Anyone see the NOVA special last night:Evolution vs. Intelligent Design

#177
#177
T-TownVol said:
If we are wrong...no harm no foul...if you are wrong....
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I am quite confident that there is no consequence for either belief. Otherwise, I would not feel the way I do. I prefer to make the best out of this life rather than bank on the possibility that life extends past the known dimension.

The thing about it is, you are no more perfect than I and vice-versa. We both make mistakes. But your belief punishes me for not having faith in something that there is no proof of and that I have been given no reason to believe. My belief leaves you to believe whatever you may.
 
#179
#179
Sabanocchio said:
Your arrogance on this subject surprises no one.
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Arrogance? You of all people want to call someone arrogant? :eek:lol::eek:lol::eek:lol:

You have nothing but the personal attack. You would be better served going back in your role of the resident Bammer apologist on SEC Talk.
 
#180
#180
T-TownVol said:
If we are wrong...no harm no foul...if you are wrong....
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if god is really this much of a jackass that i'll go to hell because i've doubted his existance than at least i can enjoy my time on earth. i'm willing to roll the dice rathre than spend a day a week bored out of my mind.
 
#181
#181
Sabanocchio said:
I am quite confident that there is no consequence for either belief. Otherwise, I would not feel the way I do. I prefer to make the best out of this life rather than bank on the possibility that life extends past the known dimension.

The thing about it is, you are no more perfect than I and vice-versa. We both make mistakes. But your belief punishes me for not having faith in something that there is no proof of and that I have been given no reason to believe. My belief leaves you to believe whatever you may.
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I will be the first to tell every one that i am not perfect and will never profess to be. Man is a sinner/"wrong doer". It is mans nature to not believe what they can not see, it does take a great deal of Faith.
I will never tell you you ARE wrong for what you believe. That is not for me to decide. I will tell the truth that I believe is directly from the Word of God. It is my proof.
 
#182
#182
droski said:
if god is really this much of a jackass that i'll go to hell because i've doubted his existance than at least i can enjoy my time on earth. i'm willing to roll the dice rathre than spend a day a week bored out of my mind.
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I promise you that I have just as much fun on this earth as you do. The methods are probaly different, but do not think that Christians sit home and meditate all day.
 
#184
#184
#185
#185
T-TownVol said:
I promise you that I have just as much fun on this earth as you do. The methods are probaly different, but do not think that Christians sit home and meditate all day.
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i'm well aware. i didn't mean to imply otherwise. each to their own.
 
#186
#186
#187
#187
droski said:
if god is really this much of a jackass that i'll go to hell because i've doubted his existance than at least i can enjoy my time on earth. i'm willing to roll the dice rathre than spend a day a week bored out of my mind.
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Which leads one to question, if god is as evil as chrisitians tell us he is, then why is he worthy of worship? Do you worship him simply out of fear? What kind of perfect god would demand such devotion?
 
#189
#189
Sabanocchio said:
Which leads one to question, if god is as evil as chrisitians tell us he is, then why is he worthy of worship? Do you worship him simply out of fear? What kind of perfect god would demand such devotion?
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who said God is evil? He's worthy of worship because he made you with the option. Worship out of fear is an idiotic concept. The perfect God of every religion ever devised asks for that kind of devotion as your creator.
 
#190
#190
Sabanocchio said:
Which leads one to question, if god is as evil as chrisitians tell us he is, then why is he worthy of worship? Do you worship him simply out of fear? What kind of perfect god would demand such devotion?
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He is not evil and no we do not worship out of fear.

The Gift of Salvation is there. It is not forced upon you. God gives us the choice to decide what to do with the Gift. Some people will never accept it. However, I accepted his gift.
 
#191
#191
BigPapaVol said:
who said God is evil? He's worthy of worship because he made you with the option. Worship out of fear is an idiotic concept. The perfect God of every religion ever devised asks for that kind of devotion as your creator.
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Now we are getting some where. The problem is not God, the problem is human depravity.
 
#192
#192
Sabanocchio said:
Which leads one to question, if god is as evil as chrisitians tell us he is, then why is he worthy of worship? Do you worship him simply out of fear? What kind of perfect god would demand such devotion?
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Please do not confuse God's judgement and wrath as evil. God tells us exactly what we are to do to avoid his wrath.
 
#193
#193
According to most christians, those that have never heard the gospel are doomed to spend eternity in hell. Does a just god do this?

If god created everything, then he created both good and evil. The mere creation of evil signifies a part of god must be evil. Why create that trap otherwise?

God is all-knowing yet he creates man and woman in full knowledge that they will never be without sin. How is god perfect?

"Now go and attack Amalek and utterly destroy all they have and do not spare them. Kill both man and women, infant and nursing child, ox and sheep, camel and donkey."(1 Samuel 15:3) If this isn't evil, then how do you condemn Hitler?

There are countless other examples, but I will spare you. We are taught in the bible to "Fear God and keep his commandments."(Ecclesiastes 12:13) Why would a just god want us to fear him?

This is all I will say, because it is starting to turn into an argument and that is not something I am interested in.
 
#194
#194
I haven't read all the posts on this topic, but I have recently learned about other views within the christian community about creation.

1. The 24 hour view - God created the earth in 6 days and rested on the 7th. aka young earth. This is the one I was taught as a child.
2. The Day-Age view - A day was a period of time, an era. aka old earth. For more about this look up Reasons to Believe.
3. Framework view - The how creation was done doesn't matter the creation is a metaphor for how we are to live our life.

If you want to read more about theses views try The G3n3sis Debate edited by David G. Hagopian
 
#196
#196
T-TownVol said:
1) Wrong, the Bible is clear that only those who hear the Gospel and refuse it will go to hell.

2) Right, sort of......God gave each person Free Will and man is sinful/evil. That is where grace enters the picture.

3) Wrath for sin. Hitler is God? Nice try.

4) Fear is good when you know the outcome of sin. That is all the "fear God" means.

5) If you concider me to be arguing, I apologize. My only purpose is to inform you af what I believe and I respect what you believe. We do not agree, but it is not an arguement.
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I respect your belief as well. As a former believer, I understand your reasoning. I also understand the nature of these discussions and don't want to get involved further. Nothing I am going to say is going to change your mind, nor is that my objective. I was just trying to offer some perspective on my view.

I will say that as to your first point, you are in the minority on that belief for certain. And as a former student of the scripture, I will further inform you that that is NOT what the bible tells us.
 
#200
#200
T-TownVol said:
The Bible says..."how can they believe if they have not heard"
I would like to hear your reasoning on how someone that has never heard of or been told how to be saved, could go to hell.
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You are taking that verse completely out of context. Paul is explaining that the Gentiles are equally deserving of hearing god's message. In essence what he is saying is that it is your duty as a christian to preach to those who have not been afforded the opportunity to hear the gospel. This is the verse that most missionary work is based upon. What is the reasoning behind this? The belief that those who have not heard, will not be able to believe and belief is the thing that saves you from eternal damnation.
 
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