And you guys really put blind faith in Fauci?

#203
#203
SpaceCoastVol said:
Yep. And those like Looter and Septic think they will be included in the Socialistic wet dream.

Pathetic really
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LOL, i'm a socialist now? This is new.

Is this just you lashing out with the first pejorative buzzword that popped into your little acorn?
 
#204
#204
Septic said:
Despite the ongoing debate, plenty of studies have imparted new functions to viruses, with clear benefit to science and medicine. Since the time when poliovirus was first grown in cultured cells, scientists have adapted viruses to live in culture. This enables production of a large supply of viral material for further study or for vaccine development. This process sometimes diminishes the pathogens’ ability to make humans ill. After all, the lab dish contains no immune system, so viruses can streamline their life cycles by dumping costly activities that would normally protect them from host attack, says Stanley Perlman, a physician and virologist at the University of Iowa in Iowa City.

Scientists have also directly modified viruses to create vaccines; the COVID-19 shots from both Oxford–AstraZeneca and Johnson & Johnson are based on adenoviruses harmless to humans that were modified to produce the SARS-CoV-2 spike protein. Researchers have also altered viruses to deliver gene therapies or cancer treatments. “All that great stuff that is going to benefit humanity is a gain of function,” says Vincent Racaniello, a virologist at Columbia University in New York City.

In addition, scientists routinely give viruses the ability to infect new hosts. Animal research — although fraught with its own set of ethical quandaries — allows scientists to study how pathogens work and to test potential treatments, a necessary precursor to trials in people. That’s what Perlman and his collaborators had in mind when they set out to study the coronavirus responsible for Middle East Respiratory Syndrome (MERS-CoV), which emerged as a human pathogen in 2012. They wanted to use mice, but mice can’t catch MERS.

The rodents lack the right version of the protein DPP4, which MERS-CoV uses to gain entry to cells. So, the team altered the mice, giving them a human-like version of the gene for DPP4. The virus could now infect the humanized mice, but there was another problem: even when infected, the mice didn’t get very ill. “Having a model of mild disease isn’t particularly helpful to understand why people get so sick,” says collaborator Paul McCray, a paediatric pulmonologist also at the University of Iowa.

So, the group used a classic technique called ‘passaging’ to enhance virulence. The researchers infected a couple of mice, gave the virus two days to take hold, and then transferred some of the infected lung tissue into another pair of mice. They did this repeatedly — 30 times9. By the end of two months, the virus had evolved to replicate better in mouse cells. In so doing, it made the mice more ill; a high dose was deadly, says McCray. That’s GOF of a sort because the virus became better at causing disease. But adapting a pathogen to one animal in this way often limits its ability to infect others, says Andrew Pekosz, a virologist at the Bloomberg School of Public Health.

The experiments did make the virus amenable to research, however, and the team shared both it and the engineered mice with others. It led to plenty of new findings. For example, Perlman’s team discovered that an immune-system protein called interferon fights the virus, at least in a very specific time window10. This parallels responses in people with SARS-CoV-2, suggesting that if interferon is provided as a treatment, it should be early in the course of the disease11.

Researchers also used the mouse-adapted MERS-CoV to test new vaccines and treatments. The Iowa team’s collaborators tested a vaccine that is a hybrid of parainfluenza virus with the MERS-CoV version of the spike. The vaccine wasn’t very effective when injected, but it did protect DPP4-expressing mice from MERS-CoV quite well when provided through the nose12. Although MERS outbreaks haven’t led to sustained transmission, this information has proved valuable in the COVID‑19 pandemic: a vaccine with the same design, but against the SARS-CoV-2 spike, works in mice and ferrets13 and is now undergoing early clinical trials. - Source: The shifting sands of ‘gain-of-function’ research
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All that makes sense when done in very controlled conditions with adult supervision and with responsible guidance and limitations. That wasn't what happened in Wuhan as far as investigators have been able to tell ... and as far as the results (a dangerous pandemic) demonstrate. It's hard to believe all - perhaps even much - of what's printed, but apparently not all of the Wuhan batshit crazy stuff was even conducted in the most secure levels of their new French built P4 facility. Of course, the French are saying no way in hell it came from the lab - nobody would admit to giving matches to the kids who burned down half the world.

