2013 F Austin Nichols (Memphis Briarcrest)

[MemphisCanes]

Since when is 10.6 ppg and 5 boards a beast and less than a block a game beastly?

Also, he's a foul machine too.

Watch him play. He's putting up comparable numbers to my boy Jarnell Stokes last season, with better scorers around him, and you guys can't stop slobbering over Jarnell. It's cause he wears blue I guess.

 

[MemphisCanes]

Ole Miss is pretty darn good this year. Bama will likely flop but they look good enough to get a bid. And you KNOW the Vols are dancing baby!!!

Unfortunately UT has the worst resume of the three right now, but I think that's likely to change once the season progresses.

 

[zjcvols]

Watch him play. He's putting up comparable numbers to my boy Jarnell Stokes last season, with better scorers around him, and you guys can't stop slobbering over Jarnell. It's cause he wears blue I guess.

Oh wow, that's awesome! Jarnell put up numbers just as good last year as Black is this year. Except Tarik is a junior and Jarnell was a mid season freshman that came in.

And that's because A) Jarnell plays for UT. B) Jarnell is really good.

I've seen Black play. I'm not going to slobber over a guy who is probably the most athletic big man in his conference and yet can't grab more than five rebounds for his career. He's a foul machine, has no low post moves, horrible rebounder, and basically is Patric Young lite.

But hey, I was impressed with him against NUI. He had as many fouls/turnovers combined as points.

 

[MemphisCanes]

Oh wow, that's awesome! Jarnell put up numbers just as good last year as Black is this year. Except Tarik is a junior and Jarnell was a mid season freshman that came in.

And that's because A) Jarnell plays for UT. B) Jarnell is really good.

I've seen Black play. I'm not going to slobber over a guy who is probably the most athletic big man in his conference and yet can't grab more than five rebounds for his career. He's a foul machine, has no low post moves, horrible rebounder, and basically is Patric Young lite.

But hey, I was impressed with him against NUI. He had as many fouls/turnovers combined as points.

Dude shot 70% from the field last year. He's not the best ebounder in the world, but Jarnell isn't the best defender in the world. Doesn't mean both aren't great ball players. The difference in numbers is because Tarik has Jackson, Thomas, Goodwin and Johnson on his team. Stokes has Golden and..... no one else of real note.

Again, I hope he's good to go on January 4th.

 

[zjcvols]

Dude shot 70% from the field last year. He's not the best ebounder in the world, but Jarnell isn't the best defender in the world. Doesn't mean both aren't great ball players. The difference in numbers is because Tarik has Jackson, Thomas, Goodwin and Johnson on his team. Stokes has Golden and..... no one else of real note.

Again, I hope he's good to go on January 4th.

Tarik Black isn't a great ball player.

And so you are telling me he just gets putbacks and dunks. He has not offensive game and is the fifth option for a reason.

 

[bleedingTNorange]

Since when is 10.6 ppg and 5 boards a beast and less than a block a game beastly?

Also, he's a foul machine too.

If you were high you'd understand.

 

[MemphisCanes]

Tarik Black isn't a great ball player.

And so you are telling me he just gets putbacks and dunks. He has not offensive game and is the fifth option for a reason.

First, he can't rebound. Then, he can only score when he gets a rebound and a dunk.

Just admit that you haven't really seen him play. You're veering dangerously close to "Donny from The Big Lebowski" area here, sir.

 

[zjcvols]

Also, Black is 4th on the team in shots attempted, only trailing Barton by 3 for third.

He also leads the team in free throw attempts.

This whole "Tarik never gets chances" is simply not true.

It would also help if he didn't average 3.6 fouls per game.

 

[zjcvols]

First, he can't rebound. Then, he can only score when he gets a rebound and a dunk.

Just admit that you haven't really seen him play. You're veering dangerously close to "Donny from The Big Lebowski" area here, sir.

No. I like my argument. Go ahead and argue that a 10/5 junior who only has a block per game this year and has 3.5 fouls per game is a great player. I like my chances.

Kenny Hall is averaging 8/7 and shoots 65.2% from the field as the fifth option on offense.

Is he a great player?

 

[bleedingTNorange]

Would Kenny even be considered the 5th option?

Going by fga he's the 6th option...just further proves how beastly K Hall is.

 

[cncchris33]

Watch him play. He's putting up comparable numbers to my boy Jarnell Stokes last season, with better scorers around him, and you guys can't stop slobbering over Jarnell. It's cause he wears blue I guess.

No offense MC, but comparing Stokes' numbers from an abbreviated freshman season (really his senior year of HS) to Black as a junior is the worst argument in history. A real "apple's and oranges" type statement.

 

[GatorsGators]

Oh wow, that's awesome! Jarnell put up numbers just as good last year as Black is this year. Except Tarik is a junior and Jarnell was a mid season freshman that came in.

