Air fresheners are illegal in Minnesota

[lukeneyland]

Again you really need to do a ride along with your local PD because you have no clue about reality in calls for service or what actually happens here...in Knoxville or Knox Co there are times there aren't "10 cop cars" manning the entire city/county

It’s a whole different world. Until I had the misfortune of experiencing it I probably wouldn’t have understood.

 

[lukeneyland]

they often escalate because of the weapons, not in spite of them

I think about 9/10 times it’s just fear. It’s the you or me mentality

 

[Tastylicks]

4 million citizen encounters with LEO a year in this country....less than 1,000 shootings each year, out of those maybe 200-400 serious shootings, out of those .0001% are unjustified or illegal

all you are doing is proving they dont need need weapons. 4 million encounters and good or bad, they only used them 1,000 times.

and yet for the 3,999,000 times they were in a dangerous spot with a weapon that could escalate into something bad

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

4 million citizen encounters with LEO a year in this country....less than 1,000 shootings each year, out of those maybe 200-400 serious shootings, out of those .0001% are unjustified or illegal

That is the issue... far too many encounters.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

I can only speak for myself and who I've worked with. I know you hate the police, so whatever I say is going to be irrelevant to you. I just think it opens up a Pandora's Box of further problems. Also saying cops "usually escalate" and have "itchy trigger fingers" has no basis in any facts, those are opinions. Better training, higher standards, raising pay, designated units, etc, I'm all for it. Disarming the police in a country full of guns, hard no.

For the record, I'm not talking about disarming all cops, (although I'm open to that discussion if someone wants to make that case). I only mentioned rookie cops or cops that have been on the force for a limited amount of time.

 

[Rickyvol77]

they often escalate because of the weapons, not in spite of them

You are clueless on this topic...you need to go do a ride along with your local PD

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

I mean yeah, she should go to prison IMO

She won't do much time. She'll probably get far less than Amber Guyger.

 

[hog88]

This is potentially your dumbest comment on this board. I don't even need to explain why.

I think she’s on to something. I’m fine with taking the guns away from the average street cop(if it’s a constitutional carry or cc state they can of course carry their own) but limit their duties to things that shouldn’t require a weapon.

 

[Rickyvol77]

That is the issue... far too many encounters.

out of a country of nearly 400 million people?

Maybe but the public are the ones calling the police, and community caretaking exists in there as well...I think given the population and excess of weapons, drugs, gangs, homeless, violently mentally ill, etc, that a few hundred "deadly" police encounters that happen, and 95-98% of those being justified and legal and moral encounters is not a bad stat

 

[Rickyvol77]

For the record, I'm not talking about disarming all cops, (although I'm open to that discussion if someone wants to make that case). I only mentioned rookie cops or cops that have been on the force for a limited amount of time.

why? some "rookie" cops are better and more level headed and proficient than other veteran officers.

It's a dumb idea with no real foresight or thought process other than your personal feelings of your misperceptions of what really goes on

 

[Rickyvol77]

I think she’s on to something. I’m fine with taking the guns away from the average street cop(if it’s a constitutional carry or cc state they can of course carry their own) but limit their duties to things that shouldn’t require a weapon.

There are no "routine" calls that may not need a weapon though

 

[lukeneyland]

all you are doing is proving they dont need need weapons. 4 million encounters and good or bad, they only used them 1,000 times.

and yet for the 3,999,000 times they were in a dangerous spot with a weapon that could escalate into something bad

They’d be slaughtered. They’d all be dead in a matter of hours if they did something like that in Fort Worth or Dallas.

 

[Rickyvol77]

all you are doing is proving they dont need need weapons. 4 million encounters and good or bad, they only used them 1,000 times.

and yet for the 3,999,000 times they were in a dangerous spot with a weapon that could escalate into something bad

I said that they were only USED in an actual shooting those hundred times...there are several instances where guns are utilized to hold felons at bay without any shooting occurring.. There are also a countless number of times the fact an officer HAD any weapon de-escalated the situation without any violence

 

[lukeneyland]

There are no "routine" calls that may not need a weapon though

They really have no idea what they are getting into when they answer the call

 

[Ttucke11]

Well first off, you are buying into the narrative that these domestic calls are usually cases of a poor innocent female being victimized by a toxically-masculine man and that this one event was the only event to ever happen in their relationship. The truth is that in many of these domestic incidents, it isn't the first altercation or first time cops were called to that particular scene and the women are not the innocent Pearl Purehearts that is painted in the narrative. But again, we are getting into problems related to the breakdown of our social fabric. Cops can't be expected to solve these issues that liberal policies helped to create.