Maybe we can't actually control what the Chinese do behind closed borders, but we certainly can expect the rest of the world to be more responsible in giving them the tools of destruction. Too bad most people can't recognize that China isn't free, that the CCP runs the place, and that the CCP doesn't care much about the safety of rest of the world. The other thing you really need to consider is that beyond the good that may come of GOF testing and development is the fact that it also has a fantastic potential in biological warfare. The Chinese have always been careless when it comes to human life - you could kill a billion of them, and they'd still outnumber the US, so how much concern do you think they have about the lesser of their citizens?

There are no coincidences. This particular virus did exist in bats but not that near Wuhan. The GOF testing was done in Wuhan. The virus infected people first in Wuhan. The virus that first affected people in Wuhan was set to infect humans, and it was wildly successful - that means it was "humanized" from the start most likely by GOF testing. The Chinese were fully aware and made up multiple different excuses to account for the infection, and the media gave them a bye. The Chinese aren't being open about investigations, and neither are the outsiders who aided and abetted the Chinese research in Wuhan. Let's just say that at best the release was accidental and not done on purpose ... for the time being anyway.
 
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#205
#205
Septic said:
LOL, i'm a socialist now? This is new.

Is this just you lashing out with the first pejorative buzzword that popped into your little acorn?
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Just remember, "socialist" is the insult of the mentally challenged. They think it's some shibboleth that magically grants them a win.

Calling someone a socialist who hasn't clearly self-identified as a socialist is waving the intellectual white flag of surrender.
 
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#208
#208
AshG said:
Just remember, "socialist" is the insult of the mentally challenged. They think it's some shibboleth that magically grants them a win.

Calling someone a socialist who hasn't clearly self-identified as a socialist is waving the intellectual white flag of surrender.
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I would add these to the white flag of surrender list......
- The use of the word feelz.
- The use of the phrase living rent free.
- The use of the clown emoji.
 
#209
#209
1vol8 said:
Talk to Webster. I didn’t define anything
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While I tend to agree with most of your thought on this, you have to remember "patriot" is defined by the eye of the beholder. To some the Rosenbergs (assuming they actually did it) were patriots for insuring that no country had a nuclear monopoly. You and I and many more might consider that people who have been satisfied with American exceptionalism and the status quo are patriots; others see themselves as patriots for tearing down all the country has stood for. This is an argument you can't win because goals aren't equally shared.
 
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#210
#210
luthervol said:
I would add these to the white flag of surrender list......
- The use of the word feelz.
- The use of the phrase living rent free.
- The use of the clown emoji.
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I always enjoy being called a Marxist, but not as much as when they call me a Pinko Commie Bastard - then I know it's game, set, match.
 
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#211
#211
AshG said:
Just remember, "socialist" is the insult of the mentally challenged. They think it's some shibboleth that magically grants them a win.

Calling someone a socialist who hasn't clearly self-identified as a socialist is waving the intellectual white flag of surrender.
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“Shibboleth”

1642799428615.gif
 
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#214
#214
AshG said:
Ok, let me rephrase:

Who gave you the right to apply the label of who is and isn't a patriot?
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Gotta pay attention to the entire conversation. Just like you just did, they are attacking me based on tid bits of past responses and forgetting the original nucleus of my posts. So I’ll some it up.

A patriot, as defined by Webster, is someone willing to fight for his/her country. I am and have expressed that many times. But it goes farther than that here in the USA in my opinion. You gotta be willing to fight for freedom just the same because freedom is a right we all have here. Which means, the willingness to stand against tyranny and enemies foreign and domestic that threaten that freedom. Those that do, no matter where they were born, is NOT a patriot. Therefore, supporters of BLM, Antifa and Fauci are not patriots because they have become domestic terrorists. Supporters of Biden and Harris are not patriotic because that would mean the support of tyranny.

