And so it begins...

[therealUT]

Politico just published a bunch of vague allegations made by un-named sources. Modern journalism at it's finest
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Is any part of the story that the Politico published untrue? Not according to Cain.

 

[gsvol]

maybe these two women saw Anita Hill cash in on a false accusation against a prominent, or at least up and coming, conservative black man and decided that they want in on some of that action

The message is clear.

 

[MUR73]

Funny, because Media Matters says the exact opposite. It is also somewhat counterintuitive to think that Fred Ryan would run such an operation.

This is not a hit from the left; it is a hit from the Republican establishment.

You didn't just cite Media Matters and also expect to be taken seriously , did you?

The National Enquirer has more integrity than George Soros' propaganda rag.

 

[sjt18]

This is true; however, it is not the left who has conjured up some potential indiscretion/skeleton in Cain's closet.

No. They reported a non-story without credible back up. They found out two women had been paid and without the particulars ran out and acted as if Cain was guilty.

The press ignored several stories about Obama on the basis that they were irrelevant and lacked verifiable foundations. These four writers ran with just such a story in an attempt to destroy someone they consider a terrible threat.

Cain is a black man who successfully escaped the plantation. He is loved by people that the left has assured us are abject racists. He is a REAL success story that makes Obama look pathetic when compared side by side. He succeeded by hard work and intelligence... something the left still assures blacks that they can't do in this terribly unjust nation.

Cain is the disproof of almost everything the left believes... of course he has to be destroyed.

 

[sjt18]

Funny, because Media Matters says the exact opposite. It is also somewhat counterintuitive to think that Fred Ryan would run such an operation.

This is not a hit from the left; it is a hit from the Republican establishment.

You still think there's a difference? The establishment GOP and left are NOT enemies. Both are progressive. Both believe in big gov't. They just differ on exactly how the power of big gov't should be used.

 

[sjt18]

Let's be honest, if these facts were brought up about BHO or any other Dim candidate, the right would be ALL OVER IT. This is an irrefutable fact.

Respectfully, please don't let your politics get in the way of reality. It's an obstacle that he'll have to overcome.

The problem?.... The right has one network that might run the story. The MSM would ignore it except to condemn the right and Fox for reporting it. It would die within days... if not hours.

FWIW, I doubt this story would have even made Fox News. There simply isn't enough "proof" there to report.

 

[sjt18]

That this appears to have caught Cain on his heels is surprising.

Cain comes from a world where people operate by at least a measure of ethics. Anyone who found it out would take it at face value and not make assumptions other than it being a settled matter to the satisfaction of all parties. Unless there was a larger pattern of those kinds of settlements... the assumption would be that it was a misunderstanding or women who figured out how to game the company based on some careless but harmless words/actions.

In the world where he operates now, a conservative is guilty of this kind of thing according to the left with or without proof... or maybe even an accusation. In the world where he now operates, Bill Clinton can be credibly accused of groping women and even attempted rape but be excused by those professing to be the champions of women and "the little people".

I know he has been an observer... but now he's in it.

If I were in his shoes... I'd hire Dick Morris as fast as I could.

 

[sjt18]

Is any part of the story that the Politico published untrue? Not according to Cain.

Two women got paid after making undisclosed accusations against the head of an organization with a public image to protect. One of the women had apparently been fired by Cain... no chance of being vindictive there, right?

That's the story. Rather than fighting it out in court, that association chose to settle. It is highly likely considering only "five figure" settlements that Cain would have won. Five figures wouldn't touch the legal fees to go to court. If they thought they would lose... the settlements would have been 7 figures.

They most likely settled to avoid PR problems.

Again, this happens ALL THE TIME. LG should know it... some lawyers have made a specialty out of turning weak accusations into quick settlements.

 

[lawgator1]

As I understand it, sjt, it wasn't the women who came forward, at least not initially. Rather, it was someone familiar with the processing of the claims and the settlements. From the sounds of it, the board of the association was very disturbed by the situation and were concerned about Cain and what he was doing. So it was probably one of them.

But not the women.