And that's because A) Jarnell plays for UT. B) Jarnell is really good.

I've seen Black play. I'm not going to slobber over a guy who is probably the most athletic big man in his conference and yet can't grab more than five rebounds for his career. He's a foul machine, has no low post moves, horrible rebounder, and basically is Patric Young lite.

But hey, I was impressed with him against NUI. He had as many fouls/turnovers combined as points.

That description doesn't fit Young whatsoever, unless you're basing it only off of his two games against UT last season.

 

[zjcvols]

That description doesn't fit Young whatsoever, unless you're basing it only off of his two games against UT last season.

Young is better than Black. My point being that Black is just like Young, a physical specimen.

Also, Young, while better than Black, is underachieving too.

Although I like the better rebounding and blocking shots this year. But he turns the ball over too much considering how he doesn't get a lot of touches.

 

[MemphisCanes]

Also, Black is 4th on the team in shots attempted, only trailing Barton by 3 for third.

He also leads the team in free throw attempts.

This whole "Tarik never gets chances" is simply not true.

It would also help if he didn't average 3.6 fouls per game.

You can obviously read a stat sheet. Good job. But let's use some big boy stats and move away from your mickey-mouse non-efficiency adjusted ones.

Offensive Rating (kenpom):
Tarik Black- 119.5 (95th in the Nation)
Jarnell Stokes- 98.7 (Not ranked in top 500)

Effective field goal percentage:
Tarik Black- 68.9 (2nd in the nation)
Jarnell Stokes- 53.4

Effective FG and FT% (TS%):
Tarik Black- 67.3 (6th in the nation)
Jarnell Stokes- 54.7

O rebound rate-
Tarik Black- 10.8
Jarnell Stokes- 12.1

D rebound rate-
Tarik Black- 12.0
Jarnell Stokes- 21.3

Block %-
Tarik Black- 6.2 (113th in the Nation)
Jarnell Stokes- 5.3

Steal %-
Tarik Black- 1.4
Jarnell Stokes- 2.2

Fouls drawn per 40 min-
Tarik Black- 4.7
Jarnell Stokes- 4.8

FT Rate-
Tarik Black- 68.4 (29th in the Nation)
Jarnell Stokes- 55.1

So, to summarize for you: Tarik is the MUCH better offensive player, when you equalize the on-court time between them both. Jarnell is the better rebounder, Tarik the better defender and Tarik is much better at getting to the line and getting his points.

Wrap your head around those for a bit, if you need help having anything explained, give me a shout.

 

[MemphisCanes]

No offense MC, but comparing Stokes' numbers from an abbreviated freshman season (really his senior year of HS) to Black as a junior is the worst argument in history. A real "apple's and oranges" type statement.

I'm not looking at Black's junior year. Nor am I looking at Stoke's sophomore year. Too small a sample.

Unfortunately, Stoke's abbreviated freshman year is all we have to go on.

 

[MemphisCanes]

That description doesn't fit Young whatsoever, unless you're basing it only off of his two games against UT last season.

ZJC doesn't watch many non UT games, it seems.

 

[cncchris33]

Unfortunately, Stoke's abbreviated freshman year is all we have to go on.

Which makes comparing the two based on statistics, laughable. You know that.

 

[zjcvols]

You can obviously read a stat sheet. Good job. But let's use some big boy stats and move away from your mickey-mouse non-efficiency adjusted ones.

Offensive Rating (kenpom):
Tarik Black- 119.5 (95th in the Nation)
Jarnell Stokes- 98.7 (Not ranked in top 500)

Effective field goal percentage:
Tarik Black- 68.9 (2nd in the nation)
Jarnell Stokes- 53.4

Effective FG and FT% (TS%):
Tarik Black- 67.3 (6th in the nation)
Jarnell Stokes- 54.7

O rebound rate-
Tarik Black- 10.8
Jarnell Stokes- 12.1

D rebound rate-
Tarik Black- 12.0
Jarnell Stokes- 21.3

Block %-
Tarik Black- 6.2 (113th in the Nation)
Jarnell Stokes- 5.3

Steal %-
Tarik Black- 1.4
Jarnell Stokes- 2.2

Fouls drawn per 40 min-
Tarik Black- 4.7
Jarnell Stokes- 4.8

FT Rate-
Tarik Black- 68.4 (29th in the Nation)
Jarnell Stokes- 55.1

So, to summarize for you: Tarik is the MUCH better offensive player, when you equalize the on-court time between them both. Jarnell is the better rebounder, Tarik the better defender and Tarik is much better at getting to the line and getting his points.

Wrap your head around those for a bit, if you need help having anything explained, give me a shout.

First off, I like how use Tarik's sophomore season and Jarnell's freshman season like that is some sort of actual barometer of anything. Let's talk this year.

Congrats.

