2008 Titans

[Bassmanbruno]

First bolded sentence - no.
Second - Not really, especially not Moss.
Third - yes, but they (as I said) are pretty much the only two people that size in the NFL that can make that claim. (I'm talking about the speed.) Which is my point.

Actually - yes.
Burress and Johnson are 6'4-6'5... Moss is listed anywhere from 6'3-6'4.

 

[NashVol11]

Yeah he's nothing like him. One is old and washed up and the other still has some playing time ahead of him. Both will have medicore careers and neither will be a legit threat for us.

This could have been a response to either of your posts, but you are underrating Washington's on-field speed. He is like a taller version of Hawkins (the Cal guy), not McCareins. McCareins was small, slow and generally bad; Washington can move. No one has really disputed that he is a downfield threat outside of you right now. His YPC was about 3 yards higher than anyone else on our team.

 

[NashVol11]

Actually - yes.
Burress and Johnson are 6'4-6'5... Moss is listed anywhere from 6'3-6'4.

As is Britt...one inch does not change the speed standard, as I said.

 

[Bassmanbruno]

This could have been a response to either of your posts, but you are underrating Washington's on-field speed. He is like a taller version of Hawkins (the Cal guy), not McCareins. McCareins was small, slow and generally bad; Washington can move. No one has really disputed that he is a downfield threat outside of you right now. His YPC was about 3 yards higher than anyone else on our team.

I wasn't comparing their style of play - just their contributions or future contributions to our team.

And I'd say Big Ben will make a WR look at lot better than VY or Collins will - especially when you have Ward/Holmes in front of you on the depth chart to open the field.

 

[NashVol11]

Congratulations. Where is Nicks listed on all this stuff?

And I would have rather had a burner drafted at WR at this point. Every guy on our roster is pretty much a possession guy it seems. The guy from Cal, name slips my mind atm, has pretty good speed but we'll see.

Neither of them had Nicks in the first round. And he is slower than Britt is, albeit slightly. He is by no means a "burner."

 

[Bassmanbruno]

As is Britt...one inch does not change the speed standard, as I said.

Then where do you draw the line? 1.5 inches? 2 inches? Is there a chart for this speed standard? I'm a lot excited about his build/overall size rather than his height because he's not going to be able to out jump the best of them due to his height like some receivers can.

 

[NashVol11]

I wasn't comparing their style of play - just their contributions or future contributions to our team.

And I'd say Big Ben will make a WR look at lot better than VY or Collins will - especially when you have Ward/Holmes in front of you on the depth chart to open the field.

Not disputing that, but he has much more potential as a downfield threat than McCareins or Brandon Jones do. After Chris Johnson, he may very well be the fastest offensive player we have.

 

[Bassmanbruno]

Neither of them had Nicks in the first round. And he is slower than Britt is, albeit slightly. He is by no means a "burner."

Seems that 90% of people had Nicks above Britt - and I was definitely more impressed with Nicks this past season - though I got to see a lot more UNC games than Rutgers games.

 

[NashVol11]

Then where do you draw the line? 1.5 inches? 2 inches? Is there a chart for this speed standard? I'm a lot excited about his build/overall size rather than his height because he's not going to be able to out jump the best of them due to his height like some receivers can.

Someone like Maclin - someone 5'10 to 6'1, 180-200 pounds - needs to probably run a 4.4 or better to be a first-rounder. For them, 4.47 is average. For someone 6'3-6'5, around 220-235 pounds, they need to run about 4.55 or better and 4.47 is good for that size. That's why Calvin Johnson, who is 6'5 235 and STILL runs a 4.35, is generally considered a freak of nature.

 

[NashVol11]

Seems that 90% of people had Nicks above Britt - and I was definitely more impressed with Nicks this past season - though I got to see a lot more UNC games than Rutgers games.

That's true initially, especially fresh after that Car Care Bowl, but by a few weeks ago they were generally ranked about the same. Kiper and McShay had Nicks in the first round I think until their very last mocks, and I'm sure they had him in the first couple picks in the second round then. They were considered in the same tier generally.

