about to be fired and sold his soul to get Marshall Henderson in school. Got him to the tourney last year, after about 8 years, and got him an extension.
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I don't trust Hart to make a good hire. We're in a Catch-22 and we shouldn't be. Outside of Ky, we have the best attendance in the SEC and probably make the most money. Ky, Fla, UT, Ark and Mizzou probably make the most money. Outside of that, most people in the SEC could care less. UT fans deserve better than what they're getting right now. It's pathetic.
 
#268
#268
bleedingTNorange said:
Sure, you can say that about any team though no?

Everyone wants to point to Martin's "history" as evidence....what's his track record after January 11th? He wins more than he losses.

So the people saying we are gonna fall apart, are actually saying Martin is gonna do something that his team hasn't done. If this team follows his other teams path, they will be in the dance.
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Six losses last year after January 11 in reg season (and six the year before) - Tennessee doesn't make the dance with 20 wins this season in my opinion.
 
#269
#269
I said it in another thread and I'll say it here. I think UT will be on the proverbial bubble yet again going into the SEC tourney. Then they'll need to probably win some games in the SEC tourney (I'm thinking 2) to get into the tourney. That's why last night's loss galls me. We had a chance to get ahead of the curve and we continue to make it tough on ourselves.

I get frustrated for the players that aren't being put in the best position to win the game because of a coaching staff that is not up to par. If you aren't a great X's and O's coach like Martin, then you damn well better have an asst that can help you out. Martin has none. Pearl wasn't the best X's and O's coach, but he had Shay and Forbes to help him out. If Martin makes it past this year, Hart should demand he make some staff changes.
 
#270
#270
bleedingTNorange said:
I'm as mad as anyone, that may be the worst loss of the Zo era simply because of how we choked it away.

However, that loss doesn't doom us to the CBI all of a sudden. I will guarantee we are still in the next updated brackets, and our RPI will still be decent. We obviously just made it a bit harder on ourselves, but to act as if there's no way this team can make the tourney now is simply overreacting.
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images
 
#271
#271
NYC Vol said:
So here's another couple of questions. Let's take making the tourney or not this year out of it. Take W's and L's out of the equation.

From what you have seen of Zo and his teams, do you think his teams are well coached? Do our teams have a strategic advantage over our opponents most nights?
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Most nights? Yes IMO. He's won more than he's lost.

It's clear he's not a veteran coach, but every coach starts some where. He has shown flashes IMO, but the inconsistency is an issue IMO. He had a great game plan against LSU, and the plan to down the screen worked tremendously and frustrated LSU all night.

He needs to become more consistent, do that and I think he can lead Tennessee to 20+ wins a year.

Jmo
 
#272
#272
bleedingTNorange said:
Well right now Tennessee is projected to win 14 of their remaining 16 games, which would put their record at 24-7. I'm not sure how you wanna break down the percentages, but yea...
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based upon whose projections? Did that person project a Tennessee loss to A&M at home?
 
#273
#273
bleedingTNorange said:
Most nights? Yes IMO. He's won more than he's lost.

It's clear he's not a veteran coach, but every coach starts some where. He has shown flashes IMO, but the inconsistency is an issue IMO. He had a great game plan against LSU, and the plan to down the screen worked tremendously and frustrated LSU all night.

He needs to become more consistent, do that and I think he can lead Tennessee to 20+ wins a year.

Jmo
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His in game coaching is sub par. A & M adjusted and what did UT do? Martin had no answers. You hold them to 18 points in the 1st half and allow them to score 39 in the 2nd? Good Lord.

A & M is a young team and that was their first true road game. UT had more talent and more experience. Yet, A & M looked like the veteran team that went on the road and got the victory. If I'm Martin, I'd be embarrassed as hell at that outcome.
 
#275
#275
bleedingTNorange said:
Most nights? Yes IMO. He's won more than he's lost.

It's clear he's not a veteran coach, but every coach starts some where. He has shown flashes IMO, but the inconsistency is an issue IMO. He had a great game plan against LSU, and the plan to down the screen worked tremendously and frustrated LSU all night.

He needs to become more consistent, do that and I think he can lead Tennessee to 20+ wins a year.

Jmo
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So you judge a coach and his ability to coach each night if he wins? That's it? So if we beat Tennessee Tech he was a good coach that night cause we won? If we lose to UK, he's a bad coach and did a bad job that night? That's the criteria?
 
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