Plus, you make it seem like the reporters went out looking for them. From all accounts, it was the opposite. Someone tipped them off and they checked into it.

I understand that you are unhappy that the current Tea Party darling has turned out to have some blemishes, and more significantly that he and his campaign have completely screwed up the handling of it. I realize that this is embarrassing for those of you who have been touting him so much.

But it is not your personal failing. It is his, at least in terms of how he has repeatedly lied over the last 48 hours, and been caught doing so, and had to retreat, how he has constantly rephrased and changed his story about what he remembers and what he doesn't.

Turns out, for all his outsider crap, Herman Cain was just another politician, the whole time.

 

[utvolpj]

did you vote for Clinton LG?

 

[sjt18]

As I understand it, sjt, it wasn't the women who came forward, at least not initially. Rather, it was someone familiar with the processing of the claims and the settlements. From the sounds of it, the board of the association was very disturbed by the situation and were concerned about Cain and what he was doing. So it was probably one of them.

But not the women.

Plus, you make it seem like the reporters went out looking for them. From all accounts, it was the opposite. Someone tipped them off and they checked into it.

It is a story that would not have been reported on a Dem. Plain and simple. Paula Jones and many others were out there... and ignored... the whole time Clinton was running. Obama has more scandalous ties than possibly anyone who ever ran for POTUS... and was NEVER vetted.

That's my point. This is basically a story with no flesh. If everything we "know" is true.... there's nothing there.

I understand that you are unhappy that the current Tea Party darling has turned out to have some blemishes, and more significantly that he and his campaign have completely screwed up the handling of it. I realize that this is embarrassing for those of you who have been touting him so much.

No. It is "upsetting" that the politics of personal destruction have been unleashed on a guy who deserves it far less than Dems who have gotten passes.

But it is not your personal failing. It is his, at least in terms of how he has repeatedly lied over the last 48 hours, and been caught doing so, and had to retreat, how he has constantly rephrased and changed his story about what he remembers and what he doesn't.

Turns out, for all his outsider crap, Herman Cain was just another politician, the whole time.

Wait... here's a guy taken off guard... trying to communicate his side in a fragmented and yes embarrassing way... and he's a liar... apparently unfit to lead, right?

Yet you guys canonize a guy who did much worse to women and then committed perjury on top of it all?

I thought "He's good at his job" was all that was important to you guys when it came to executives accused of sexual harrassment or misdeeds? By all accounts, Cain was excellent at his job.


Cain may have made mistakes. He probably did make enough to cause this settlement to be necessary... but having gone through SH training numerous times... it really doesn't take much. But he remains an outsider. As someone else pointed out, the most likely "outers" on this story are estblishment GOP types. Imagine that... Progressives doing things to advance their political cause that aren't exactly fair or honest.

 

[gsvol]

Allegedly, two women alleged that Herman Cain sexually harassed them while he was the CEO of the National Restaurant Association. The NRA allegedly settled with the women out of court to prevent the alleged lawsuit from going to trial. A series of anonymous sources, including one of the alleged victims, expressed their outrage to Politico about Cain's behavior. Politico ran the story and Cain's camp has thus far handled the scandal ineffectively.

That's the current situation, right?
Posted via VolNation Mobile

In one of the cases Cain, only being affable as is his normal manner, said; "you are about as tall as my wife", and held his hand up to about chin level.

The woman didn't object or pretend to be offended at the time but did get a lawyer and sue for a huge sum charging harrassment.

The case never went to court, she didn't have a case, the only settlement she ever received was the normal termination package any employee would have gotten.

I don't know any of the details about the second case I but suspect it was just another opportunist trying to get something for nothing.

Mark Levin: Politico Is A "Phony Website ... Not News, It's Leftism" | RealClearPolitics

Mark Levin slams Politico for what he says is a smear against Herman Cain. Levin also goes on to lambaste Kenneth P. Vogel, a writer that contributed to Politico's story against Cain.

"This guy is a hit man dressed up as a reporter," Levin said about Vogel. "In fact, this entire political site, Politico, is a phony website that might as well be run by MoveOn.org or the Daily Kos. It's not news, it's leftism."