 

[Brewerw]

Bassmanbruno, seriously, stop. Why are you so insistent that you know more than an NFL front office. I bet you were one of the people who hated CJ when we picked him. Not comparing the two but check this out.
Catches:
Crabtree 78
Britt 68

Catches per game
Crabtree: 7.8
Britt: 7.5

Yards
Crabtree: 1010
Britt: 994

Yards per game
Britt: 110.1
Crabtree 101.0

Yards per catch
Britt: 14.6
Crabtree: 12.9

Obviously Britt is no Crabtree, but he is talented. (Though his QB was way worse and Rutgers loves to run.)

 

[Bassmanbruno]

Bassmanbruno, seriously, stop. Why are you so insistent that you know more than an NFL front office. I bet you were one of the people who hated CJ when we picked him. Not comparing the two but check this out.
Catches:
Crabtree 78
Britt 68

Catches per game
Crabtree: 7.8
Britt: 7.5

Yards
Crabtree: 1010
Britt: 994

Yards per game
Britt: 110.1
Crabtree 101.0

Yards per catch
Britt: 14.6
Crabtree: 12.9

Obviously Britt is no Crabtree, but he is talented. (Though his QB was way worse and Rutgers loves to run.)

Brewerw, seriously stop - I mean it.

No - I liked CJ - you can go back through the Titans threads and I was bashed for saying he was going to be on sports center quite a lot this year and will have some major contributions.

And - yes - you are comparing the two. You listed both of their stats side by side. Looks like comparing to me.

I never said Britt was crappy - he's solid and is not likely a high risk/high reward guy because of his style. I think the Titans would have definitely jump on Nicks if he was still there or even Harvin - who would give us a dynamic receiver for once. I said the pick could have been used else where for the better or we could have used a burner and not a possession guy. I've never been a big fan of using a late first round (25-32ish) on a WR... if you're going to draft a big time WR you really need to try to do it early because you often find a big gap between a few of them in that range.

I just don't feel this was the year to draft a WR (if we weren't going to trade up) since we had such a low 1st round pick. The past years when we actually had a chance for a decent pick up - no one was there at the time but this class had a deeper selection.

 

[buckeyevol23]

Recently, there have been some good WRs drafted late in the 1st like Santonio Holmes, Bowe, Anthony Gonzalez, and Roddy White. Plenty of top 10 WRs have been busts too like Troy Williamson, Mike Williams, Reggie Williams, Charles Rogers. That's just how WRs are. It's a big hit or miss position.

 

[Bassmanbruno]

Recently, there have been some good WRs drafted late in the 1st like Santonio Holmes, Bowe, Anthony Gonzalez, and Roddy White. Plenty of top 10 WRs have been busts too like Troy Williamson, Mike Williams, Reggie Williams, Charles Rogers. That's just how WRs are. It's a big hit or miss position.

Yeah and there have been plenty crappy ones in that range as well. The ones in the top 15 range being busts are a lot more rare.

 

[buckeyevol23]

Yeah and there have been plenty crappy ones in that range as well. The ones in the top 15 range being busts are a lot more rare.

Well, if you look at some of the guys drafted in the 1st 15 picks like Stallworth, Braylon Edwards, Michael Clayton or Roy Williams who've had up and down careers, it's not that that much different in success rate between WRs in the top or bottom half of the 1st round.

Although, with the higher picks you can get an athletic freak like Calvin Johnson, Andre Johnson or Fitzgerald. But Charles Rogers was considered a freak too.

 

[NashVol11]

I never said Britt was crappy - he's solid and is not likely a high risk/high reward guy because of his style. I think the Titans would have definitely jump on Nicks if he was still there or even Harvin - who would give us a dynamic receiver for once. I said the pick could have been used else where for the better or we could have used a burner and not a possession guy. I've never been a big fan of using a late first round (25-32ish) on a WR... if you're going to draft a big time WR you really need to try to do it early because you often find a big gap between a few of them in that range.

It is highly unlikely that we take an injury-prone pothead that is generally incapable of playing on the outside and incapable of running good routes at all--coming from a spread offense that in no way translates to the NFL--with our first-round pick. Washington is our burner. But the ones you wanted--namely Harvin--have much less of a shot at becoming #1 receivers than Britt does. And I have no idea why you even bring up Nicks, as he was considered a second-rounder who is slower, smaller and less productive than Britt. If you are disappointed about Britt being a "possession guy," then you cannot even talk about Nicks. And outside of the top ten, the "gap" that you speak of isn't really there.

EDIT: Before the draft, we were said to be really high on Britt as well. We would most likely have taken him over Nicks, and I don't mind that at all.