Once again, this is my opinion and no matter how many disagree, I’ll stand by it.
 
#216
#216
1vol8 said:
Gotta pay attention to the entire conversation. Just like you just did, they are attacking me based on tid bits of past responses and forgetting the original nucleus of my posts. So I’ll some it up.

A patriot, as defined by Webster, is someone willing to fight for his/her country. I am and have expressed that many times. But it goes farther than that here in the USA in my opinion. You gotta be willing to fight for freedom just the same because freedom is a right we all have here. Which means, the willingness to stand against tyranny and enemies foreign and domestic that threaten that freedom. Those that do, no matter where they were born, is NOT a patriot. Therefore, supporters of BLM, Antifa and Fauci are not patriots because they have become domestic terrorists. Supporters of Biden and Harris are not patriotic because that would mean the support of tyranny.

Once again, this is my opinion and no matter how many disagree, I’ll stand by it.
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Would you know how to exist without an enemy?
 
#217
#217
AM64 said:
While I tend to agree with most of your thought on this, you have to remember "patriot" is defined by the eye of the beholder. To some the Rosenbergs (assuming they actually did it) were patriots for insuring that no country had a nuclear monopoly. You and I and many more might consider that people who have been satisfied with American exceptionalism and the status quo are patriots; others see themselves as patriots for tearing down all the country has stood for. This is an argument you can't win because goals aren't equally shared.
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I can respect that stance but it won’t change my opinion. Anyone not willing to fight for their country, freedom or stand against tyranny in my opinion should not have the honor of anything red, white and blue.
 
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#218
#218
TN Ribs said:
I always enjoy being called a Marxist, but not as much as when they call me a Pinko Commie Bastard - then I know it's game, set, match.
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We can all do better. All of us.

I don't mind a bit of crass banter, but there are people here - left, middle, and right - who know nothing of kindness and give their perceived enemies no quarter. The only way to respond to those individuals is to show them a better way by example.
 
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#219
#219
AshG said:
Would you know how to exist without an enemy?
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Enemies are all around us wether you decide to see them or not. Just because someone isn’t a direct contact enemy of your person doesn’t mean they aren’t there to you. Biden is a great example. He’s no “personal” enemy of any of us but he’s the biggest enemy to us all as a whole.

As for personal enemies? I don’t have any.
 
#220
#220
1vol8 said:
Enemies are all around us wether you decide to see them or not. Just because someone isn’t a direct contact enemy of your person doesn’t mean they aren’t there to you. Biden is a great example. He’s no “personal” enemy of any of us but he’s the biggest enemy to us all as a whole.

As for personal enemies? I don’t have any.
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You sound a lot like my uncle, the one my parents said to be kind to because he had shell shock.
 
#221
#221
1vol8 said:
I can respect that stance but it won’t change my opinion. Anyone not willing to fight for their country, freedom or stand against tyranny in my opinion should not have the honor of anything red, white and blue.
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Again I tend to side with you, but there are plenty in this country who believe they are patriots for seeing the status quo as evil that should be eradicated, and there are all differing shades and opinions in between. One man's patriot is another man's traitor, and it's always been that way. We are probably more fragmented now as a country than we've ever been because we have no real common, definable enemy - so we fight each other.
 
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#224
#224
AM64 said:
Again I tend to side with you, but there are plenty in this country who believe they are patriots for seeing the status quo as evil that should be eradicated, and there are all differing shades and opinions in between. One man's patriot is another man's traitor, and it's always been that way. We are probably more fragmented now as a country than we've ever been because we have no real common, definable enemy - so we fight each other.
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I just can’t imagine anyone who can combine the words “BLM” and “patriot” in the same sentence. Let alone Biden or Fauci after what they’ve done
 
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