Ras, I like you and agree with a lot of what you say. However, I'm not buying into any narrative. I've been there and done it. I was just giving an example, of which I have personally witnessed. The last two sentences are spot on.

 

[Tastylicks]

They’d be slaughtered. They’d all be dead in a matter of hours if they did something like that in Fort Worth or Dallas.

that's a baseless exaggeration

 

[Tastylicks]

I said that they were only USED in an actual shooting those hundred times...there are several instances where guns are utilized to hold felons at bay without any shooting occurring.. There are also a countless number of times the fact an officer HAD any weapon de-escalated the situation without any violence

Right. things that could be done with a taser

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

out of a country of nearly 400 million people?

Maybe but the public are the ones calling the police, and community caretaking exists in there as well...I think given the population and excess of weapons, drugs, gangs, homeless, violently mentally ill, etc, that a few hundred "deadly" police encounters that happen, and 95-98% of those being justified and legal and moral encounters is not a bad stat

The social issues need to be addressed at the same time. I don't hear enough cops out here making the case that we have far too many ineffective laws and far too many social issues that make their jobs worse. They have the protection of the union and still don't use that protection for good use. If these lawmakers come out with bogus laws that violate the people's rights, you cops don't say a word. But let some rogue cop shoot a civilian and all cops are on deck to defend the cops. its like you all create the "us" vs "them" environment. You all don't seem to ever stand with the people and against the lawmakers.

 

[C-south]

that's a baseless exaggeration

To an ignorant comment. You downplay the cops need for weapons based on a low percentage and want to disarm the law abiding citizens based on a low percentage. You’re pandering to the criminals in both cases but that’s expected.

 

[Ttucke11]

Right. things that could be done with a taser

A taser is worthless if someone has jacket on. They also have two shots, max, typically one. Miss and you're in a fist fight, because you probably don't have the time to switch to pepper spray now.

 

[allvol123]

The social issues need to be addressed at the same time. I don't hear enough cops out here making the case that we have far too many ineffective laws and far too many social issues that make their jobs worse. They have the protection of the union and still don't use that protection for good use. If these lawmakers come out with bogus laws that violate the people's rights, you cops don't say a word. But let some rogue cop shoot a civilian and all cops are on deck to defend the cops. its like you all create the "us" vs "them" environment. You all don't seem to ever stand with the people and against the lawmakers.

Knox county LE basically said the mask mandate was assinine and they weren't going to fool with it.

 

[NorthDallas40]

I know I'm behind here. I wouldn't call fleeing in a car "nonlethal" per se. Especially since it'll be at panicked high speed. But I don't think that's in play in this situation because the officer appears to have thought she had the taser and didn't. She's culpable for the negligence on that topic and I think that's where it ends. Is it murder? No. Was she trained well enough? Nope. This mistake should never happen in the field because the memory should be imbeded in training on the belt set up.

I mostly agree however the basic act of fleeing in a car isn’t lethal I’d submit. But just like the officer, the driver is responsible for any actions taken while fleeing. That is my main objection to trying and equate the victims acts as warranting any level of lethal response. The bolded is pretty much where I have been coming from. She owns this, lock stock and barrel.

 

[Rasputin_Vol]

Knox county LE basically said the mask mandate was assinine and they weren't going to fool with it.

OK, rare example. Now the rest of the time, when have they stood with the people?

 

[C-south]

OK, rare example. Now the rest of the time, when have they stood with the people?

Which laws in particular are you talking about that should be done away with or not enforced?

 

[lukeneyland]

that's a baseless exaggeration

Work there for a few months and it’ll not seem that way