 

[Bassmanbruno]

It is highly unlikely that we take an injury-prone pothead that is generally incapable of playing on the outside and incapable of running good routes at all--coming from a spread offense that in no way translates to the NFL--with our first-round pick. Washington is our burner. But the ones you wanted--namely Harvin--have much less of a shot at becoming #1 receivers than Britt does. And I have no idea why you even bring up Nicks, as he was considered a second-rounder who is slower, smaller and less productive than Britt. If you are disappointed about Britt being a "possession guy," then you cannot even talk about Nicks. And outside of the top ten, the "gap" that you speak of isn't really there.

EDIT: Before the draft, we were said to be really high on Britt as well. We would most likely have taken him over Nicks, and I don't mind that at all.

Yeah - there's a drop off from Crabtree... and then from Maclin to the rest... Harvin could be up there but if obviously the biggest risk of the draft - but don't discredit Harvin yet. He could be a beast - and he's not a product of the system... don't kid yourself. He would have been a star in any system.

And Nicks is just a playmaker - and no he was not considered a second rounder unless you were judging right at the end of the CFB season. And less productive? The dude has been on a craptastic team for all but the past season (and a backup QB was throwing to him this season as well). Luckily - Butch Davis got them turned around this year so he could actually have some success.

I don't think Britt will develop into a #1 - but I'm not sure any receiver will look like a #1 with our QB situation. Personally - I would've tried to trade up for Maclin - especially considering how late he went since we were set on taking a receiver in the first round.

 

[NashVol11]

Yeah - there's a drop off from Crabtree... and then from Maclin to the rest... Harvin could be up there but if obviously the biggest risk of the draft - but don't discredit Harvin yet. He could be a beast - and he's not a product of the system... don't kid yourself. He would have been a star in any system.

And Nicks is just a playmaker - and no he was not considered a second rounder unless you were judging right at the end of the CFB season. And less productive? The dude has been on a craptastic team for all but the past season (and a backup QB was throwing to him this season as well). Luckily - Butch Davis got them turned around this year so he could actually have some success.

I don't think Britt will develop into a #1 - but I'm not sure any receiver will look like a #1 with our QB situation. Personally - I would've tried to trade up for Maclin - especially considering how late he went since we were set on taking a receiver in the first round.

People compare him to Reggie Bush, but he could just as easily be Ted Ginn. Either way, neither is the #1 WR that we need and there are too many red flags.

Right before the draft, Nicks was considered an early second-rounder. Britt is a playmaker as well, and Nicks was not even the best WR on his own team before Brandon Tate got injured.

We are never set on taking any position; we just really liked Britt, so we took him. And if the spread is a concern with any player, it's Maclin. I like him, but I don't think he's amazing.

 

[Bassmanbruno]

People compare him to Reggie Bush, but he could just as easily be Ted Ginn. Either way, neither is the #1 WR that we need and there are too many red flags.

Right before the draft, Nicks was considered an early second-rounder. Britt is a playmaker as well, and Nicks was not even the best WR on his own team before Brandon Tate got injured.

We are never set on taking any position; we just really liked Britt, so we took him. And if the spread is a concern with any player, it's Maclin. I like him, but I don't think he's amazing.

Everything I saw (including both guys on ESPN) had Nicks 1 spot above Britt going into the draft. They listed both as late 1st or early 2nd.

I know they're both play makers - but Nicks had a ton of huge plays this past year - more so than Britt. And Tate is not better than Nicks purely as a WR for the NFL. You can make that argument if you add his punt/kickoff return threat into the equation though because he can definitely add that dimension.

 

[Sabanocchio]

Everything I saw (including both guys on ESPN) had Nicks 1 spot above Britt going into the draft. They listed both as late 1st or early 2nd.

I think the Titans take Nicks before Britt definitely. The cards didn't fall that way though, obviously. I like Britt though. I'll have to see more of him before I'm sold, but the analysts have had good things to say. I don't think he's an immediate success. I think he has some time before he's a consistent weapon, but I think he will get there.

 

[TrueOrange]

Titans new DC Chuck Cecil was inducted into the 2009 College Football Hall of Fame

Cecil now a college Hall of Famer - AFC South - ESPN

A two-time First Team Academic All-America selection (1986-87), Chuck Cecil becomes only the second Arizona player to be inducted into the College Football Hall of Fame.