Every NBA scout would laugh at you for that for saying Tarik has the better offensive game.

First off, offensive rating isn't a good stat. So let's just get rid of that one, even though both have good offensive ratings.

The reason Tarik has a much better Efg% and TS% is because Jarnell is getting 3.5 more shots per game and also two extra free throws a game. Jarnell is the primary focus of the offense, while Tarik isn't. So Jarnell's efficiency numbers aren't going to be as high.

Black is the better shot blocker, while Jarnell is very good at stealing it. Jarnell is average 1.5 steals per game, fantastic for a big man.

Jarnell also kills Tarik in offensive rebounding percentage 14.7% to 8.8%. Tarik does have him beat in defensive rebounding percentage, but only by 3%.

Also, Jarnell is a fantastic passer for a big man, 16.8 to 3.7 in that department against Black.

Jarnell also has a better AST/TO ratio.

Also, Jarnell can stay in the game (2.6 fpg in 29 minutes) while Tarik can't (3.6 in 23 mpg).

Jarnell also has a better free throw rate than Tarik this year too.

Jarnell has a better free throw point percentage than Tarik 23.6 to 20.7

And to top it off, Tarik has a 19.3 shot percentage, while Jarnell has 26.3, showing how much more use Jarnell has than Tarik.

Next time, let's use some current stats.

 

[zjcvols]

I'm not looking at Black's junior year. Nor am I looking at Stoke's sophomore year. Too small a sample.

Unfortunately, Stoke's abbreviated freshman year is all we have to go on.

Five games is 17% of the college basketball regular season.

When do they start to count?

 

[zjcvols]

ZJC doesn't watch many non UT games, it seems.

I do.

If you want to think Tarik Black is some sort of great player, go ahead and think that.

He isn't. It's actually quite laughable.

 

[MemphisCanes]

First off, I like how use Tarik's sophomore season and Jarnell's freshman season like that is some sort of actual barometer of anything. Let's talk this year.

Congrats.

Every NBA scout would laugh at you for that for saying Tarik has the better offensive game.

First off, offensive rating isn't a good stat. So let's just get rid of that one, even though both have good offensive ratings.

The reason Tarik has a much better Efg% and TS% is because Jarnell is getting 3.5 more shots per game and also two extra free throws a game. Jarnell is the primary focus of the offense, while Tarik isn't. So Jarnell's efficiency numbers aren't going to be as high.

Black is the better shot blocker, while Jarnell is very good at stealing it. Jarnell is average 1.5 steals per game, fantastic for a big man.

Jarnell also kills Tarik in offensive rebounding percentage 14.7% to 8.8%. Tarik does have him beat in defensive rebounding percentage, but only by 3%.

Also, Jarnell is a fantastic passer for a big man, 16.8 to 3.7 in that department against Black.

Jarnell also has a better AST/TO ratio.

Also, Jarnell can stay in the game (2.6 fpg in 29 minutes) while Tarik can't (3.6 in 23 mpg).

Jarnell also has a better free throw rate than Tarik this year too.

Jarnell has a better free throw point percentage than Tarik 23.6 to 20.7

And to top it off, Tarik has a 19.3 shot percentage, while Jarnell has 26.3, showing how much more use Jarnell has than Tarik.

Next time, let's use some current stats.

So basically, Tarik is a much better offensive player, when stats are equalized on a per possession basis, than Stokes?

Tarik is the better defensive player?

Jarnell the better rebounder?

Tarik better at getting to and converting from the line?

Thanks for summarizing my summation.

If you don't like the current stats (most likely because they're contrary to your position), lets revisit this towards the end of the season. Or we can watch how they fare against each other.

 

[MemphisCanes]

Five games is 17% of the college basketball regular season.

When do they start to count?

Even if we use the stats from this season, Tarik looks to have the edge.

Your point is flawed unless you have a Delorian that we can use to get to the end of the season.

 

[MemphisCanes]

Which makes comparing the two based on statistics, laughable. You know that.

So the two simply can't be compared, statistically, because they're in different classes?

That's convenient.

 

[zjcvols]

So basically, Tarik is a much better offensive player, when stats are equalized on a per possession basis, than Stokes?

Tarik is the better defensive player?

Jarnell the better rebounder?

Tarik better at getting to and converting from the line?

Thanks for summarizing my summation.

If you don't like the current stats (most likely because they're contrary to your position), lets revisit this towards the end of the season. Or we can watch how they fare against each other.

That wasn't your summation. You acutally tried to say Tarik Black as a MUCH better offensive player than Jarnell Stokes. Which is a joke.

 

[zjcvols]

Even if we use the stats from this season, Tarik looks to have the edge.

Your point is flawed unless you have a Delorian that we can use to get to the end of the season.

In what?

All the stats point to Jarnell as the better player, especially offensively, especially when you factor in Stokes is the #1 option on his team.