Later in his program, not included in this clip, Levin says Politico is the "Barack Obama Campaign Website."

Of course wapo aka pravda on the potomac is making a big deal out of it.

 

[sjt18]

BTW, if unsubstantiated charges of sexual harrassment are all the left or GOP establishment can dig up on the guy... He's going to continue to be a force in the race. Those who will attempt to make the most noise have already lost their credibility due to Clinton and their support of him.

 

[lawgator1]

It is a story that would not have been reported on a Dem. Plain and simple. Paula Jones and many others were out there... and ignored... the whole time Clinton was running. Obama has more scandalous ties than possibly anyone who ever ran for POTUS... and was NEVER vetted.


That's stupid, see e.g. Weiner. And no one made a claim against him that he was abusing his position of authority and then paid money to people to go away.


That's my point. This is basically a story with no flesh. If everything we "know" is true.... there's nothing there.


Stupid again. Cain admits the accusations were made and the settlement made. Had he plausibly denied it and admitted all of that, he might have been able to survive. Its the constant backtracking and lying about it now that is getting him in trouble.


No. It is "upsetting" that the politics of personal destruction have been unleashed on a guy who deserves it far less than Dems who have gotten passes.

Partisan, and not worth commenting on.



Wait... here's a guy taken off guard... trying to communicate his side in a fragmented and yes embarrassing way... and he's a liar... apparently unfit to lead, right?

Correct.


Yet you guys canonize a guy who did much worse to women and then committed perjury on top of it all?

Partisan, not worthy of comment.


I thought "He's good at his job" was all that was important to you guys when it came to executives accused of sexual harrassment or misdeeds? By all accounts, Cain was excellent at his job.

Deny the underlying offense, and he's fine. But the 3-4 stories and variations he has told in less than two days suggests someone who we could never hope would be able to handle the pressure of the job he seeks.



Cain may have made mistakes. He probably did make enough to cause this settlement to be necessary... but having gone through SH training numerous times... it really doesn't take much. But he remains an outsider. As someone else pointed out, the most likely "outers" on this story are estblishment GOP types. Imagine that... Progressives doing things to advance their political cause that aren't exactly fair or honest.

They are fair in that Cain is running for president. That these types of claims were made and settlements paid matters. And its honest because the reporting is correct and accurate.

Are you going back to Bachmann now or Perry?

 

[gsvol]

It is a story that would not have been reported on a Dem. Plain and simple. Paula Jones and many others were out there... and ignored... the whole time Clinton was running. Obama has more scandalous ties than possibly anyone who ever ran for POTUS... and was NEVER vetted.

And they reviewed 2,500 of Palin's emails and got nothing except the fact that she writes two grade levels above the average NYSlimes columnist.

WikiLeaks says it will stop publishing state secrets because it is running out of money. No surprise. That strategy didn't help the New York Times, either.

GOP candidate Rick Perry raised the issue of the veracity of President Obama's birth certificate Sunday. He should tread carefully here. Rick Perry is already on the record in favor of benefits for illegal immigrants, but he has to draw the line at a second term for them.

The State Department just bought thousands of books written by Barack Obama for overseas distribution. He gets a fifteen percent royalty on each book sold to his own government. Bill Clinton cannot believe there is actually something he didn't think of first.

Yesterday on CNN, Joe Biden said he hasn’t made up his mind about whether he’ll run for president in 2016. Which raises the question: “Who was raising that question?”

President Obama and Democrats on Capitol Hill are increasingly referring to the Congress as "Republican" even though their party controls the Senate. Just practicing for 2012, I guess.

A columnist for the New York Daily News has declared that Herman Cain's use of the word "cornbread" is "troubling". Yes, why can't he talk about "arugula" like normal presidential candidates?

 

[therealUT]

You still think there's a difference? The establishment GOP and left are NOT enemies. Both are progressive. Both believe in big gov't. They just differ on exactly how the power of big gov't should be used.

In that case, then why doesn't Cain run as an independent? Why give the nod to the establishment that is the GOP? Is he sacrificing his principles in order to achieve higher office?