A consensus All-American in 1987, Cecil was the Aloha Bowl MVP and a two-time All-Conference selection. He was named Pac-10 Defensive Back of the Year in 1987 and Pac-10 Player of the Week on three occasions. He is a recipient of the NCAA Top Six Award, the Pac-10 Conference Medal and a three-time Golden Eagle Award (3.0 GPA or better) honoree. The defensive back set school records for career passes defended (38), interceptions in a single game (four) and career interceptions (21).

Drafted in the fourth round of the 1988 draft by the Green Bay Packers, Cecil spent seven seasons in the NFL with the Packers, Arizona Cardinals and Houston Oilers...

Cecil has served as co-chair of the University of Arizona Medical Center Foundation campaign for UMC Trauma Center with his wife and founded the Chuck Cecil Scholarship Golf Classic benefitting University of Arizona scholarships.

 

[TrueOrange]

I guarantee you the Titans would learn to adjust if they could get their hands on a type of player like that or that caliber.

Believe me, I don't doubt that they could or would. But the general opinions seem to be that Fisher and Co. are very happy with Tulloch and what he's been doing /how he's been coming along, and that really, for Fisher's D, they like a smaller, quicker MLB in their system.

They really were never considering replacing him at this point.

 

[Brewerw]

Brewerw, seriously stop - I mean it.

No - I liked CJ - you can go back through the Titans threads and I was bashed for saying he was going to be on sports center quite a lot this year and will have some major contributions.

And - yes - you are comparing the two. You listed both of their stats side by side. Looks like comparing to me.

I never said Britt was crappy - he's solid and is not likely a high risk/high reward guy because of his style. I think the Titans would have definitely jump on Nicks if he was still there or even Harvin - who would give us a dynamic receiver for once. I said the pick could have been used else where for the better or we could have used a burner and not a possession guy. I've never been a big fan of using a late first round (25-32ish) on a WR... if you're going to draft a big time WR you really need to try to do it early because you often find a big gap between a few of them in that range.

I just don't feel this was the year to draft a WR (if we weren't going to trade up) since we had such a low 1st round pick. The past years when we actually had a chance for a decent pick up - no one was there at the time but this class had a deeper selection.

Fair enough... I see this as about equal to our other options though. I wouldn't have minded seeing Max Unger come to us, but it is what it is. I think Britt is just the kind of guy Fisher wanted.

 

[NashVol11]

Fair enough... I see this as about equal to our other options though. I wouldn't have minded seeing Max Unger come to us, but it is what it is. I think Britt is just the kind of guy Fisher wanted.

I have a feeling we like Leroy Harris too much to do that. We would need one other lineman if we let Amano go, but we've shown that we don't really ever need to take them in the first round.

 

[TitanHope]

The Titans had Nicks and Britt rated nearly identical. Neither would have been reaches at #30. I like both WR's a lot.

Britt had the 3rd longest arms among the WR's at the combine. The knocks about his catching/drops is because he tends to catch the ball with his body. His strength, physicality, and long arms make him the best blocking WR in the draft, at least out of the top guys. Better leaper than Nicks, and is faster and taller. A good route runner coming out too, and can get through jams.

Nicks had the 2nd biggest hands. Has questionable work ethic/discipline after gaining nearly 20 lbs. due to not being able to work out because of an injury. He has an inconsistent motor, and he's just an average blocker. Better body control than Britt, and uses his hands to catch the ball away from his body. Isn't as fast as Britt, but is better after the catch with his good balance. Good route runner too, but it will still be hard for him to get separation consistently.

Britt is an all-around WR, and Nicks is a possession guy. As I said, I like both a lot, but with Britt being a better down-field threat and better blocker, he fits Dinger's scheme better.

Also, to clarify a few misconceptions:

I don't know who said Britt was strictly a possession guy, but that's wrong.

I think 40-times for offensive skill positions are vastly over-valued. Running good routes cause more separation than pure speed. But, Britt's 40-time of 4.47 is just fine. Maclin ran a 4.46 40, and Britt has 20 lbs. on him.

Rey Maualuga is best when he moving straight ahead. He would struggle in the Titans Cover 2. He'd have to be taken out on 3rd Down, and could be a liability with his aggressiveness. Would the Titans change their philosophy on drafting the MIKE position early if a can't miss prospect is available? Yes, but that prospect is not Maualuga.