(Same can be said w/ regard to Ron Paul).

 

[therealUT]

Cain comes from a world where people operate by at least a measure of ethics. Anyone who found it out would take it at face value and not make assumptions other than it being a settled matter to the satisfaction of all parties. Unless there was a larger pattern of those kinds of settlements... the assumption would be that it was a misunderstanding or women who figured out how to game the company based on some careless but harmless words/actions.

In the world where he operates now, a conservative is guilty of this kind of thing according to the left with or without proof... or maybe even an accusation. In the world where he now operates, Bill Clinton can be credibly accused of groping women and even attempted rape but be excused by those professing to be the champions of women and "the little people".

I know he has been an observer... but now he's in it.

If I were in his shoes... I'd hire Dick Morris as fast as I could.

Paying someone hush money is now considered to be part and parcel of an ethical world?

 

[HSVol]

In that case, then why doesn't Cain run as an independent? Why give the nod to the establishment that is the GOP? Is he sacrificing his principles in order to achieve higher office?

(Same can be said w/ regard to Ron Paul).

This is an excellent post, and liked.

 

[Cartervol]

Happens everytime. Get a guy up there that makes sense. Let the personal attacks begin. Herman Cain makes them all look like the crooks they are. They don't like it much , so lets dig up some dirt on him.

 

[therealUT]

Happens everytime. Get a guy up there that makes sense. Let the personal attacks begin. Herman Cain makes them all look like the crooks they are. They don't like it much , so lets dig up some dirt on him.

So, if it happens that Cain actually harassed these women, does that not make him a crook?

Crook: n. One whose conduct is crooked; a dishonest person, swindler, sharper.

Oxford English Dictionary

After looking at the definition, I would say that even his inconsistent responses to the allegations demonstrates a certain amount of dishonesty.

 

[Gramps]

All these guys do the same thing, Dems and GOP.

They all think they are smart enough or have enough power to lie their way out of every situation.

They all try to cover up. Cain is now trying to cover up his cover up.

Cain is doing no different than the other politicians.

 

[Cartervol]

So, if it happens that Cain actually harassed these women, does that not make him a crook?



After looking at the definition, I would say that even his inconsistent responses to the allegations demonstrates a certain amount of dishonesty.

Never stopped Clinton.

 

[therealUT]

Never stopped Clinton.

If by "never stopped" you mean that his antics were a factor in the GOP Congress grab, led to his impeachment in the House, and kept Clinton from pushing any of the legislation he wanted to push, then you are correct.

Basically, elect Cain with these clouds and you are asking for a lame-duck GOP President with no mandate.

 

[lawgator1]

Let's not forget the original thesis of the thread, which is that this was all some sort of concocted lie, conjured up by the far left.

sjt could not have been more wrong.

First, everything in the Politico story has been confirmed now to be 100 % true. Cain does not dispute a single thing in the story.

Second, the consensus, even amongst the conservative commentators, is that it was likely a GOP rival behind its disclosure.



People are fallible. Whatever Cain did at the time, this whole thing has been bungled. And what is most remarkable about that is that Cain has at least 10 days' warning that it was coming. It was his arrogance, and the arrogance of his campaign director, that prevented him from being prepared to deal with this.

 

[therealUT]

Let's not forget the original thesis of the thread, which is that this was all some sort of concocted lie, conjured up by the far left.

sjt could not have been more wrong.

First, everything in the Politico story has been confirmed now to be 100 % true. Cain does not dispute a single thing in the story.

Second, the consensus, even amongst the conservative commentators, is that it was likely a GOP rival behind its disclosure.



People are fallible. Whatever Cain did at the time, this whole thing has been bungled. And what is most remarkable about that is that Cain has at least 10 days' warning that it was coming. It was his arrogance, and the arrogance of his campaign director, that prevented him from being prepared to deal with this.

LG, you are forgetting that the GOP is left, according to SJT and, regardless of the facts, the story should not have aired unless it made sweeping conjecture, instead of just sticking to the facts.